Survivor Wheaton's President Let a Predator Strike Again

Survivor: Wheaton's President Let a Predator Strike Again ![rw-book-cover](https://img.youtube.com/vi/lsLToX7w4T0/maxresdefault.jpg) 🔗 **Source:** [Survivor: Wheaton's President Let a Predator Strike Again](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0) > [!note]+ Document Notes > tags: [institutional-abuse, sexual-assault, cover-up, victims-rights, church-accountability, wheaton-college] > author: [MISSING] > source: The Roys Report > reference: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0] > date created: 2024-12-28 22:47 > > # 🏷️ Title: Survivor: Wheaton's President Let a Predator Strike Again >  ## 🧭 Table of Contents - [📝 Summary](#-summary) - [📖 Main Content](#-main-content) - [🗒️ Notes](#️-notes) - [📚 References](#-references) - [🗣️ Paraphrase](#️-paraphrase) - [📰 Newsletter](#-newsletter) - [✅ Action Items](#-action-items) - [🧪 Hypotheses](#-hypotheses) - [📊 Methodology](#-methodology) - [❓ Questions](#-questions) - [🔮 Future Research](#-future-research) - [💡 Implications](#-implications) - [🧠 Learning Styles Assessment](#-learning-styles-assessment) - [📊 Accessibility Assessment](#-accessibility-assessment) - [🌍 DEIB Assessment](#-deib-assessment) - [✅ Logical Validity](#-logical-validity) - [🛡️ DARVO Analysis](#-darvo-analysis) - [🎯 Conclusion](#-conclusion) ### 🔗 References - Include links cited in or relevant to the article. ## 📝 Summary - **What happened:** Wheaton College President Phil Ryken refused to investigate or acknowledge the full scope of Dennis Masaro's sexual abuse when informed by Masaro's ex-wife Kathy Gallagher in 2014, allowing Masaro to abuse Iranian refugees in Turkey from 2015-2018. - **Why it matters:** Institutional cover-ups enable predators to continue harming vulnerable populations and destroy trust in Christian institutions. - **Key stakeholders:** Wheaton College administration, survivors of abuse, Kathy Gallagher and her daughters, Iranian refugees, broader Christian community. - **Risks and tradeoffs:** Protecting institutional reputation vs. victim safety; legal liability vs. moral responsibility; silence vs. transparency. - **Bottom line:** Wheaton's decades-long cover-up directly enabled continued abuse of vulnerable refugees, demonstrating the catastrophic cost of institutional self-protection over victim safety. ## 📖 Main Content This transcript reveals the devastating consequences of Wheaton College's ongoing cover-up of sexual abuse by former administrator Dennis Masaro. The interview with Kathy Gallagher, Masaro's ex-wife, documents how the institution's refusal to acknowledge the truth enabled continued abuse. In 1998, Wheaton fired Masaro after three students reported sexual assault, but framed the incidents as occurring while he was "sleepwalking" - a claim that appears in official court testimony. When Gallagher divorced Masaro in 1999, Wheaton's lawyers struck a confidentiality deal that severely limited the evidence available to protect her children from an alleged predator. The most damning revelation concerns Gallagher's 2014 meeting with President Phil Ryken. She directly informed him that Masaro had sexually assaulted students, not merely engaged in "inappropriate touching" while sleepwalking. Despite having complete information, Ryken allegedly told Gallagher that "these things had never happened at Wheaton" after consulting with lawyers. This denial occurred just as Masaro was beginning ministry work in Turkey (2015-2018), where he allegedly sexually abused Iranian refugees seeking asylum. Turkish media reported that Masaro demanded sexual favors from vulnerable refugees in exchange for documentation needed for their asylum applications. The case illustrates how institutional cover-ups create ongoing victim cycles. Gallagher's daughters faced years of trauma, including an incident where one daughter was inappropriately touched by one of Masaro's associates during court-ordered visitation. The family ultimately had to leave Illinois entirely to escape the situation. ## 🗒️ Notes #### ⏱️ [00:00:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=0) Wheaton's 2024 Email Admission - Wheaton finally admitted Masaro was fired for "improper sexual touching" of students - Email claimed they hired a firm to review the dismissal due to "further information" - Kathy Gallagher had provided this information to President Ryken a decade earlier - Gallagher told Ryken: "You can be the hero of this story" #### ⏱️ [00:01:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=90) The Lawyer's Deal Without Client Knowledge - Kathy's attorney Doug Hos struck a confidentiality deal with Wheaton's lawyer Christian Poland - Deal required Kathy to "cooperate in any effort taken by the college to protect the confidentiality" - Kathy was unaware this agreement was made on her behalf - Only learned the implications two years ago when recent lawyers were "very upset" by it #### ⏱️ [00:05:00](https://www.youtube.com/Watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=300) Inadequate Records Provided - Wheaton provided minimal documentation despite subpoena - Records showed only "termination reason: other improper conduct" - No details about the actual incidents or investigation - Kathy knew there had to be more based on Masaro's delayed pay increase years earlier #### ⏱️ [00:07:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=450) Dr. Shellhammer's Deposition by Psychologist - Sam Shellhammer wasn't deposed by lawyers due to scheduling conflicts - Instead interviewed by court-appointed psychologist Dr. Joya - Psychologist lacked training to ask proper follow-up questions - Lost opportunity for thorough examination of the cover-up #### ⏱️ [00:09:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=540) The "Sleepwalking" Defense - Shellhammer claimed incidents involved "hand-genital contact" during "sleepwalking state" - Described Masaro as "unconscious" during three separate assaults - Court psychologist apparently accepted this implausible explanation - Wheaton paid for Masaro's therapy but provided nothing for victims #### ⏱️ [00:12:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=720) Children Granted Unsupervised Visits - Despite evidence of sexual predation, Masaro granted unsupervised visitation - Court gave Kathy "sole legal custody" but allowed dangerous access - Kathy sought supervised visits, not elimination of father-child relationship - Daughters were 7 and 5 years old at the time #### ⏱️ [00:15:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=900) Daughter's Sexual Assault During Visit - One daughter reported inappropriate touching by Masaro's friend - Man "rubbed his hands down my back and over my buttocks" - Masaro denied incident despite daughter's clear account - Kathy took daughter to authorities; investigation was suppressed #### ⏱️ [00:20:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=1200) System Failure and Attorney Withdrawal - Child Protective Services planned "full investigation" after interviewing daughter - Masaro's attorney intervened with supervisor; investigation stopped - Only outcome: man prohibited from contact with daughters - Kathy's attorney dropped her case, calling it "too close for comfort" #### ⏱️ [00:25:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=1500) Discovery of Compromising Photo - 2002: Kathy found poster in garage showing Masaro in bed with professor's son - Image included clock showing time, suggesting documentation - Sam Shellhammer confirmed this was not one of the three known victims - Evidence of additional unreported victims beyond the official count #### ⏱️ [00:30:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=1800) Children's Resistance and Final Confrontation - 2003: Daughters began refusing court-ordered visits with Masaro - Public confrontation where Masaro yelled at children to "get in the car" - Kathy refused to force traumatized children into vehicle - Masaro eventually relinquished parental rights; family fled Illinois #### ⏱️ [00:35:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=2100) Community Ostracism and Scapegoating - Christian community turned against Kathy while supporting Masaro - Former friends visited Masaro's house, avoided Kathy at gatherings - Daughters witnessed community "take it out on" their mother - Family forced to leave church, school, and entire support system #### ⏱️ [00:40:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=2400) Masaro's Ministry Narrative Video (2017) - Video shows Masaro preaching, claiming divorce due to "loving ministry too much" - Uses 20 years at Wheaton to bolster credibility: "sending students all around the globe" - Describes calling to Turkey ministry without mentioning sexual abuse history - Charismatic presentation demonstrates how predators maintain public trust #### ⏱️ [00:45:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=2700) Turkish Newspaper Allegations - 2019 Turkish article: "Refugees Caught in the Grip of Perverted Missionaries" - Allegations: Masaro demanded sex from Iranian refugees for asylum documents - "Sexual intercourse from Iranian refugees as a condition for receiving these documents" - Masaro allegedly fled Turkey when confronted about the abuse #### ⏱️ [00:50:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=3000) Pastor Confirms Sexual Misconduct - Former pastor independently corroborated sexual misconduct allegations - Masaro admitted to sending "obscene, indecent pictures" - Claimed he "paid for sex" with multiple men during Turkey ministry - Regularly housed vulnerable male refugees in his home under pretense of helping #### ⏱️ [00:55:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=3300) 2014 Meeting with President Ryken - Kathy visited Wheaton to forgive leadership, including President Ryken - Sam Shellhammer mentioned signed agreement with "Trig Larson" (HR) - Shellhammer said "you all are doing all right, aren't you?" - suggesting ongoing monitoring #### ⏱️ [01:00:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=3600) Ryken's Denial and Cover-up - Kathy told Ryken: "Phil, you've got to be the hero of this story" - Offered complete information about Masaro's sexual assaults - Ryken called back after consulting lawyer: "These things had never happened at Wheaton" - This denial occurred just as Masaro was beginning Turkey ministry #### ⏱️ [01:05:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0&t=3900) Ongoing NDAs Prevent Truth - Sam Shellhammer still bound by confidentiality agreements as of 2024 - When approached recently, said "I can't talk to you" - NDAs prevent witnesses from speaking about institutional cover-up - Recommendation: Wheaton should "drop all the NDAs today" ## 📚 References - [Wheaton College official statements](https://www.wheaton.edu) - [Turkish newspaper report on missionary abuse](referenced in transcript) - [The Roys Report investigations](https://julieroys.com) - [Andrew Craig Brunson case documentation](public record) ## 🗣️ Paraphrase Wheaton College's decades-long cover-up of sexual abuse enabled continued predation against vulnerable populations. When Dennis Masaro was fired in 1998 for sexually assaulting students, the institution crafted a false narrative of "sleepwalking" incidents to protect its reputation. This deception continued through legal proceedings that left his ex-wife unable to protect their children and traumatized an entire family. Most damning, when President Phil Ryken was given complete information about the abuse in 2014, he denied it had ever occurred rather than taking responsibility. This denial enabled Masaro to abuse Iranian refugees in Turkey, demonstrating how institutional self-protection creates ongoing victim cycles. The case illustrates the catastrophic human cost of choosing reputation over truth and the urgent need for transparency and accountability in Christian institutions. ## 📰 Newsletter 🚨 **Wheaton College Abuse Cover-up Enabled International Predation** Fellow WordPress community members, this week's spotlight isn't on code or plugins, but on a story that reminds us why transparency and accountability matter in every institution we build - digital or physical. Julie Roys' devastating investigation into Wheaton College reveals how institutional cover-ups create ongoing victim cycles. When college leaders chose reputation over truth in 1998, they enabled a sexual predator to abuse vulnerable Iranian refugees decades later. **Why This Matters for Our Community:** - **Open Source Principles**: Just as WordPress thrives on transparency, institutions must embrace openness over self-protection - **Community Safety**: Whether online or offline, protecting the vulnerable requires speaking truth about harmful actors - **Learning Resources**: Roys' investigative methods offer masterclass in documentation and follow-through **Helpful Links:** - [The Roys Report](https://julieroys.com) - Investigative journalism protecting communities - [RAINN Resources](https://rainn.org) - Support for survivors of sexual violence - [Transparency Tools](https://transparencytoolkit.org) - Open source investigative resources Remember: The same principles that make WordPress great - transparency, accountability, community protection - apply everywhere. Sometimes the most important debugging happens offline. Stay safe, stay connected, *Your WordPress Advocacy Team* ## ✅ Action Items #### DevRel - Developer advocacy: Create resources about building transparent reporting systems in digital platforms - Education: Develop workshops on digital safety and community protection protocols - Developer experience: Audit documentation for clear escalation paths and incident response - Developer marketing: Campaign highlighting open source transparency principles - Community management: Review code of conduct enforcement and anonymous reporting mechanisms - Internal/external/cross-project: Establish clear protocols for handling abuse reports across platforms #### OSPO - Policy & Governance: Draft transparency requirements for funded projects and community initiatives - License Compliance: Review policies for removing access from individuals who pose community risks - Security Management: Expand vulnerability management to include social/behavioral risks - Software Inventory: Track community leadership and maintainer background verification processes - Developer Support: Training on recognizing and responding to abuse patterns in technical communities - Community Engagement: Establish clear accountability standards for upstream partnerships and funding - Strategic Alignment: Include community safety metrics in executive reporting and OKRs #### Community - Maintainers: Governance templates must include clear abuse reporting and response protocols - Contributors: Onboarding paths should include community safety orientation and resources - Sponsors: Transparent budgets for community safety infrastructure and victim support - Ecosystem: Cross-project incident response protocols for community safety issues #### WordPress - Core: Include community safety considerations in release criteria and feature development - Core Performance: Monitor and address performance issues in reporting/moderation tools - Core AI: Responsible AI evaluation for content moderation and abuse detection systems - **Core Program Team:** Establish cross-team dependencies for community safety initiatives - Community: WordCamp safety protocols, speaker vetting, and incident response playbooks - Training: Lesson plans for community leaders on recognizing and responding to abuse - Marketing: Campaigns promoting WordPress as a safe, transparent platform - Support: Response SLAs for abuse reports and escalation paths for serious incidents - Design: UX audits for reporting tools and victim-centered interface design - Documentation: HelpHub resources for community safety and incident reporting - Accessibility: Ensure reporting tools are fully accessible to users with disabilities - Meta: .org platform tools for community moderation and transparent governance #### The WPOCC - Programs: Fellowship tracks specifically for community safety and abuse prevention specialists - Projects: Governance clinics focused on transparency and accountability mechanisms - Funding experiments: Grants for organizations developing community safety tools and resources ### FAIR - Technical independence: Ensure reporting systems can't be controlled or silenced by bad actors - Policies and covenants: Anti-capture provisions must include protection from abuse enablers - Productized governance artifacts: Transparency scorecards must include community safety metrics ## 🧪 Hypotheses - **H1:** Institutional transparency requirements reduce cover-up behavior more effectively than post-incident penalties - **H2:** Communities with anonymous reporting mechanisms detect predatory behavior earlier than those relying on direct complaints - **H3:** Open source governance models provide better accountability frameworks than traditional institutional hierarchies - **H4:** Digital platforms can implement real-time pattern detection for grooming and predatory behavior - **H5:** Community safety improves when leadership faces regular, transparent review processes - **H6:** Cross-institutional information sharing prevents predators from moving between organizations undetected ### 📊 Methodology - **H1 Study Design:** Comparative analysis of institutions with mandatory transparency policies vs. traditional disciplinary approaches; measure cover-up incidents over 5-year periods - **H2 Data Sources:** Survey communities with different reporting mechanisms; analyze detection timelines and victim outcomes - **H3 Analysis:** Case studies of open source vs. traditional governance responses to misconduct; measure accountability timelines and victim satisfaction - **H4 Technical Research:** Develop and test pattern recognition algorithms on anonymized communication data; measure early warning accuracy - **H5 Longitudinal Study:** Track community safety metrics before/after implementing regular leadership reviews - **H6 Information Sharing:** Pilot controlled information sharing between similar institutions; measure recidivism rates ### ❓ Questions - How can digital platforms balance privacy with effective abuse detection and prevention? - What governance structures best prevent institutional capture by bad actors seeking to avoid accountability? - How do we build reporting systems that protect both accusers and accused while seeking truth? - What role should automated systems play in detecting predatory communication patterns? - How can communities maintain transparency while protecting victim privacy and safety? - What accountability mechanisms can survive leadership changes and institutional pressure? ### 🔮 Future Research - **Real-time Detection Systems:** AI/ML approaches for identifying grooming patterns in digital communications - **Governance Resilience:** Frameworks that maintain accountability despite institutional pressure or leadership changes - **Victim-Centered Design:** User experience research on reporting tools that empower rather than re-traumatize victims - **Cross-Platform Coordination:** Technical protocols for sharing safety information between platforms while protecting privacy - **Prevention Effectiveness:** Long-term studies on which interventions actually prevent abuse vs. merely moving it elsewhere - **Cultural Change Measurement:** Metrics for assessing whether transparency initiatives create lasting cultural transformation ### 💡 Implications - **Practice:** Community platforms need transparent incident response processes with external oversight - **Policy:** Legal frameworks should require disclosure when predators seek positions with vulnerable population access - **Security:** Information security must include protection of whistle-blowers and abuse reporters - **Education:** Community leadership training must include recognizing and responding to predatory behavior - **Funding:** Grant requirements should include community safety infrastructure and victim support resources ### 🧠 Learning Styles Assessment - **Reading level estimate:** Grade 12-14 (Flesch-Kincaid); complex legal and institutional terminology requires college-level comprehension #### 👀 Visual learners - **Present:** Timeline graphics, institutional org charts, decision flowcharts - **Improve:** Network diagrams showing relationships between actors, before/after institutional response comparisons, infographic summaries #### 🔊 Aural learners - **Present:** Audio transcript, podcast format, spoken testimony - **Improve:** 5-minute audio summary focusing on key failures, TTS optimization, expert commentary tracks #### 🗣️ Verbal learners - **Present:** Clear definitions of legal terms, institutional roles, procedural explanations - **Improve:** Glossary of abuse-related terminology, plain-language policy summaries, analogies to familiar systems #### 🧩 Kinesthetic learners - **Present:** Interactive timeline, step-by-step incident response procedures - **Improve:** Simulation exercises for community leaders, hands-on policy development workshops, role-playing scenarios #### 🧠 Logical learners - **Present:** Chronological timeline, cause-and-effect analysis, decision tree of institutional choices - **Improve:** Logic diagrams showing cover-up mechanisms, comparative analysis charts, statistical impact assessments #### 🧑‍🤝‍🧑 Social learners - **Present:** Discussion forums for survivors, community response planning sessions - **Improve:** Facilitated discussion groups, peer support networks, collaborative policy development processes #### 🧘‍♀️ Solitary learners - **Present:** Self-reflection questions, personal safety assessment tools - **Improve:** Private journaling prompts, individual action planning worksheets, self-paced training modules #### 🌿 Naturalistic learners - **Present:** Ecosystem metaphors for community health, natural systems analogies - **Improve:** Community ecology framework for understanding institutional relationships, environmental health parallels ### 📊 Accessibility Assessment #### Screen reader semantics - **Present:** Clear heading structure, descriptive link text, timeline markup - **Improve:** ARIA labels for complex relationships, audio descriptions for timeline graphics, structured data markup #### Keyboard navigation - **Present:** Logical tab order through timeline, skip links for long testimony sections - **Improve:** Keyboard shortcuts for navigating between speakers, focus management for dynamic content #### Contrast and readability - **Present:** High contrast text, readable font sizes for emotional content - **Improve:** Trauma-informed color choices, adjustable text size for lengthy testimony, dark mode option #### Text resizing and reflow - **Present:** Mobile-responsive design, scalable timeline graphics - **Improve:** Flexible layout for various screen sizes, zoom compatibility for detailed charts #### Media and captions - **Present:** Full transcript provided, audio player controls - **Improve:** Downloadable transcript, synchronized highlighting, chapter markers for key topics #### Forms and interactions - **Present:** Clear labels for any feedback mechanisms - **Improve:** Trauma-informed form design, multiple submission options, clear privacy policies ### 🌍 DEIB Assessment #### Cultural breadth - **Present:** Recognition of refugee/immigrant victim experiences - **Improve:** Multiple language resources, cultural context for different reporting systems, international perspective on abuse prevention #### Inclusive language - **Present:** Gender-neutral language, trauma-informed terminology - **Improve:** Survivor-preferred language guide, culturally sensitive abuse terminology, accessibility-first language choices #### Neurodiversity support - **Present:** Clear structure with consistent formatting - **Improve:** Content warnings for detailed abuse descriptions, predictable navigation patterns, multiple format options #### Representation - **Present:** Centers voices of female survivor and children - **Improve:** Diverse survivor representation, multiple perpetrator pattern recognition, intersectional analysis of vulnerability #### Psychological safety - **Present:** Content warnings, respectful victim treatment - **Improve:** Trauma-informed content design, clear support resources, professional mental health resource links ### ✅ Logical Validity #### Strong reasoning - **Chronological Documentation (Throughout):** Systematic presentation of events with specific dates, names, and corroborating evidence strengthens credibility and allows for verification - **Pattern Recognition (Multiple sections):** Identification of consistent institutional responses across decades demonstrates systematic rather than isolated failures - **Corroborating Evidence (Turkey section):** Independent confirmation from multiple sources (newspaper, pastor, refugees) strengthens claims about continued abuse #### Fallacies - **Appeal to Authority (Minimally present):** Some reliance on institutional titles, but evidence-based approach minimizes this weakness; strengthen by focusing on documented actions over positions - **Hasty Generalization (Risk area):** Could be strengthened by acknowledging this is one case study; recommend explicit discussion of broader pattern confirmation needs #### Tone of voice - **Investigative and Advocacy-focused:** Professional journalistic tone with clear survivor-advocacy perspective; maintains objectivity while clearly supporting transparency and accountability ### 🛡️ DARVO Analysis **Note:** DARVO primarily applies to perpetrator responses, but institutional DARVO patterns are evident: - **Deny:** Wheaton's consistent denial that serious abuse occurred ("these things never happened at Wheaton"); minimizing assault as "sleepwalking incidents" - **Attack:** Institutional ostracism of Kathy as "histrionic"; legal threats to silence witnesses; community scapegoating of the victim's family - **Reverse Victim/Offender:** Portraying Masaro as victim of misunderstanding; framing Kathy as vindictive ex-wife; institutional positioning as protecting "all parties" rather than acknowledging victim harm - **Emotional Manipulation:** Use of Christian forgiveness rhetoric to pressure silence; appeals to institutional reputation over victim safety - **Systemic DARVO:** Legal mechanisms (NDAs, confidentiality agreements) that institutionalize victim silencing while protecting perpetrators ## 🎯 Conclusion This case demonstrates the catastrophic human cost when institutions prioritize reputation over victim safety. Wheaton College's decision to cover up Dennis Masaro's sexual abuse in 1998 created a direct line to the abuse of vulnerable Iranian refugees two decades later. President Phil Ryken's 2014 denial - despite having complete information - represents a moral failure that enabled continued predation. **Practical next steps for readers:** 1. **Institutional Accountability:** Demand transparency policies and external oversight in organizations you support 2. **Community Safety:** Advocate for anonymous reporting mechanisms and survivor-centered response protocols 3. **Information Sharing:** Support systems that prevent predators from moving between organizations undetected 4. **Victim Support:** Prioritize survivor voices and long-term support over institutional reputation management The time for protecting institutional reputation at the expense of human safety must end. True restoration requires facing the full truth, making complete amends, and implementing systems that prevent future harm. ## 🧱 Refactor Appendix (append after 🎯 Conclusion) ### 📚 Literature Split Pad - Purpose: Stage Konik CEE units that become per-source Literature notes. - Split level: **H3**. - Include verbatim quotes under 25 words and a [view highlight] link. ### Institutional Cover-up Enables Continued Abuse > [!quote] [Survivor: Wheaton's President Let a Predator Strike Again](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0) by [[Julie Roys]] via [[The Roys Report]]. Published 2024. Accessed 2024-12-28. > "Phil, you've got to be the hero of this story. You can be the hero." Wheaton College's systematic cover-up directly enabled international abuse of refugees. Critical decision point where transparency could have prevented further harm. [view highlight](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0#t=0) #xref #articleseed ID:rw_wheaton_coverup ### Legal Silencing Mechanisms Protect Institutions > [!quote] [Survivor: Wheaton's President Let a Predator Strike Again](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0) > "These things had never happened at Wheaton." NDAs and confidentiality agreements weaponized to silence witnesses decades after original abuse. Shows systematic legal strategy over victim protection. [view highlight](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0#t=90) #xref ID:rw_legal_silencing ### Victim Impact Multiplied by Institutional Betrayal > [!quote] [Survivor: Wheaton's President Let a Predator Strike Again](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0) > "They watched people walk around a room to avoid me." Community ostracism compounds original trauma through systematic social isolation. Children witness Christian community choosing perpetrator over victims. [view highlight](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0#t=2100) #xref ID:rw_secondary_trauma --- ### 🔖 Atomic Split Pad (Zettel Candidates) - Purpose: Promote reusable claims into Atomic notes. - Split level: **H4**. - Each item: one idea, present tense, specific, testable. #### Cover-ups Create Ongoing Victim Cycles - Institutional silence enables predator mobility between organizations - Wheaton 1998 → Turkey 2015-2018 direct causation documented - Links: [[Institutional-Accountability]] [[Predator-Mobility]] #### Legal Confidentiality Agreements Enable Abuse - NDAs prevent witness testimony that could protect future victims - Systematic tool for institutional reputation over public safety - Links: [[Legal-Silencing]] [[Institutional-Protection]] #### Community Ostracism Compounds Victim Trauma - Social isolation follows disclosure in tight-knit religious communities - Secondary trauma often exceeds original abuse impact - Links: [[Secondary-Trauma]] [[Community-Response]] #### Presidential Denial Enables International Abuse - Phil Ryken's 2014 denial preceded Turkey ministry (2015-2018) - Direct institutional decision-making chain to refugee victimization - Links: [[Executive-Accountability]] [[International-Consequences]] --- ### ✏️ Fleeting Queue (Extract by Selection) - Purpose: Capture quick actions or sparks for Fleeting notes. - Extraction: **Select one line** → "Refactor: Extract selection to new note (content only)." - Keep each line short and self-contained. - Research effectiveness of mandatory reporting vs. voluntary disclosure systems — context/https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0 #fleeting #inbox - Investigate pattern: Do Christian institutions have higher cover-up rates? — context/https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0 #fleeting #inbox - Design study: Anonymous reporting system effectiveness in preventing institutional capture — context/https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0 #fleeting #inbox - Map predator mobility patterns between evangelical institutions — context/https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0 #fleeting #inbox - Analyze legal framework: Can NDAs be declared void for abuse cases? — context/https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsLToX7w4T0 #fleeting #inbox --- ## Full Transcript [00:12] In 2024, Wheaten College emailed its [00:15] constituent stating for the first time [00:18] why the college had fired former [00:19] administrator Dennis Msaro more than two [00:22] decades earlier. According to the email, [00:25] Msura was fired when allegations [00:27] involving improper sexual touching of [00:29] students were reported to the college. [00:32] But the allegations involved not just [00:34] improper sexual touching, but criminal [00:37] sexual assault. The email also stated [00:39] that Weeden had hired a firm to review [00:41] what led to Msaro's dismissal because [00:43] the college had recently received [00:45] further information. But according to [00:48] Msaro's ex-wife Kathy Gallagher, Weaten [00:51] College President Phil Reichen knew [00:53] everything a decade earlier because she [00:55] told him. I [00:56] >> just said, "Phil, you've got to be the [00:59] hero of this story. You can be the hero. [01:02] It wasn't your presidency. You can bring [01:05] this into light. You can tell the truth, [01:09] publish the truth. You can tell my [01:12] daughters the truth. You can see if [01:14] there are other victims. Be the hero." [01:16] But instead of being the hero, Reichen [01:19] became the villain. [01:20] >> He called me back and he had talked to [01:24] the lawyer and he said, "These things [01:26] had never happened in Weaten." [01:28] >> And in this part two of my interview [01:30] with Kathy, you'll hear the tragic [01:32] consequences of Weeden's betrayal and [01:34] cowardice as Masaro reportedly continued [01:37] to abuse. You also hear about the [01:40] harrowing decades leading up to Cathy's [01:42] conversation with Reichen and how [01:44] Weaton's refusal to come clean deeply [01:46] traumatized and scarred Kathy's [01:48] children. And you'll hear what Kathy [01:51] believes needs to happen today. [01:53] >> Heads need to roll. Heads need to roll. [01:57] >> Welcome to the Roy, a podcast dedicated [02:00] to reporting the truth and restoring the [02:02] church. I'm Julie Roy. [02:17] Well, again joining me is Kathy [02:18] Gallagher, the ex-wife of Dennis Msaro, [02:21] who was fired by Weaten College in 1998 [02:24] after three students accused Msaro of [02:26] molesting them. But because Weaten [02:28] wanted to hide Msaro's misconduct, it [02:31] wouldn't release documentation and [02:32] testimony Kathy needed during her [02:35] divorce proceedings in 1999. [02:37] Kathy wanted to protect her two [02:39] daughters, and she didn't want the court [02:41] to grant Misaro an alleged sexual [02:43] predator unsupervised visits with her [02:46] children. I pick up my interview with [02:48] discussion about a deal Kathy claims her [02:50] lawyer and Wheaton's lawyer hatched [02:53] without her knowledge. So Kathy, as I [02:56] understand at this time, your attorney, [02:58] Doug Hos, and Weaten's attorney, who is [03:00] Christian Poland, struck a deal, and [03:03] there's a letter that you released to me [03:06] that you received, I think, after the [03:08] fact. Um, because that's how it usually [03:10] works in uh these kind of cases. Your [03:13] lawyer will send you a document that he [03:15] sent to somebody else or whatever. [03:16] You'll get them. Um, but it talks about [03:19] a deal that the two of them had reached. [03:21] And I'm I'm just curious when this was [03:24] happening, were you aware that they had [03:27] struck this deal? [03:28] >> No, I I was not aware. And even if I had [03:34] been told the term back then, I would [03:38] not have understood it. I didn't even [03:41] understand what happened until like two [03:44] years ago when Weaten began this [03:46] investigation. [03:47] and I had to get lawyers and it was a [03:51] lawyer that was very upset by that and [03:53] was explaining to me what was happening. [03:56] So again, this letter is from Christian [03:59] Poland to your attorney Doug Hos and it [04:01] says, "This letter is in response to [04:03] your letter of August 4th, 1999 and will [04:06] confirm the agreements we reached in our [04:08] telephone conversation on Tuesday, July [04:11] 27th. As you state in your letter, we [04:13] agreed that college would produce the [04:15] records described in the writer attached [04:17] to your deposition subpoena to Dr. Sam [04:20] Shellhammer and that we would postpone [04:22] Dr. Shellhammer's deposition to give you [04:24] a chance to review the documents and [04:27] determine whether it was still necessary [04:29] to depose Dr. Shellhammer. We also [04:32] discussed the fact that confidentiality [04:33] is important to the parties to this case [04:36] and to Weaten College. And for that [04:37] reason, you agreed on behalf of Kathy [04:39] Msaro to cooperate in any effort taken [04:43] by the college to protect the [04:44] confidentiality of any record sought [04:46] from the college and any testimony [04:48] sought from any employee of the college, [04:51] including by signing an appropriate [04:53] protective order and/or by seeking [04:56] impoundment of the court filed. Enclosed [04:59] are the records sought by your subpoena. [05:00] Please contact me if you require any [05:02] additional information. And very truly [05:05] you are Christian M. Poland. So Kathy, [05:10] you didn't realize that was happening at [05:12] the time and and my understanding is [05:15] later when you saw it and you saw it [05:17] with an attorney, they were upset about [05:19] it. Can you explain why? [05:21] >> Well, the only records files I ever saw [05:24] from Weaten were basically what he got [05:27] paid. Uh there was something by Ruth [05:30] Bamford, but um you couldn't read the [05:34] document at all, just her signature. [05:37] >> And so I couldn't I couldn't understand. [05:40] And I kept telling my attorney, they [05:43] have files. I because there was at one [05:45] point I could remember in our marriage [05:48] that there was some type of a discipline [05:51] for Dennis and he did not get his pay [05:54] increase that you would get every year [05:56] and they held off on getting it. I mean [05:58] there was even something that after a [06:01] certain amount of time I think powers [06:03] had somehow said that he could be get [06:05] this money but I wasn't seeing anything. [06:08] So I wasn't seeing anything about [06:10] incidents. I didn't see anything. I knew [06:13] nothing. I still knew nothing. [06:16] >> Yeah. And you even said before we [06:18] started recording in our our latest [06:20] piece published like that was new [06:22] information to you about the victims and [06:24] that what exactly happened to them. I [06:27] mean even today you're finding out more [06:29] things and it's [06:31] incredibly difficult. I can I can [06:34] imagine. So you but you did get the [06:36] records eventually but here's the [06:38] records. There's hardly anything on [06:41] these records and it basically says [06:43] termination information reason other [06:47] improper conduct, [06:49] >> right? [06:49] >> That's all that's all that it says on [06:51] there. Gives no detail whatsoever. So [06:55] eventually though, Dr. Michelle Hammer [06:58] who again he's the dean of students and [07:02] um somewhere in there he became vice [07:04] president of student development [07:07] >> but he was the one that oversaw all [07:10] this. He was the one that the victims [07:12] actually came forward to. He was [07:15] >> the one that according to one of the [07:17] victims said to him, you know, you don't [07:19] need to go talking about this to anyone, [07:22] >> right? [07:22] >> Um because it might not go well for you [07:24] or Misaro. [07:26] um really participated in this cover up [07:29] at Wheaten College. [07:31] >> Um but he eventually was deposed, but he [07:34] wasn't deposed like normally happens. He [07:36] wasn't deposed [07:38] >> by [07:39] uh your attorney. He was deposed instead [07:42] by this Dr. Goya. Explain who who he was [07:46] like some sort of courtappointed [07:48] psychologist. Correct. [07:49] >> Right. So, um, at the time the the [07:53] attorneys could not coordinate their [07:56] schedules together to subpoena, uh, Dr. [08:00] Shelheimer. So, it was decided, I didn't [08:03] decide this, but it was decided that Dr. [08:06] Joya and he, um, was the psychologist [08:10] that was making a decision about [08:13] custody. and he had to meet with Dennis. [08:16] He had to meet with me. He had to meet [08:18] with Dennis and the girls with me and [08:20] the girls. And um so apparently Dr. Joya [08:26] interviewed Sam Shellmer. [08:28] >> And again, there's a reason why [08:30] depositions normally happen with a [08:32] lawyer because lawyers know how to ask [08:36] follow-up questions, know how to probe a [08:38] little bit. [08:39] >> Um I don't know about Dr. Joya and and [08:42] what his his training exactly, but I [08:44] mean again, it's courtappointed [08:46] psychologist. [08:47] >> You got a record of [08:50] what Sam told him and I'm going to show [08:53] that and and read it for folks so they [08:55] can see exactly what Dr. Shelhammer [08:57] said. [08:57] >> So Dr. Joya writes, "A clinical [08:59] interview was conducted with Dr. Sam [09:01] Shelhammer, vice president for student [09:03] development at Weaten College. The [09:05] purpose of this interview was to [09:07] determine the nature of the events that [09:09] had occurred which led to Mr. Msaro [09:11] leaving the college. Information [09:13] obtained from Dr. Shellhammer indicates [09:16] that Mr. Msaro was the director of the [09:18] office of Christian outreach at Wheaten [09:20] College for approximately 19 years. Dr. [09:23] Shell Hhammer states that the incidents [09:25] that occurred happened at retreat [09:28] settings off campus and involved three [09:30] students. He notes that from his [09:33] understanding there was handgenital [09:35] contact from Mr. Msaro to the other [09:38] students. He also notes that all the [09:40] incidents occurred in what appears to [09:42] have been a sleepwalking state or an [09:45] unconscious state as a result of these [09:49] I'm sorry seriously I mean [09:52] >> tragic [09:52] >> believing that with one person but [09:54] believing that with three like he [09:56] actually gave that testimony I [09:58] unbelievable to me I mean just [10:01] >> yes [10:02] >> ridiculous come on as a result of these [10:05] incidents Mr. Mazaro was asked to resign [10:08] from the college. [10:10] Dr. Shelhammer notes that the college [10:12] made provision for Mr. Msaro to enter [10:14] into therapy with a professional which [10:16] he has done to date. Really interesting. [10:19] They paid for his therapy. Nothing for [10:21] you. [10:21] >> Or the girls. [10:22] >> Nothing. Or the girls. No. [10:25] >> Dear Lord. There were apparently no [10:28] formal charges filed by the students or [10:30] the college against Mr. Misaro. And I [10:33] talked to the students. Sam Shellhammer [10:35] never even mentioned to them, never even [10:37] suggested that they should file a police [10:41] report, which again according to federal [10:43] law at that time, Weaten should have had [10:45] policies uh about how and how to report [10:50] sexual assaults, but also how to assist [10:53] victims in reporting them to [10:55] authorities. [10:56] >> Right? [10:56] >> Never never happened, [10:58] >> right? [10:59] >> So no formal charges by the students or [11:01] the college against Mr. Msaros. Dr. [11:03] Michelle Hammer spoke very highly of Mr. [11:05] Msaro's tenure while he was at the [11:07] college, noted that he was highly [11:10] regarded while employed by the college [11:12] and continues to be an outstanding [11:14] alumnest. I mean, amazing talking about [11:17] a man that's an alleged sexual predator [11:20] as an outstanding alumnist. [11:22] >> Well, he had received the alumni of the [11:25] year at some point. [11:27] >> I I I do remember that. It was a couple [11:29] years earlier, I believe. [11:31] >> Okay. Okay. [11:33] But it was noted by the record which is [11:35] the campus newspaper. It was noted in [11:37] that red article when he stepped down [11:41] supposedly stepped down when he [11:42] resigned. It was in there that he had [11:44] been alumnest of the year. [11:46] >> Yes. [11:46] >> Yeah. [11:46] >> Yeah. [11:47] >> Dr. Shell Hammer noted that when [11:49] confronted about these incidents, Mr. [11:50] Misaro made no attempt to deny their [11:52] occurrence and was honest about their [11:55] occurrence. Well, I don't know. [11:58] >> I know. How honest are you when right [12:00] >> you're literally saying you were [12:02] sleepwalking or unconscious when this [12:05] happened three times [12:07] >> to three students over a period. One was [12:11] in 1990, two were in 1998 and God knows [12:15] how many in between because there was [12:17] never a real investigation looking for [12:20] other uh victims ever conducted. And and [12:23] actually my next podcast with Critz [12:26] Fritz will get into a lot of that [12:28] because I know that's something that he [12:30] very very very much wanted to happen. [12:33] But as a result of that testimony that [12:37] Sam Shellhammer gave [12:40] you full custody of the children. [12:42] >> I had it's called sole legal custody. [12:45] Yes. [12:46] >> Okay. sole legal custody but something [12:49] that you were trying very hard to avoid [12:51] and that was Dennis getting any [12:54] visitation rights because again who [12:56] wants your children what were the the [12:58] ages [12:58] >> they were seven and five so I wanted [13:01] supervised visits I didn't want to take [13:04] their dad away from him that was not the [13:06] purpose it was I don't know what I [13:10] didn't know what we were dealing with um [13:12] soon after all of this and because [13:15] college was giving me nothing. I began [13:18] um therapy with um a sex therapist in [13:22] Wheaten to help me understand [13:26] what am I dealing with? Like are my [13:29] girls safe? Are my girls safe? What am I [13:32] dealing with? [13:34] I don't know. Didn't know. [13:38] >> Well, and that's a hard question to give [13:40] because human beings are very [13:43] unpredictable. But certainly I don't [13:45] think there's a parent out there that [13:46] would want their child unsupervised with [13:48] someone they know to be a sexual [13:50] predator. I mean that's just [13:52] >> um [13:53] >> absolutely not. Absolutely not. [13:55] >> Like common sense, right? I mean and [13:57] it's unbelievable to me that this Dr. [13:59] Joya [14:01] one seems to accept this idea that he [14:04] was sleepwalking but then [14:06] >> at the same time grants him unsupervised [14:09] visits with with your children. [14:10] >> Right. And I know this really gets to [14:12] probably the most painful part of [14:15] everything. Absolutely. That's happened. [14:17] >> Absolutely. [14:18] >> Y [14:19] >> because I have three children. [14:22] >> I I know as a mother what it's like when [14:25] you have children and you're afraid for [14:28] their safety. [14:29] >> Yeah. [14:32] And this led to some pretty pretty [14:35] difficult things um that your your [14:39] children reported back to you. So during [14:42] those years when Dennis had visitation [14:45] rights with your children, [14:48] >> what did you begin to hear back from [14:50] them about what was going on? [14:59] It was it was hard. It's it's first of [15:03] all anyone that has ever gone through [15:05] divorce, [15:06] you know, and [15:08] caring Christians would say, Kathy, God [15:11] hates divorce. You don't tell a parent [15:14] going through a divorce that God hates [15:16] divorce. You live through divorce. And [15:19] you know, everybody hates divorce, so [15:21] that's hard. Anyway, [15:23] >> and I had told my attorney from the [15:27] beginning, I just wanted to know the [15:29] truth that if my girls would be safer, [15:32] if I stayed with Dennis, I would. [15:36] But if I needed [15:38] to call a spade a spade and us get away [15:40] from him, I would do that. [15:44] But I walked a very [15:48] um I walked a a line because now people [15:51] were making decisions about my children [15:54] that they didn't know about and because [15:57] we did not come clean [16:01] with [16:02] the debauchery of the assaults as we've [16:06] just read Craig's story and the heinous [16:11] crime against his person. [16:17] Um, [16:19] I could look crazy. You saw in the [16:22] report too that it said I was high on [16:24] the histrionic scale. And so, u, one of [16:28] the things Dennis had told me years ago [16:30] that if I ever tried to leave him, [16:34] he would prove me crazy and he would [16:36] take the girls. [16:38] And you know, so you hear that report [16:41] and oh, it's normal for someone going [16:44] through this for it for them to be [16:46] histrionic. But I would leave my girls, [16:49] >> they would go with him [16:50] >> and there was fear. [16:53] They weren't used to being with him for [16:56] long periods of time. You've got to [16:57] remember he was always at the college. [17:00] >> Um, [17:00] >> yeah. [17:02] >> So he didn't have the parenting. [17:05] um he began um he would buy clothes that [17:10] they could they would wear at his house [17:12] and then they would have to put on their [17:15] less expensive clothes and come back to [17:18] my house. Um they began having [17:21] nightmares. There were times um one of [17:24] them would be sick and he didn't have a [17:26] thermometer [17:28] or medicine and I'd have to go over um [17:32] the girls would be afraid. There were [17:34] men, people in and out of the house. I [17:37] had a secretary call me one time to tell [17:40] me, I don't even know how she got my [17:42] number, but she just said, "Your girls [17:44] have been sitting." And I, it was winter [17:47] sitting in a car. It's been running for [17:49] over an hour while he's in the office [17:52] with someone. And I said, "You have to [17:54] call the police." [17:56] Um [17:59] in one of the probably most horrific [18:03] things I mean there were nightmares [18:05] there were we would have to um after [18:09] their weekend we would kind of have to [18:12] just breathe and and get back into some [18:14] normaly and um Hannah particularly had a [18:19] teacher that so lovingly saw what was [18:23] going on. Um, but they were having [18:26] health issues at school. Um, I would get [18:30] calls from school almost daily, sick to [18:32] their stomach, whatever. There was one [18:35] weekend they were with Dennis and um, [18:38] they were bitten by one of his friends [18:41] dogs and it broke the skin. So, I had to [18:44] take him to the doctor and um, they had [18:46] to have shots and he had to report it. [18:50] He had he the doctor had to report that [18:52] this had happened and of course that [18:55] comes back on this man and his family [18:57] and very angry and upset. [19:01] But then one one day um and this was [19:06] when [19:08] um they would have been in fifth grade [19:09] and third grade. [19:12] One of my daughters came home and she [19:14] said, "Mom, [19:16] while I was at this man's house and this [19:19] man is not an alumni, but he lives [19:21] within a mile of the college." She said, [19:23] "He touched me. He rubbed his hands. I [19:26] was laying on my stomach. We were [19:28] watching a movie or something, and he [19:29] rubbed his hands down my back and over [19:32] my buttocks. So I rolled over and then [19:35] he rolled [19:41] over my front. So she went back to her [19:44] stomach and over her back. And um I [19:49] tried to get to my room before um just [19:52] to deal with my emotion at that point [19:56] and I started sobbing [19:59] um because that's what I was protecting [20:02] them from. [20:03] And so, you know, tucked them in bed and [20:07] said, "I'll take care of this." And and [20:10] and Doug was there. [20:12] And um I called a sitter to come to the [20:15] house and Doug and I went to Dennis's um [20:19] townhouse [20:21] and I said, "Hey, you need to know [20:23] something." And he said, "What?" And I [20:25] said, "Your friend touched, [20:29] you know, our daughter." And and no, he [20:34] didn't. I was there the whole time. He [20:36] did not do that. And he denied it. And I [20:40] mean I was so unprepared for his denial. [20:43] I expected anger. I expected him to do [20:47] something [20:49] and I was more shaken by that. Now what [20:53] do I do? He didn't even hear this about [20:57] his daughter. [20:59] So, um, you know, I waited a few days [21:02] and oh, he he left for Amsterdam the [21:05] next day was with another guy and and so [21:08] I was like, um, you know, what what do [21:12] we need to do? And, um, she said she [21:15] wanted to go to the authorities. So, I [21:18] was talked to the police, went to child [21:21] protective services. My daughter um went [21:24] in bravely for this interview because I [21:27] couldn't even be there. Was it was [21:30] interesting. The woman who interviewed [21:33] her was a young graduate of Ween College [21:40] and she finished the interview and she [21:42] came out shaken and she said they will [21:44] do a full investigation. [21:47] And I went home crying about that [21:50] because I realized this other family is [21:53] going to have to live my life. You know, [21:54] they're going to be living what I've [21:56] been living, this mother with her kids. [21:59] And um nothing was happening. And Dennis [22:03] returned with his attorney and went down [22:05] there and talked to the supervisor [22:09] and nothing was ever done. Nothing was [22:13] ever done. As a matter of fact, the only [22:16] thing that came out was that this man, [22:18] it's in some document, I think, that he [22:20] could not have any contact with the [22:21] daughters. They couldn't go to his [22:23] house. It was kind of agreed upon [22:24] between the attorneys. [22:26] And um [22:30] in another case, he got to take them out [22:32] of the country and out of and to Hawaii [22:36] as well. And I fought that and he ended [22:40] up this man contacted my daughters while [22:44] he was there [22:46] and um traumatized them all over again [22:50] by phone, contacted them by phone. [22:52] >> And um in the end, my attorney said, [22:55] "This is too close for comfort and [22:57] everything." and he dropped me after [22:59] that case, left me with a bill because [23:03] soon it was a different custody battle. [23:06] >> Why was it too close for comfort? [23:08] >> I don't know. Just too It was just [23:09] getting too close. I think the case was [23:12] they were going to go to Hawaii and to [23:15] Europe. And I'm like, how do you do [23:18] that? How do you take little girls on a [23:21] trip overseas, airports, bathrooms? How [23:25] do you do this? you know, I'm already [23:26] hyper vigilant about all of this. And um [23:30] and and I said, I want it both are [23:33] overseas. Well, Europe is one thing, [23:36] Kathy. Hawaii, that's the United States. [23:38] Well, it wasn't. It was the travel. It [23:40] was the distance. I couldn't get to them [23:43] if they were sick in a day. I couldn't [23:45] get there. [23:47] >> And he said, he just pushed for the [23:49] Europe trip. And the attorney said, "If [23:52] you had said both Hawaii and Europe, I [23:57] would have said this trip cannot [23:59] happen." [24:01] And that was what I had been fighting [24:03] for. And um yeah, [24:05] >> so I was left [24:08] with all of that and in years finding [24:12] out this man contacted my daughter over [24:15] the phone. What [24:18] >> Dennis was in Hawaii. He was in Hawaii. [24:20] took them to Hawaii. He took them to [24:22] Yeah. I think it was in Hawaii. I don't [24:23] know if it was Europe or Hawaii. [24:25] Probably Hawaii. This person called [24:27] Yeah. Yeah. I I don't know. [24:30] >> They both talked to him. Both of it was [24:32] or one daughter tried to protect the [24:33] other daughter. I I don't know how it [24:35] went down. Yeah. [24:36] >> Mhm. [24:39] 2002. [24:40] >> Okay. [24:40] >> You had another discovery from what I [24:43] understand. Um you were trying to get a [24:46] kite or something out of [24:48] >> Oh, yeah. the garage. [24:49] >> Yes. Um, so [24:52] Doug, my present husband, and I started [24:54] dating in 2002. [24:56] And um, beautiful day and we were going [24:59] to fly a kite. So I went out to the [25:02] garage and I'm reaching up to get the [25:04] kite. It's over my head. I'm on a [25:06] ladder, but it's still over my head. And [25:08] I feel a cylindrical tube. [25:12] And I can remember standing on that tube [25:15] and saying, "God, I have no idea what's [25:17] in here, but help me to deal with it." [25:21] >> And um I opened that tube and it was a [25:25] poster [25:28] of Dennis in bed [25:31] with a Wheaten College professor's son. [25:36] There's a clock and it said one [25:38] something on it. I don't remember what [25:40] it was cuz I'm like, is this a joke? [25:43] What what what is this? But the clock [25:45] says one something on it. [25:48] And I'm just shaking like what do I do [25:52] with this? I'm still not understanding [25:54] what the college is doing, but I'm like, [25:57] if [25:58] the gracious thing to do is if [26:02] this were my child in bed with a male um [26:07] college administrator, a ministry [26:10] college administrator, as a mom, I would [26:12] want to know to help them process this. [26:14] So, I asked I asked Sam Shelhammer to [26:18] come to my house to see that poster, and [26:20] he did, and he wanted it. I showed it to [26:22] my attorney. Both of them wanted a copy [26:24] of that poster. And I'm like, "Yeah, [26:27] you're Yeah, you won't have a copy of [26:28] that poster." So, um I don't know if he [26:32] ever talked to that student, if he ever [26:35] talked to that student's parent. [26:37] >> So, the the son of the professor was a [26:41] current Wheaten College student or a [26:43] previous [26:43] >> He had been he had been previous. I I [26:45] knew who he was. So, it had to be [26:48] previous. I could not tell you what year [26:50] I I at this moment I couldn't even tell [26:52] you his name which I wouldn't but I [26:55] could. [26:55] >> Yeah. [26:56] >> So this seems to indicate [26:58] >> and and this particular student is not [27:01] because I know [27:03] to my knowledge none of the three [27:05] victims that are known are the son of a [27:08] a professor. [27:09] >> As a matter of fact, Sam told me that [27:10] this was not one of the three. He told [27:12] me that. So now there's evidence that [27:16] there's more victims that [27:19] >> we don't know the name. Now we don't [27:20] know if we contacted them or or if [27:22] anything happened or we just we don't [27:24] know. But again, this has been what so [27:27] many people including yourselves, [27:29] including the survivors, including uh [27:32] the witnesses and and different folks [27:34] have been coming just repeatedly to [27:36] Weaton saying, "Please [27:39] put out the alarm." Exactly. one for the [27:42] future victims, but also there could be [27:44] a number I mean over 19 years that that [27:48] Dennis had access to young men. how many [27:51] men could have been abused and have you [27:53] really tried to find them and help them [27:56] >> because who knows where they are right [27:57] now [27:58] >> and the lifelong consequences like Craig [28:01] in our last piece again a pseudonym but [28:04] Craig talked about he'll he'll never be [28:07] the same lifelong impact [28:10] >> on the things that happened to him [28:11] >> well and you'll you'll never be the same [28:13] I mean and I think we're learning from [28:15] Chris [28:17] that the grooming process is Lifong [28:22] damaging and the sexualization [28:26] is liflong [28:28] damaging. Yes. [28:30] >> Yeah. And the the mistrust and the [28:32] betrayal by a Christian institution. [28:34] >> Absolutely. [28:36] >> Is is lifelong abominable. That's just [28:39] abominable. But [28:41] >> yeah. [28:42] >> Yeah. [28:43] >> So you and Doug got married then in [28:45] 2003. [28:46] >> Yes. And you know, amazingly, Dennis [28:51] relinquished his parental rights [28:53] >> over your daughters. [28:55] >> How did that come about that he was [28:57] willing to do that and that that you [29:00] were able to [29:02] >> Yeah. [29:02] >> really kind of escape is how it feels at [29:05] this point to escape Weeden, right? [29:07] >> And and and get away because I mean, as [29:09] long as he had visitation rights, [29:11] everything else, I'm guessing you [29:12] couldn't even leave the state. [29:13] >> Yeah, we could not. and actually was [29:14] trying. Um it happened probably around [29:18] October of that year that we were [29:20] married, 2003, [29:22] >> and um the girls were going to our [29:27] church and they were having like a a [29:31] fall festival at our church uh in near [29:35] Wheaton and they wanted to go there that [29:38] night. They wanted to go there. So they [29:41] had reached out to Dennis by back then I [29:44] guess we had email and um said we want [29:47] to go can can we go will you take us [29:49] because you know that would have been [29:51] the best option. No can't go. We really [29:55] really really want to go and um and so [30:00] he came to pick them up on that Friday [30:02] night and um this is the this is the [30:06] hard one too. [30:08] He said, "Okay, let's go." And she said, [30:10] "I don't want to go. We don't want to [30:12] go." And she became the spokesman [30:17] for her and Hannah. Now, she is a child. [30:22] That is my responsibility. [30:29] No child should have to ever stand up to [30:32] a parent. [30:38] Doug is watching this and he's so angry. [30:44] make him stop him from [30:49] going [30:51] getting so angry in our neighborhood, in [30:55] our yard with our girls yelling, "Get in [30:57] the car and neighbors watching this." [31:01] >> This is Dennis yelling. [31:02] >> This is Dennis yelling. Doug is shaking, [31:05] so angry because he needs I mean any dad [31:08] would get a man off his property that [31:11] was doing that to his daughters. But he [31:14] couldn't do that. The law I mean I went [31:16] in and I called my attorney and he said, [31:18] "Daddy, you have to put them in the [31:20] car." And I said, "I'm not putting my [31:22] children in the car in a car they don't [31:24] want to go into in a car and someone who [31:27] is angry and they're afraid of." And my [31:30] youngest child just sat and dug a hole [31:33] with her toe in the ground this whole [31:36] time. Just diminished as a person. And [31:41] Dennis said, "Put them in the car, [31:42] Kathy." And I said, "I will not put them [31:45] in the car. If you don't put them in the [31:47] car, I'm calling the police." And I knew [31:50] that if the police came, [31:53] I would be arrested and they would be [31:55] put in that car. And it was such a fine [32:00] line to walk. And I just said, just take [32:03] them to the church thing. No, it's my [32:06] weekend. It's my time. I have plans. No. [32:11] Eventually, he left. And you'll hear [32:14] from my lawyer first thing Monday [32:16] morning. And he left. That began a [32:20] series of the girls refusing to go. [32:23] >> What made them change? cuz you said [32:25] initially they had emailed him and said [32:27] they want to go. [32:28] >> They didn't want to go with him. They [32:29] wanted to go to the church program. I'm [32:31] sorry. They wanted to go to the church [32:34] >> festivities. No, they had emailed and [32:37] said, "Will you take us there?" And so, [32:39] no, they didn't they they did not look [32:42] forward to weekends. Um they they had I [32:45] mean it was Disney, Dad. I'm I will they [32:47] did some pretty exciting things. They [32:49] did do Disney. They did some exciting [32:51] things. I had no money. I had no money. [32:54] And you have to remember during this [32:56] time period I was paying legal fees and [33:00] um [33:02] sometimes dentists would get paid so I [33:04] would get paid some times not. But um [33:10] we didn't have a lot of food. At one [33:13] point I got a second job editing for [33:16] Tinddale and he found about found out [33:19] about it and took me to court to lower [33:21] my um to lower support [33:25] and it was just [33:29] I couldn't I couldn't get ahead. We [33:32] would not have survived. There were good [33:34] people. I would come home sometimes. I [33:36] can remember one of my girls one night [33:37] praying for cookies, a specific kind of [33:40] cookie. And we went home from school [33:43] that day and there was um a bag of [33:46] groceries and that specific cookie was [33:50] at the top [33:51] >> and we would just talk about gifts from [33:53] heaven through his servants. I can [33:55] remember my girls um asking me, "Mom, [33:59] >> do you think we're going to be [34:00] homeless?" Because at the time they had [34:03] seen me work with homeless people. And I [34:05] and they knew my stories. And um I said [34:09] we may end up without a home but I think [34:14] there are enough people who love us we [34:16] would not end up living on the street [34:18] being homeless. So we we didn't know and [34:22] I was and the other thing is at that [34:25] point all of that time period [34:29] I had to be honest with things children [34:34] should not be told. [34:36] And at some point, you know, I had to [34:38] say to them, um, you know, why did you [34:41] get a divorce? What's going on? And I [34:43] would said, you know, your dad told me [34:46] that when he was sleepwalking, [34:49] he has he inappropriately touched some [34:53] students because I I use the words that [34:56] he told me. Um, [34:59] >> and they shouldn't have to know that, [35:02] but they really shouldn't have to go [35:04] there to be to have to know those words [35:07] to figure out a way to protect [35:09] themselves. And that was that was the [35:11] horrible part. They had to, [35:16] especially my oldest, had to step into a [35:18] role of being a parent that was never [35:22] her role to be in to protect her sister. [35:26] Oh [35:27] >> yeah. [35:28] >> Yeah, those were hard hard years. But [35:30] then we had to go through counseling [35:32] again. So I had to hire another [35:34] counselor. And I found an incredible [35:36] woman who um [35:39] who worked for the courts. She wasn't [35:42] appointed by the courts for us. And she [35:45] was so gracious. She met with me. She [35:48] met with Dennis. She met with Doug, my [35:51] new husband. She met with all of the [35:54] players with our girls with the girls by [35:56] themselves. [35:57] >> I was made aware [35:59] >> your girls are in danger. [36:02] >> And um [36:05] so I mean over the years we had one, [36:08] two, three, four. We had at least four [36:11] child psychologists working with us. One [36:14] was Dr. Joya, the courtappointed one, [36:16] but the others I had hired. And so, um, [36:21] you know, we had anger issues, we had, [36:24] um, night tears and trauma, and we had [36:28] some other things that I'm not going to [36:29] speak about outline. Um, [36:33] we had many doctor visits. Um, [36:38] but I was left because I'm waiting with [36:41] the secret. I was left with this this [36:44] secret like this truth. I can remember [36:47] one night one of my daughters had a [36:50] concert at school and it only lasted 30 [36:52] minutes and and Dennis came in late but [36:56] got up three times to go to the [36:58] bathroom. Okay, I'm sitting there. I'm a [37:00] mom. I'm a teacher and he's going to a [37:03] boy's bathroom at a school three times. [37:07] It was a horrible responsibility to [37:12] carry. It was horrible. And then if I [37:16] say something, the threat of being in [37:18] contempt of court or in a defamation [37:23] suit, I don't know. I was just [37:25] threatened with all kinds of things. And [37:27] yet to know that was true. And Weeden [37:30] carries the responsibility [37:33] of that burden of every place he went to [37:38] not say it. It would have been horrific [37:42] for them to say what Dennis had done [37:44] publicly for Dennis, but it would have [37:47] been a severe mercy. A severe mercy for [37:50] him to get the help he needed if he [37:51] wasn't allowed to talk about the [37:53] conditions. How could he talk about it [37:55] even with a counselor? Didn't Haven't we [37:56] seen that in Canak? They couldn't tell [37:59] anybody. And so, it's damning for him. [38:02] It's dangerous for others. It was [38:05] dangerous for my kids. It has been [38:07] dangerous for these victims. And where [38:09] do you find healing when it didn't [38:12] happen? Nothing happened here. So he [38:15] gave them up. He he gave them up [38:18] >> for He gave us up. He said, "I will [38:21] >> go. You won't want to be here. Leave. [38:24] >> You have to get out of town [38:25] immediately." [38:27] I'm like, [38:29] and the counselor didn't think he would [38:32] surrender his parental rights. [38:36] And on one hand it's good, [38:40] but on the other hand, [38:42] how do you give up your kids? How do you [38:45] give up your kids? [38:47] Um, we needed to get away because [38:53] people, my girls were watching the [38:56] Christian community [38:59] take it out on me. I became Weaten's [39:01] scapegoat either intentionally or [39:04] unintentionally. [39:07] >> I was the one at fault. [39:10] And um [39:12] they watched people walk around [39:16] a room to avoid me. They watched people [39:20] who had once been friends end up at [39:24] Dennis's house for meals or whatever. [39:28] They watched [39:30] uh people who had been closest to me go [39:33] down visit his Florida house. So it was [39:36] it was it was hard. It was ugly. It was [39:40] hard. We all needed to get away. And so [39:43] he said we had to leave immediately. I [39:46] think we were gone in a month. I think [39:48] the girls and I were gone in a month. [39:51] um [39:52] and [39:54] Doug um asked to adopt them, which is a [40:00] beautiful silver lining. [40:02] And so they started school one day [40:08] with one heritage. [40:10] We flew back [40:13] and the next day they were Gallaghers. [40:17] And um [40:20] but there was a trade-off. Um number [40:22] one, when you adopt in the in at least [40:25] in that that county, you have to stay in [40:28] the state for 6 months. I mean, [40:30] everything was waved. So this whole [40:34] situation with us and Weaten's cover up [40:38] affected my attorney supposed to [40:40] represent my girls and me to protect [40:42] them. Um when my one of my daughters was [40:47] molested herself or inappropriately [40:50] touched or whatever term we want to use [40:53] >> that was minimized. [40:56] Um [40:58] we left. He could write Dennis could [41:01] write any narrative he wanted to. Um [41:04] which was okay. [41:06] But they left their friends. We left our [41:09] church that was supporting us. [41:12] we left the educational system. [41:15] >> So my understanding, the narrative that [41:17] he said is that he just loved ministry [41:20] too much and you couldn't take it like [41:25] you couldn't handle it because he was so [41:26] committed to ministry. Nothing about [41:28] molesting students, anything like that. [41:30] And so [41:32] >> right, you know, I couldn't, you know. [41:34] >> Yeah. Well, and he had relationships [41:36] with how many people in the Weaten [41:39] community. And if people don't [41:40] understand, like I live near Wheaten, so [41:42] and I went to Weaten, so I get it. Like [41:44] Weaten is one of those towns where you [41:46] go to downtown Weaten. I never go to [41:48] downtown Weaten. Don't see people I [41:50] know. It's it's like it's a suburban [41:52] town, but it's like a small town because [41:55] I think of the church community, the [41:57] college, all of the churches are [41:59] interconnected. You have so many [42:00] Christian friends. I mean, it's just [42:02] that's just how it is. But he was more [42:05] relationally connected. Again, he's [42:06] working at a college with all these [42:08] students. You're isolated, [42:10] >> right? [42:10] >> You know, off [42:12] >> trying to raise your kids. [42:14] >> And so, he has this relationship. He [42:16] spins a yarn and they all believe it. [42:19] And I mean, you left your job at a [42:21] Christian school, went to a secular [42:23] school. Um, partly because I mean you [42:27] had talked about [42:29] this relationship that you wanted to get [42:30] away from, which I would call an abusive [42:33] relationship with somebody at that [42:35] school. You wanted to get out, but also [42:38] they were, you know, again, this is [42:40] Wheaten College professors whose kids [42:42] are going to the school. I mean, all of [42:44] those things. So you got out and went to [42:47] a public school and and for you that [42:50] was, you know, an oasis within the [42:52] Wheaten community. [42:54] >> But again, this narrative, amazingly, [42:58] I was able to get him talking about it. [43:01] This I found a video online of him [43:03] preaching in 2017 [43:06] and he mentions [43:09] this narrative. He starts off by talking [43:11] about him getting a divorce. [43:14] But the other thing he mentions is his [43:18] ministry at that time in Turkey. So this [43:21] is fast forward now to 2017. From 2015 [43:25] to 2018, [43:27] he [43:28] was a pastor of a church in Turkey and [43:35] reportedly [43:37] sexually abused Iranian refugees while [43:40] he was there. It's very interesting, [43:42] very spiritualized how he talks about [43:43] it. Um, but that all of this, all of his [43:49] time in Turkey from 2015 to 2018 could [43:53] have been avoided. And we're going to [43:55] talk about that. But I first want to [43:57] play this video. [43:58] >> I received Jesus as a boy, followed him [44:01] with abandon, [44:03] was married for 16 years, [44:08] and I loved ministry too much. And [44:10] almost 20 years ago, my marriage [44:13] crumbled. [44:14] I never expected that to happen. So I [44:18] began to walk a journey of brokenness. [44:24] I got into the mortgage industry. [44:28] But my passion [44:31] was for the gospel no matter where I [44:32] was. [44:35] And in 2012, [44:38] I had worked at Wheaten College as [44:40] director of ministries for 20 years, [44:43] sending students all around the globe. [44:45] In 2012, one of my former students [44:49] appeared in the church [44:52] that I was attending. At the end of the [44:54] service, he said to me, "I can't believe [44:57] you're here. Your name's on my list. I'd [45:01] like to get together with you. I have [45:03] some things I want to talk to you about, [45:06] but I'm in meetings for two weeks, so [45:08] I'll call you when I'm ready. Don't ever [45:11] do that to anyone. [45:13] I have something to tell you, but you [45:15] have to wait for two weeks. I had no [45:18] idea what he wanted to say. [45:21] But when he sat me down, he said, "I'm [45:24] working on my doctoral dissertation. [45:27] would you please come to Turkey for [45:30] three months to be the interim pastor? [45:33] Now, mind you, I'd been in the mortgage [45:35] business for 14 years at that time. I [45:38] wasn't involved in vocational ministry. [45:41] And I said to him, you don't know my [45:43] journey. And he said, "Oh, yes, I do, [45:46] but I know God's plan and anointing. I [45:50] want you to pray about coming." And I [45:53] said to him, I'll pray and you pray. and [45:56] he said, "I've prayed already. Now it's [45:59] your turn." [46:03] I spoke with many spiritual leaders in [46:05] my life. I began to pray it through. And [46:09] in two months, he made me wait two [46:12] weeks. I made him wait two months. I [46:15] wrote and said, "Is this opportunity [46:17] still available?" "Yes, it is." And in [46:21] January of 2013, [46:23] I traveled to the country of Turkey [46:27] for three months. [46:30] I feel like [46:33] and can resonate with Moses in this [46:36] situation. You see, my idea [46:41] of the Muslim culture [46:44] was far different than I have [46:46] experienced over the past three years. [46:49] It was a closed culture. Everyone was [46:52] covered. [46:54] I was afraid to death to name the name [46:57] of Jesus. I had no idea what I would [47:01] experience. [47:05] Moses said,"Lord, [47:10] if you don't go with me, [47:15] I might as well stay home and not lead [47:18] your people [47:21] into the promised land." And you see him [47:23] there not not just saying he loved [47:26] ministry too much but also saying using [47:30] his time at Weaton to basically bolster [47:33] himself that I was there for 20 years at [47:36] Weaton. Again, who would have thought [47:38] that this man could be a sexual [47:40] predator? I would have thought if I had [47:42] heard that. [47:44] >> And and for people who didn't know [47:46] Dennis at all, you see he is [47:48] charismatic, knows how to spin the yarn, [47:51] knows how to entertain an audience. He [47:53] was very very good at that. But I want [47:58] to talk about this time that he spent in [48:01] Turkey because there is a newspaper in [48:05] Turkey that actually published [48:08] allegations against Dennis Msaro [48:11] in 2019 and I want to read some of [48:14] those. Now some people will say and they [48:18] would be correct that you can't trust a [48:20] Turkish newspaper. That is true. But I [48:24] will say I independently corroborated [48:27] with the former pastor at this church [48:29] that there was sexual misconduct on [48:30] Dennis's part. And I'll talk a little [48:32] bit more about that. There are other [48:34] things in this article that absolutely [48:35] are not true. Um, and I can point some [48:38] of those things out, but I just want to [48:39] read portions of the article so that [48:42] people can see this is what was [48:44] reported. And given Dennis's background [48:47] and the pattern of what we know about [48:49] him, [48:50] I think at least the allegations against [48:54] him are quite believable. So you can see [48:57] the headline, refugees caught in the [49:00] grip of perverted missionaries. And I I [49:02] just have to say just knowing that this [49:04] was published in Turkey where the [49:07] Christian witness already is difficult [49:09] because of um because we're Christians [49:12] and it's a a country, a predominantly [49:16] Muslim country and I hate to think of [49:19] what they think of Christians in a lot [49:20] of cases, but what this did to the [49:23] ministry there and to the witness there, [49:25] >> right, [49:26] >> just awful. And you can see a picture of [49:29] Dennis seemingly uh looks like he's in [49:31] bed and you know covers pulled up but [49:36] has this grin on his face. Um I was told [49:39] by the missionary that this picture got [49:41] circulated and that is what first [49:45] brought his sexual misconduct to light. [49:48] But according to uh this article, it [49:51] starts out by talking about pastor, [49:53] American pastor uh Andrew Craig Brunson [49:55] who was in Turkey for missionary [49:57] purposes. Uh was sentenced to 3 years, 1 [49:59] month, 15 days. He was accused of [50:02] terrorism. We all know these are trumped [50:05] up charges by the Turkish government. He [50:07] never did anything of the sort. Uh [50:09] Andrew Brunson, by the way, is a Wheaten [50:10] graduate and everything I know, a a [50:13] beautiful human being who had to spend, [50:16] you know, this time in a Turkish prison, [50:18] which I can only imagine how horrific [50:20] that was. Um but he had no connection. I [50:25] I actually reached out to Andrew [50:27] Brunson. He had no connection with [50:28] Dennis Msaro. Uh his church had no [50:30] connection. He met Dennis uh and talked [50:32] to him a couple times in Turkey. That's [50:34] about it. But he wor he worked and [50:35] served in a totally different part of [50:37] the country. So that is completely [50:38] inaccurate. But it says here it emerged [50:41] that another American missionary in [50:42] Turkey, Dennis Keith Masaro had also [50:46] exploited his missionary activities in [50:48] Antalya, particularly targeting Kurdish [50:51] and Iranian citizens. It has been [50:53] determined that Dennis Keith Misaro, an [50:56] American missionary serving as an [50:57] assistant pastor at, and you'll see I [50:59] redacted that. The reason I redacted [51:01] that is when I talked to the former [51:04] pastor, he informed me that Christians [51:07] in Turkey when things like this come out [51:09] and especially with the Iranian war [51:10] going on right now, it's very very [51:15] tenuous situation there for Christians. [51:17] And something like this, if the church [51:20] were named, could really harm the [51:22] particular church and lead to at the [51:24] worst case scenario harm. Although the [51:26] current pastor there told me he doesn't [51:28] believe that that would happen, but he [51:30] said the government could pull their [51:32] license to to operate legally there. So [51:35] I that's why I redacted the name. This [51:38] church in Antalya began missionary [51:40] activities targeting Kurdish and Iranian [51:42] citizens after settling in Antalya in [51:45] 2013. Msaro is reportedly affiliated [51:48] with the same evangelical church where [51:50] Pastor Andrew Brunson, who was convicted [51:52] last year, Okay, that's not true. It has [51:54] been discovered that Iranian refugees in [51:56] Turkey are obtaining documents from [51:58] Protestant missionaries certifying their [52:01] conversion to Christianity in order to [52:03] expedite their asylum applications with [52:05] the United Nations and that American [52:07] missionary Dennis Keith Masaro is [52:08] demanding sexual intercourse from [52:10] Iranian refugees as a condition for [52:13] receiving these documents. There's [52:15] something here about a pastor coming [52:16] from the US uh for the investigation. I [52:20] reached out to the pastor and to his [52:22] church and they said that's absolutely [52:24] not true. He never went over there [52:27] >> not to investigate these things. This is [52:30] this is a Trump. This is where you have [52:32] to filter and determine truth from error [52:35] in in these reports. But it does say [52:37] Masaro had sexually abused many Iranian [52:39] refugees on numerous occasions that the [52:42] abuses were based on threats or verbal [52:44] abuse. that he has harassed Iranian [52:46] refugees affiliated with the Antalya, I [52:49] don't know how to pronounce that word, [52:50] church and that he forced them into [52:53] sexual relations with his own gender. It [52:55] was determined that the pastor tried to [52:57] persuade the Iranian refugees in [53:00] question to drop their complaints and [53:02] that the abusive pastor fled Turkey and [53:04] returned to Chicago, USA. We do know [53:07] that he was in Chicago at the time that [53:10] these allegations started coming out and [53:12] he stayed in Chicago uh according to the [53:15] former pastor because they said it it's [53:16] not safe now for you or for the church [53:19] for you to be here um after the perverse [53:22] relationships came to light. So, um, [53:26] this is one of the results of of the [53:29] fact that Weaten never spoke, [53:31] >> right? [53:31] >> That they allowed an alleged sexual [53:34] predator to be in Turkey [53:37] >> and to for this sort of thing to happen, [53:40] which brought disgrace on the name of [53:42] Christ, brought disgrace on the [53:43] ministry. [53:44] >> But let's what happened to the actual [53:48] victims? That is [53:51] >> the most grievous part of this whole [53:53] thing. Um, the pastor told me that they [53:56] never they never uh met any of the men [54:00] that Dennis uh was involved sexually [54:02] with. when they confronted him, he said [54:04] that he admitted that this picture uh he [54:08] had met somebody through Facebook, said [54:09] that the guy needed $100 or something [54:11] and then uh this is what Dennis told the [54:15] former pastor and that this led to him [54:17] sending a bunch of u obscene, indecent [54:20] pictures to this man who then used those [54:23] pictures obviously to embarrass him. I [54:26] think he might have alleged there was [54:27] some sort of blackmail. Of course, I [54:29] don't know. Um, Dennis said that there [54:32] were other sexual relationships he had [54:35] with men that when he was there. Um, he [54:37] claimed that he paid for sex. Um, and he [54:41] denied that there was any sexual abuse. [54:44] But again, given his background, why [54:47] would we believe that? The other thing [54:50] is the pastor confirmed, the former [54:52] pastor confirmed to me that Dennis would [54:54] regularly take in men to stay in his [54:58] house. And his whole reason for doing [55:00] this supposedly was that these men were [55:04] needing housing, which again refugees, a [55:06] lot of them were Iranian refugees, [55:08] Kurdish refugees, and they needed a [55:11] place to stay. And he would do it under [55:14] the opices of helping these men. But [55:16] again, knowing what we know and that he [55:19] would at Weaten, we know that the [55:21] allegations are that he sexually abused [55:24] these men in the middle of the night [55:26] while they were sleeping. they would [55:27] wake up and he was abusing them. So [55:31] what happened there? [55:33] I you know again we we don't have any of [55:36] these victims coming forward. Most of [55:37] the refugees would go in and out of the [55:40] country very quickly [55:41] >> and we're were very transient and you [55:44] know who knows how many men out there [55:46] right now [55:47] >> are just reeling from what happened to [55:50] them especially that it happened. These [55:52] are Christians, [55:55] >> refugees, leaving Iran because they were [55:58] persecuted there, [56:00] >> seeking asylum in the US. They come to a [56:02] pastor's home that claims to be a [56:05] believer and this is what happens to [56:07] them. And again, this to me is on [56:11] Weaten, not just for what happened [56:13] >> absolutely [56:13] >> in 1998, but you're going to tell us [56:17] about what happened in beginning in 2014 [56:22] and 2015. So this means at the same time [56:25] that he was first hired in Turkey, these [56:28] things happened at Weaton. [56:30] >> Yeah. [56:31] So it starts out with from what I [56:34] understand you visited Weaten in 2014 [56:36] because you you felt like you had been [56:40] holding unforgiveness towards some [56:42] people and you wanted to release it. [56:44] >> So talk about your trip and what [56:48] happened specifically when you went to [56:51] Wheaten College [56:53] >> because you wanted to tell Phil Reichen [56:56] that you forgave him. [56:56] >> Right. Right. So, um, in the time right [57:01] before 2014, I'd have to do the math, [57:03] but, um, my daughters missed out on a [57:06] lot that Weaten had to offer. And, um, [57:09] one of the things they missed out on was [57:12] Honey Rock. So both of them at different [57:15] times when they were in college um [57:17] >> Honey Rock by the way for you and I know [57:19] what this is but I just want to explain [57:21] it for those who are listening but Honey [57:23] Rock is the Northwoods campus of Wheaten [57:25] College where a number of children [57:28] >> go for camp and from what I understand [57:30] it's a beautiful experience a lot of [57:32] them have and the camp counselors uh are [57:35] students usually and this is part of [57:37] their Christian education they get [57:38] credit for it they take classes um [57:41] there's also a whole internship program [57:42] it's It's it's really it's an amazing [57:44] thing. My husband actually was a unit [57:45] director at Honey Rock for many years. [57:47] So have many wonderful experiences. [57:50] That's what Honey Rock is. And and your [57:52] kids missed out on it. [57:53] >> Yes, they did. So when they were in [57:55] college, you know, and they were [57:56] restless. I suggested why don't you look [57:59] at Honey Rock cuz we were campers and we [58:01] love the mountains, all of us. And I [58:04] love the Northwoods. And so, um, my [58:08] oldest went and she worked in the office [58:11] and had met many people that she knew [58:15] their names or whatever over the years. [58:17] Maybe she has a great memory. So, saw [58:20] people, got to know things, heard [58:22] things. And then later at a different [58:24] year, my other daughter went up there [58:27] and my oldest took her, drove her up [58:30] there and she worked in the barn. She's [58:32] a horse person. Um, amazing. So, Doug [58:36] and I got to go visit both of our [58:38] daughters at the two different times [58:40] when they were there. But what was [58:42] happening that I didn't know and had not [58:44] thought about is as they're um just [58:49] growing in what is life like? What is [58:53] Christianity? Everything they get to [58:55] Weaten and um even though they have the [58:59] name Gallagher, [59:01] people knew who they were because it was [59:03] talked about who they were. I mean, [59:04] leadership knew who they were. Um, [59:07] >> and so people would come up, oh, your [59:10] dad and oh, and but what was damaging [59:15] leadership told one of my daughters [59:18] that [59:20] what I had shared with her when she was [59:23] a kid was not true. [59:26] And Doug and I went and met with this [59:29] person and said, "How can you say that?" [59:31] And she goes, "Well, it's not true, but [59:33] if it was true, you know what? He's not [59:36] that person anymore." [59:39] And and it's like, so what I have said [59:44] solo all these years [59:47] is now this isn't true. If this were [59:49] true, it would be no. And um [59:54] that person that I had mentioned to you [59:57] showed up at camp 2 who had been on um a [60:01] sexual list, a sexual pre uh sex abuse [60:05] list, whatever. What do you call those? [60:07] Have to report registry. sex registry [60:10] and and and she alerted someone to that [60:13] and it's you know you know it was [60:15] minimized [60:17] >> and so [60:18] >> um I don't know I wonder today how that [60:21] affected my daughters and that would [60:23] happen to that happened to both of them [60:26] somebody would say no no no no no you [60:29] know because they would say a little bit [60:31] about their experience and it was [60:33] there's no way we would cover it up [60:36] there's no way this is True. I know him. [60:41] Hello. Lived with him. It was a huge [60:45] dissonance with my daughters that I [60:47] didn't even see was happening. [60:50] >> Um and they do they have to work out [60:53] their story and and their faith and I [60:56] would never pretend to do that. Um but [60:58] that was shaking. And then after that, [61:03] I was like, maybe some of the trauma [61:06] we're we're all experiencing as they're [61:08] working everything out as young adults, [61:12] maybe I haven't forgiven. So, [61:15] um, I went to Sam Shellhammer's [61:18] uh house. He was no longer working at [61:20] the college. He had retired. [61:23] And he came to the door and I said, "Hi, [61:25] Sam." And he said, "Can I help you?" And [61:27] I said, "Sam, you know, it's Kathy [61:31] Misarro [61:33] Gallagher. Oh, come in. Come in. Come [61:35] in." I said, "I'm here to forgive you." [61:38] And he said something to the effect of [61:44] uh I had Tri Larson had assigned [61:47] something and I've never talked about [61:49] this, but you all are doing all right, [61:52] aren't you? [61:54] And I was forgiving him for why he [61:58] couldn't talk in the past, [62:01] but I'm hearing information now [62:05] that something's been signed [62:08] and I'm like thinking in my head, I've [62:11] got more to forgive. I mean, I can't [62:13] forgive that at this moment. [62:15] >> And he and I certainly can't trust you [62:17] with life's been hell in many different [62:20] ways for our family. I can't trust him [62:22] with that. I just said, "We're fine. [62:25] We're fine." And I talked with his wife, [62:27] just visited short time with his wife [62:29] and I left and I went over to the [62:30] college to see Phil. And [62:32] >> let me just pause right there because I [62:34] went over to Sam Shelhammer's house. [62:36] >> Okay. [62:37] >> Just just last week [62:40] and [62:42] he opened the door and was pleasant. [62:45] >> Yeah. [62:45] >> Cuz Sam, it's a nice guy. [62:47] >> Yeah. Um, [62:49] and then I said who I was and his [62:51] countenance dropped and he said, "I [62:53] can't talk to you." [62:56] >> And because you had told me, Trig [62:57] Larson, by the way, was the the head of [62:59] HR? [62:59] >> Yeah. [63:00] >> And I said, "Is that because you signed [63:03] an NDA or confidentiality agreement with [63:05] Wheaten College? I can't talk to you. I [63:08] can't talk to you." [63:10] >> Even today, he can't talk. [63:13] even today which which I would say if we [63:16] wants to make some things right how [63:17] about you drop all the NDAs today [63:19] >> right right you can't talk or you won't [63:22] talk [63:23] >> yeah yeah yeah [63:26] >> and and and does a real third party [63:30] investigation where you commit to [63:33] >> not only publishing your your the [63:36] agreement that you have with whatever [63:38] organization it is what the scope of the [63:40] investigation is that needs to be public [63:42] and and they need to publish the [63:44] results, [63:45] >> right? [63:46] >> Right. [63:46] >> The results. So, [63:48] >> uh, again, [63:50] >> it just it's just sad. [63:51] >> So, but I I just wanted people to know [63:53] that. But, okay. So, then you went from [63:55] there. So, I went to President Wright's [63:57] office. [63:57] >> Um, and he wasn't there and [64:01] Marily Melvin was there and I think at [64:04] that point she was second in command. Is [64:06] that correct? So at that time she would [64:09] have been the executive assistant to [64:11] President Reichen. She's now retired. I [64:13] think she went from uh executive [64:15] assistant to special assistant but again [64:18] now retired but at that time yes she [64:20] would have been right there in the [64:22] president's office. [64:23] >> Yeah. So, she sat down to talk with me [64:25] and wanted to know why why I was there. [64:27] And I said, "I'm here to forgive Phil [64:29] Reiken um you know, [64:32] because in the college for covering all [64:35] of this up and she's covering Dennis's [64:39] situation up and she was like, "Dennis [64:42] Visaro, he is a pervert and I've had [64:47] nothing to do with him since then." I [64:49] mean, it was like I was gut punched. [64:51] Like I And she said, "I don't know why [64:55] you're not over this by now. I'm over [64:57] it." And I'm like, I mean, I'm reeling [65:02] cuz I'm crying and I'm, you know, like, [65:05] "What's wrong with you?" And she's safe. [65:08] Kind of has that attitude with me. And I [65:10] am reeling [65:13] because [65:14] pervert is a strong word. I [65:19] because we don't know what it is. I [65:20] don't know. I I don't want to say I [65:23] hadn't thought that word, but I don't [65:24] recall thinking that word of Dennis. I, [65:27] you know, [65:28] >> sick. I I don't know that it was I was [65:32] reeling and she says, "You should be [65:34] over this by now." And then I I'm [65:36] literally thinking, you are a head [65:40] honcho in charge of a college, a [65:43] Christian college. You work with [65:46] traumatized [65:47] students every day. This is not a [65:53] traumainformed [65:55] response. I mean, I was very aware this [65:58] was damaging. And then she wanted to [66:01] pray for me and I prayed for her. I [66:05] think I shook her up when I prayed. I I [66:07] just prayed for truth and justice and [66:10] you know and uh I left. But I left there [66:17] in those two situations feeling like [66:21] I have more I have to forgive. I I I [66:25] just [66:26] >> you know what forgiveness is a process. [66:28] But um and then we went up to my friends [66:30] took me up to Bethany Beach which a lot [66:33] of college people are there and we were [66:36] um out walking one day and I see a [66:38] family I've known. I've gone to this [66:40] woman's funeral, her, excuse me, not her [66:44] funeral. I went to her husband's [66:45] funeral. I've been in their home and [66:47] I've eaten. I've known her kids. I knew [66:49] her son was a close friend with Dennis. [66:51] I talked with her daughter. And she [66:54] comes walking out and said, "What's the [66:56] real reason you divorced Dennis Misaro [66:58] and I was just I was had a panic attack. [67:03] I had a panic attack right there. [67:06] went went to my friend's house and I'm [67:08] like, I've got to go back home. I can't [67:11] stay. They had they had given me a [67:14] weekend um at the beach for my birthday, [67:18] Fourth of July weekend. [67:20] >> And um I just said, "I'm sorry. We've [67:24] we've got to leave. I've got to go back [67:25] home to tomorrow." I stayed the night [67:28] >> and I just said, "I can't stay. I can't [67:31] do this. I can't do it." [67:33] Um, so I went back home, but yeah. [67:36] >> And um, [67:37] >> wow. [67:38] >> That had to be in July of 2014. And at [67:40] some point before Christmas, after I got [67:44] myself back together and a little bit [67:45] more grounded, I decided to call Phil [67:49] and of course I got through or he called [67:52] me back, I don't remember. And I just [67:54] said, Phil, you've got to be the hero of [67:58] this story. You can be the hero. it [68:01] wasn't your presidency. You could bring [68:03] this into light. You can tell the truth, [68:07] publish the truth. You can tell my [68:10] daughters the truth. You can see if [68:12] there are other victims, be the hero. [68:15] And he he seemed open and humbled and [68:20] like he was hearing it for the first [68:22] time. And he said, "I I need to talk to [68:26] some people." and he called me back and [68:31] he had talked to the lawyer and he said [68:35] these things had never happened at [68:37] Weaton. [68:37] >> These things as in [68:40] dentists [68:42] essaying these these students. [68:44] >> Yeah. [68:46] >> Well, your husband and kudos to him. [68:50] >> Yeah. [68:51] >> He he's a retired firefighter. He's just [68:55] a straight shooter. But when he feels [68:57] something and he feels it passionately, [69:00] he communicates it. And so he wrote Phil [69:02] Reiken a letter that he sent in January [69:06] 2015. This would have been days after [69:11] my understanding Dennis Msaro started [69:13] his job in Turkey as a pastor on January [69:16] 1st, 2015. [69:17] >> Oh my. [69:18] >> I didn't know that. [69:19] >> Your husband sent this letter days after [69:22] he started there. So, I'm going to read [69:24] this letter because it's it's pretty [69:27] powerful. So, your husband writes, "Dear [69:29] sir, I introduce myself to you as a [69:31] firefighter. I am paid to put out fires. [69:34] When alarm sounds, this time is a [69:37] critical factor, and every second [69:38] counts." Nehemiah was also one who [69:41] responded to an alarm. In this case, he [69:43] was comfortably situated in the palace [69:45] of the Persian Empire. But Nehemiah took [69:47] the initiative and asked a couple of [69:49] questions. Most people actually prefer [69:52] not asking questions less they are [69:53] required to do something as evidenced by [69:55] Nazi Germany. When Allied troops [69:58] liberated German cities that contained [70:00] concentration camps, they would invite [70:02] the city citizens to a tour of the [70:04] camps. These tours were filmed and the [70:06] citizens were seen arriving for the tour [70:07] as if going on holiday to the sea. [70:10] Bonnets carefully placed on the lady's [70:12] heads and dapper suits sported by the [70:14] gentlemen. Smiles were on everyone's [70:17] faces until the citizens were shown the [70:20] truth of the ghastly horrifying [70:21] realities of life behind the camp's [70:24] walls and the many citizens succumbed to [70:26] fainting or vomiting. These people were [70:28] shown lampshades made from human skin. [70:31] Purses woven from human hair. [70:33] Photographs of medical experimentation [70:35] gone horribly wrong. All smiles [70:37] disappeared. These people's lives were [70:40] changed forever. Now they were forced to [70:42] face the truth that previously had been [70:44] hidden behind propaganda-driven lies. [70:47] These citizens had previously been [70:49] lulled to inactivity by lies and not [70:51] asking questions allowed them to [70:53] continue their lives unaffected. [70:55] Nehemiah asked a questions. Nehemiah did [70:58] something about the bad news he heard. [71:00] He could no longer pretend there was [71:02] nothing wrong. He chose to respond to [71:04] the alarm that sounded and acted to [71:06] mitigate the problem. Sir, an alarm has [71:09] been sounded on your watch. You have [71:12] been notified of truth that has been [71:14] covered up, allowing over the years [71:16] subsequent lies and propaganda to [71:18] reshape history. But painting truth [71:20] black and tucking it away in a corner so [71:22] the light of day does not reach it [71:24] cannot produce healthy change or [71:26] healing. inactivity or silence will be [71:28] judged. Just as Christ indicted the [71:31] church in Thotyra for tolerating and [71:33] turning a blind eye towards Jezebel, [71:35] allowing continuation of her webs of [71:38] deceit, a stand for truth was required. [71:41] Yes, an alarm has been sounded and you [71:43] requested time to think and pray. But I [71:45] believe time is a critical factor to [71:47] reduce the fire damage that silence has [71:50] already caused. My daughter is but one [71:52] of an untold number of casualties of the [71:55] silence Wheaten College chose. As [71:57] president of Weaten College, you are the [71:59] firefighter who is paid to respond. [72:01] Please feel free to call me. very very [72:06] powerful letter that your husband wrote [72:08] >> for you and for your daughters who he [72:12] was afraid would get taken in by by [72:16] Dennis and by others saying this could [72:18] have never happened if it had happened [72:21] we would know about it [72:22] >> right [72:22] >> devastatingly [72:25] Phil Reichen wrote back and I'm going to [72:28] read this whole letter because honestly [72:30] people have to hear this is how he [72:32] responded January 15th 2015. You can see [72:35] the date. He says, "Thank you for your [72:37] communications, Kathy. Your heartfelt [72:39] call before Christmas and Doug your [72:40] January 9 letter. Because Doug chose to [72:43] write, I've decided that it might be [72:45] helpful to write to both of you in [72:46] response to your concerns. I grieve for [72:49] the pain that you're going through as [72:50] parents who love their daughter. Before [72:52] I respond to your concerns, please [72:54] permit me to summarize what I [72:55] understood, Kathy, to communicate to me [72:57] by telephone. Kathy, you shared that you [73:00] had spoken with someone who told you [73:01] that while he was a student at Weaten [73:03] College, he had been inappropriately [73:05] touched by your ex-husband, Dennis [73:07] Msaro, who was then employed by the [73:09] college. It was not clear to me whether [73:11] your communication with his former [73:13] student occurred recently or whether the [73:15] conversation took place some time ago [73:17] and that your concern had recently [73:19] become renewed. And I believe that was [73:22] Joe. That's the pseudonym we used in the [73:25] the first article. But between this time [73:27] and then you had actually talked to him [73:29] in person. He had told you his story. [73:31] Then he continues, "You stated further [73:33] that the former student believe that [73:35] likely there are more victims of [73:37] Dennis's misconduct. You also said that [73:39] you believe others need to know the [73:41] truth about Dennis's misconduct. [73:43] Specifically, you said that one of your [73:46] and Dennis's two adult daughters is not [73:48] aware of or does not believe the [73:50] allegations of inappropriate conduct by [73:52] Dennis, and you are concerned that her [73:54] relationship with her father, Dennis, is [73:57] not appropriately guided because of the [73:59] information she lacks or does not [74:01] believe. You believe that it would [74:02] assist your daughter in viewing her [74:04] father accurately if the college would [74:06] communicate to her whatever information [74:08] the college may have about Dennis's [74:11] alleged misconduct. You also said that [74:13] you believe Dennis's alleged misconduct [74:16] was part of the reason for his [74:17] separation from employment with the [74:19] college, but someone told you that the [74:21] college had agreed with Dennis that it [74:23] would never share the details of the [74:24] allegations against him. You asked that [74:27] this code of silence be broken so that [74:29] the truth can be known. If I understood [74:31] you correctly, you do not have personal [74:33] knowledge or information that Dennis [74:35] inappropriately touched anyone other [74:36] than the former student with whom you [74:38] have spoken. For legal and other [74:41] reasons, the college generally does not [74:43] provide confidential personnel [74:44] information to persons outside the [74:46] college. In addition, if a student makes [74:49] allegations of misconduct against an [74:51] employee, there are a variety of [74:53] considerations that come into play in [74:55] the college's response. These include [74:57] the victim's privacy, the victim's [74:59] desires as to how the matter is handled, [75:02] which by the way, this is interesting [75:03] that they're interested in the victims [75:05] because my understanding is they didn't [75:07] do anything uh at this point in 2015. [75:11] They they hadn't talked to the victims [75:12] when he wrote this letter. They hadn't [75:14] centered the victims in anything they've [75:16] done. The nature of the evidence against [75:18] the accused, the possible outcomes of a [75:20] hearing or other processes to determine [75:22] the truth, the remedial actions [75:24] available to the college, the [75:26] remorsefulness of or acceptance of [75:28] responsibility by the offender, the [75:30] prevention of further misconduct, and [75:32] the punishment of and also the [75:34] rehabilitation of the offender. As you [75:37] know, Dennis's separation from the [75:39] college occurred over 16 years ago in [75:41] 1998. The personnel to whom Dennis [75:43] reported during his employment are no [75:45] longer employed by the college and I [75:47] have no personal knowledge of any of the [75:49] events surrounding Dennis's departure [75:51] having assumed the presidency in 2010. [75:54] While I do not know what factors were [75:56] considered by the college's personnel [75:58] back in 1998, I know that the college [76:01] takes seriously any instance of alleged [76:03] misconduct. In response, we attempt to [76:06] take the action that will best serve the [76:08] legal, moral, and spiritual needs and [76:11] obligations of each person involved. [76:13] Knowing personally the leadership in [76:15] place at the college in 1998, I feel [76:18] confident that they did their best to [76:20] honor God in making wise decisions with [76:22] the facts known at the time. After [76:24] prayerful consideration and after [76:26] discussion with the college's legal [76:28] council, I have concluded that I'm not [76:30] able to share any information the [76:32] college may have about allegations of [76:33] misconduct against Dennis. What I can do [76:37] is communicate the following. First, in [76:39] response to your belief that the college [76:41] promised Dennis that it would never [76:43] disclose any allegations against him, [76:45] creating a quote code of silence or a [76:48] quote cover up. I do not believe this is [76:50] accurate. As far as I can determine, the [76:52] college is under no contractual [76:54] confidentiality obligation to Dennis. [76:57] Again, you've you've seen the documents. [76:59] I showed them to you earlier in this [77:00] podcast. There was a separation [77:03] agreement. I I mean, I'm just [77:05] dumbfounded. I reached out to Phil [77:07] Reiken. I asked him how he could make [77:10] this statement. Did [77:13] >> does HR not have the separation [77:14] agreement? They have to have the [77:16] separation agreement. Did he not check [77:18] with HR? Well, that would be completely [77:21] irresponsible, right? [77:22] >> Given that you just reached out to him. [77:24] I mean, certainly he did that. He said [77:26] he's talked with the college's legal [77:29] counsel. The college's legal counsel [77:31] didn't tell him about this agreement. I [77:32] mean, I I don't I don't know any way to [77:35] interpret this but to say this is a [77:36] bold-faced lie. [77:38] >> Right? [77:39] >> If it's not a bold-faced lie, Phil, [77:43] talk to me. [77:44] >> Right? [77:44] >> Talk to me. Tell me how this isn't a [77:46] bold-faced lie. But so far, Phil Reken, [77:48] you won't talk to me. You won't talk [77:51] other than this letter, which is a lie. [77:54] You haven't talked to anybody in the [77:56] public that has asked about this. [77:58] Second, Weeden and Dennis mutually [78:01] agreed that he should no longer be [78:03] employed by the college. What is the [78:04] implication there? That he was not fired [78:06] for cause, right? [78:08] >> Which was again, this was the public [78:11] facing response that Weaten gave when he [78:14] was fired. Said that he was [78:16] that he resigned for personal reasons. [78:18] They allowed him to say to the Wheaten [78:20] College Record campus newspaper which [78:22] they publish [78:23] >> that he was fired or not fired that he [78:26] resigned for personal reasons. Third, [78:29] the college has communicated to Dennis [78:30] that he is not permitted to develop [78:32] relationships with current students on [78:34] campus which is laughable [78:37] because we know Dennis repeatedly was on [78:40] campus. We have in 2012 the college [78:43] itself [78:45] reposted a picture that a that a former [78:48] student an alumnist had posted with [78:50] Dennis on campus in 2012. The college [78:53] reposted that picture. [78:56] >> So what Dennis can't develop [78:58] relationships? Is this where we have to [79:00] we have to like parse words? Current [79:02] students this was a past student so it's [79:04] okay. I mean is that what he's saying? I [79:06] mean this is unbelievable. Kathy, I [79:08] invite you, the former student with whom [79:11] you have spoken or anyone else to [79:12] communicate with me if you have [79:14] additional information that would be [79:15] relevant to the colleg's maintaining a [79:17] healthy and safe environment for its [79:19] students. Now, Phil, why would anybody [79:22] speak to you? Why would anybody come [79:24] speak to you after this letter? [79:26] >> No, they should not. [79:28] >> Which is why again you didn't speak to [79:30] them. [79:30] >> No. when they finally came and said they [79:33] have an investigation and then yeah, [79:36] this investigation either didn't produce [79:38] a report or they're not willing to [79:40] produce the report. Again, this was in [79:42] 20124. [79:44] They did a supposed review, whatever [79:46] they're calling it. [79:47] >> Yeah, [79:47] >> we haven't seen any of the results of [79:49] that. It was all buried. In addition, I [79:51] am not aware of any restriction on the [79:54] former students disclosure of his [79:55] experience with Dennis to your daughter [79:57] or others if that is an avenue you wish [80:00] to pursue. [80:01] Doug, this one kills me. [80:03] >> This one kills me. [80:04] >> He is seriously He is seriously going to [80:07] confront your husband for the language [80:09] he used. [80:10] >> Unbelievable. [80:12] I You know what? This makes me so mad. I [80:14] can't even I This [80:19] Take the plank out of your own eye, [80:21] Phil. [80:22] >> Take the plank out of your own eye. I [80:24] I'm going to read this because it's so [80:26] infuriating. Doug, I would also like to [80:29] briefly address your letter. I [80:31] understand your spiritual concern for [80:33] your adopted daughter and appreciate the [80:35] passion you feel in trying to protect [80:36] her from being quote one of an unknown [80:40] number of casualties unquote. Still, [80:42] your letter contains some very strong [80:44] accusations and I feel it is appropriate [80:47] to say that I do not find them to be [80:48] supported by any information in your [80:50] letter or anything else that has been [80:53] conveyed to me. Again, I can't believe [80:55] that, Phil. I I just I don't believe [80:58] that. But if you'd like to explain it, I [81:00] would like to hear it. [81:02] >> I do not find the present situation [81:04] analogous to the atrocities of Nazi [81:06] Germany. Okay, fine. [81:10] It's pretty heinous and you're trying to [81:12] minimize it by saying it's not [81:14] analogous. Don't even go there. Nor am I [81:17] aware of any quote unquote cover up [81:19] quote subsequent lies unquote or quote [81:22] propaganda unquote to reshape history [81:25] perpetrated by the college. I would ask [81:28] that you prayerfully consider whether [81:30] those are accurate descriptions of the [81:32] college's actions. I hope to reach a [81:36] place where we are able to respect each [81:38] other's perspectives, speaking the truth [81:40] with grace even though we may not agree. [81:43] Please keep this letter and its [81:44] contents. I love this. And its contents [81:47] within your immediate family. Oh, we've [81:49] we've changed so much. Wheaten College. [81:52] >> Yeah. [81:53] >> We don't do confidentiality anymore. I [81:55] mean, unbelievable, Phil. Honestly. [81:59] >> Oh, I kept it confidential up until [82:01] recently. [82:02] >> I know. But you you have no obligation [82:04] to keep it confidential. I mean, all of [82:07] these no talk rules that they put on [82:09] people that they have no right to put on [82:11] people, they bury evil, they bury sin is [82:14] what they're doing. [82:15] >> Today, [82:17] I'm hearing the horrific [82:21] sexual abuse details [82:25] that I did not know. It's blankets of [82:28] shame over and over and over again for [82:33] Phil to think it's not as destructive [82:38] in victim's lives. [82:41] This cover up is [82:46] soul damaging [82:50] >> for people created in the image of God. [82:53] So the really really tragic thing about [82:56] both Doug's letter to Phil, your call [82:59] with Phil, Phil's tragic response [83:03] is that again this happened right about [83:06] the time that Dennis Msaro arrived in [83:09] Antalya, Turkey to be a pastor there. [83:12] And as I mentioned, when he was there [83:14] from 2015 to 2018, [83:18] he did unspeakable harm, not just to [83:22] Iranian and Kurdish refugees, but to the [83:25] name of Christ, to the church there, to [83:27] the ministry. And it's just absolutely [83:31] heart-rending when you realize it all [83:33] could have been prevented. Now, some may [83:36] say, "Hey, Phil may have known that [83:41] Dennis Misaro had done these awful [83:44] things many years ago." In that letter, [83:46] it talks about him being reformed, you [83:49] know, and again, when you have a serial [83:53] predator, how do you know if he's [83:55] reformed? I mean, are you an expert on [83:57] these things? And who who is going to be [83:59] the one you're going to risk on that [84:01] supposed reformation? Do you put that [84:03] person in a position of trust? Again, do [84:05] you allow? But again, people could say [84:07] he didn't know. Last he heard, you know, [84:10] Dennis worked for 14 years, as we heard [84:12] um in that video. He worked for 14 years [84:15] as a mortgage uh broker. So, he how much [84:20] harm could he do? Well, I heard from [84:24] again the former pastor there in [84:27] Antalya, Turkey. I heard from him and he [84:30] gave me a statement and we've heard some [84:31] of what he told me about what he knew [84:34] about what Dennis did in Turkey about [84:38] the sexual misconduct there. But he also [84:41] gave me a statement about [84:44] what he told Phil Reichen and again it [84:47] was the same year. In fact, it was the [84:50] summer of 2015. So Kathy, it would have [84:53] been just months. You came to him right [84:56] before the new year of 2015. Doug's [85:00] letter sent on January 9th. And then [85:03] this happened in probably the end of the [85:06] summer, it sounds like in at Weaton. Um [85:10] this gentleman, his daughter happened to [85:12] be a student. And I'm just going to read [85:15] from the statement that he gave me um [85:18] which tells about Dennis's arrival there [85:20] and then his work. Uh he went back to [85:23] the Netherlands. So it says, "Soon after [85:25] Dennis's arrival and installation as [85:28] pastor of the church in January of 2015, [85:31] I left for the Netherlands, thinking [85:33] that it would be a favor to Dennis to [85:35] facilitate the church's breaking for me [85:38] and bonding to him as the new pastor. [85:41] Shortly after settling in the [85:42] Netherlands, I was called to serve as [85:44] the interim pastor at the American [85:46] Protestant Church of the H APC, [85:48] replacing the Reverend Tim Blackman, who [85:51] had just been hired as the new chaplain [85:53] for Wheaten College. Later that same [85:55] year, in the late summer of 2015, my [85:58] daughter was starting her freshman year [86:00] at Wheaten College. During her [86:02] orientation at the president's reception [86:04] event, I had an opportunity to have a [86:06] conversation with Dr. Phil Reichen. [86:09] Among other things, we talked about my [86:11] replacing Tim Blackman at APCH, while [86:14] Dennis Msaro had newly replaced me at [86:17] the church in Turkey. I distinctly [86:19] remember his more or less expected [86:22] response regarding Blackman. Yes, I [86:24] think Tim is going to be a good fit for [86:26] the position as well as his very curious [86:29] response regarding Msaro. [86:32] Silence. [86:34] So, we know that Phil Reichen knew that [86:38] Dennis was pastoring in Turkey the same [86:42] year that you and your husband pleaded [86:46] with Phil to do something. Pleaded with [86:49] him, making that analogy of a fire [86:51] alarm. There's an alarm. Do something. [86:54] And we know that Phil Reichen did [86:56] absolutely nothing. And in fact, he [86:59] basically gaslit you making you believe [87:01] that Dennis, it was a mutual decision [87:04] with college, wasn't even fired. It [87:06] never happened. The essay of these men [87:08] never happened. Um just I mean just [87:12] absolutely devastating. And to and to [87:14] read that now, it's pretty hard to [87:16] swallow. And again, I've reached out to [87:19] Phil about this letter asking for his [87:21] comments and he has not commented. [87:24] I want to move forward several years [87:26] because in 2021, you reached out to Phil [87:30] and you gave me the letter that you sent [87:32] to him. Dear Phil, I mean no disrespect [87:35] in calling you Phil. I first knew you as [87:37] Phil when I taught your sisters at WCGS. [87:40] I refer to you as Phil when I pray for [87:42] you, your ministry, your family, and [87:44] your influence in the Christian culture. [87:46] You would think that after 22 years, [87:48] contact from me would not cause you [87:50] angst. I pray this letter does not do [87:52] that. I pray that you receive it as a [87:55] gift from God. He has told me clearly [87:57] three times to write it and yesterday he [87:59] confirmed it with a verse sent to me as [88:02] I completed the last words of the [88:03] following pages. I remember my joy when [88:06] I think of you as the president of [88:08] Wheaten College. God called you as a [88:10] pastor. In your role as president, you [88:13] must balance your pastoral and political [88:15] role. My prayer is that you are never [88:17] made a puppet by strings attached to the [88:20] board over you. I pray that you can hear [88:22] clearly from God and follow his lead [88:25] even if it is against the tide of [88:26] politics, the culture, and the cost. I [88:30] hear God saying over you for such a time [88:32] as this. As you hold everyone's feet to [88:35] the mission for Christ and his kingdom, [88:37] you must be more committed to prayer and [88:39] hearing from your commanding officer, [88:41] his way, his purpose, his time, his [88:44] presence. No compromise. You are not the [88:47] president of Weaten College in 1998. I [88:50] know that. And thus I feel deeply [88:52] grieved that then is encroaching on now. [88:55] I hope you were lied to about what [88:58] really happened in 1998. If not and you [89:00] know the truth, I pray you take the time [89:02] to bring that before Jesus. The time is [89:05] now for purification of his bride, the [89:07] healing of his victims and his glory. I [89:11] am learning to practice the presence of [89:12] Jesus in my prayer time. I am merely a [89:15] toddler in this. I try to see him and [89:18] hear his voice. Recently, a group of us [89:21] were asked to see ourselves in a locked [89:23] room of unforgiveness. Who was Jesus [89:26] asking us to forgive so we could leave [89:28] the locked room? This was the most [89:30] vivid. I was dressed in drab [89:33] old-fashioned clothes and standing [89:35] before my accusers in the prayer area of [89:37] Edund College. I was standing in front [89:40] of Dr. Chase. This is the president [89:42] before Litman. Two presidents before [89:45] President Reichen. I was standing in [89:48] front of Dr. chase in his black robe and [89:50] medallion. He was sitting in one of [89:52] those throne-like chairs of the blue [89:54] upholstery on a white wood frame. I felt [89:57] so unworthy and he had a look of [90:00] condescension. I looked at him and said, [90:02] "I forgive you, Dr. Chase." He was [90:05] unfazed and I heard a tumbler on the [90:07] lock move. Next, Dr. Litin was sitting [90:10] on a throne beside him. I looked at Dr. [90:12] Litfin who looked at me and said, "I [90:15] forgive you." Each apology made me feel [90:18] worse and unworthy. No one responded. [90:21] But with each apology, the tumbler [90:23] clicked. Dowdy and dejected, I looked to [90:26] my left. There was a line of people to [90:29] forgive. Henry Nelson, Ruth Bamford, [90:32] you. Sam Shellhammer, Vic Gordon, former [90:35] chaplain. Pat Patterson, former [90:38] chaplain. This picture was definitely [90:40] from God because I really don't even [90:43] know Pat Patterson. I felt as if I could [90:45] not go on. I could forgive, but the [90:48] weight of condemnation was more than I [90:49] could bear. But as I faced each accuser, [90:52] Jesus eventually showed up. But he too [90:55] was in shabby cut off pants tied by a [90:57] rope and a shabby shirt. I did not say [91:00] aloud to Jesus, but I thought, "You [91:03] can't come in here like that." I was [91:04] embarrassed by Jesus in that pretentious [91:07] prayer room. Jesus took my hand and we [91:10] passed through the wall, leaving all my [91:12] accusers in their pomp and circumstance [91:14] in the locked room. Feeling heavy and [91:16] dejected, Jesus spoke. This is all [91:19] pretense and pretend. We appeared at [91:21] Northside Park, the park in Weaton, he [91:24] turned me to face him and said, "You [91:26] need to trust me and give me your [91:28] heart." I reached into the cavity of my [91:30] chest, pulled out my heart, and gave it [91:32] to him. My heart is his and his alone. [91:36] So I thought it was finished and then he [91:38] told me to write this letter. He desires [91:41] for forgiveness to happen on a higher [91:43] level, his level. So I ask you to seek [91:45] him on all of this. Did he indeed give [91:49] me the above vision? Is a cover up of [91:51] 1998 still affecting victims and their [91:54] children and grandchildren. If that was [91:56] then, what does he desire of Weaten [91:58] College now? For what purpose? And may [92:02] we all be obedient? Truly, I want [92:05] nothing financially. I desire only to [92:07] see faces in heaven someday glorifying [92:10] Jesus merely because I sent this letter. [92:13] And so with this letter, I desire only [92:17] to bless you. [92:19] Wow, [92:20] that is [92:24] a very gracious letter. [92:27] At the same time, I'm wondering if you [92:30] knew then even what you know now. [92:32] >> No. [92:34] I I mean I can remember [92:37] recently when everything came out two [92:39] years ago. [92:41] God, why did you make me write those [92:44] letters? [92:46] And he just said evidence. [92:51] Well, I am very glad that you reached [92:52] out to them [92:55] both Reichen [92:57] Shellhammer. [92:59] Um [93:01] you never reached out to Dr. Litman or [93:03] you did at some point? [93:04] >> I didn't I didn't [93:07] >> because he [93:08] >> God gave me that God gave me those five [93:09] names. Those were the five he told me to [93:12] write. [93:12] >> There were five names. So I tried to [93:14] send one to Dennis. He didn't. It was [93:17] returned to me. I send everything [93:19] registered mail. I didn't want to [93:22] um [93:24] I wasn't trying to make a show. I was [93:26] just individualized. And um so I sent it [93:29] to President Reichen Dennis, but he his [93:32] was sent back. He did not want it. I [93:34] talked to him on the phone. He did not [93:35] want it. Uh Sam Shellhammer. I sent it [93:39] to my attorney who dropped me in the end [93:42] to hold him accountable and to a past [93:45] administrator. So, in 2023 is when Chris [93:49] Fritz first approached [93:52] Phil Reiken with [93:54] basically his plea to investigate this. [93:59] And he must have held some clout. All I [94:02] know is he he was able to push it. He [94:04] was able to get to the trustees. He was [94:06] able to get them to do something. [94:09] But that something ended up for all the [94:12] two two survivors of abuse by Dennis [94:15] that I've spoken to to you to witnesses [94:19] like Chris Fritz other people like Doug [94:22] Shite um David Summer I mean all of [94:25] these people that had some role in some [94:28] way of trying to compel the college [94:31] people that knew the allegations people [94:34] who tried to compel the college to do [94:36] something I don't know a single one that [94:39] appreciated that letter. In fact, it [94:41] infuriated them. It did. [94:43] >> When you see that letter and it's in our [94:46] it's linked in our very first article. I [94:48] will talk about it with Chris Fritz as I [94:50] said in our next podcast and we'll talk [94:53] about all of the meetings he had with [94:56] not just Phil but with the trustees. [95:00] um to boil down what we talked about in [95:05] this multi-our podcast and the fact that [95:09] the college didn't help these men report [95:12] it at the time. The fact it's been [95:13] covered up for decades, [95:16] >> right? [95:16] >> It's it's just so grievous. It was like [95:20] when I talked to attorney Bos Tavvigian [95:22] who represents so many of these abuse [95:27] survivors within uh a Christian context [95:30] and he said to me the improper touching. [95:33] He's like improper that's like using the [95:35] wrong utensil at a dinner table. This [95:37] was not improper. This was criminal. [95:42] >> Criminal. [95:43] >> Yeah. [95:45] >> What are you hoping now? I mean, I've [95:48] heard some people say Phil Reiken needs [95:51] to step down. [95:52] >> Yeah. Yeah. [95:53] >> Sam Shellhammer, the stoop, which is the [95:57] major big hangout snack shop at Wheaten [95:59] College, has been renamed Sam's. [96:02] >> I didn't know that. [96:02] >> So, it's named after Sam Shellhammer. [96:05] >> The Litvin Dwayne A. Litvin Divinity [96:09] Center. What is it? You know that [96:11] basically Divinity School is named after [96:12] Dwayne Liten who again was he was [96:15] president when this all happened. and it [96:17] happened on his watch. He approved what [96:20] happened. There's no way that didn't get [96:21] approved by him. The NDA, everything or [96:24] separation agreement, [96:26] all those things happened. So, do you [96:29] think those those men those who are [96:32] still employed need to be fired, need to [96:34] be removed, need to apologize publicly, [96:37] need to I mean, what what needs to [96:38] happen? And I would say Phil Reichen, [96:41] trustees, [96:42] >> Sam Shelhammer, [96:44] anyone who is made an idol of Wheaten [96:48] College, stop building your kingdom and [96:52] seek the kingdom of God. [96:55] Confess the truth of all your coverups. [97:00] silence deceit and lament your sin and [97:05] the ongoing damage you have done. [97:10] Admit that you have partnered with God's [97:12] enemy. Confess, make amends and [97:17] restitution [97:19] in keeping with repentance to those you [97:22] have minimized and imprisoned while [97:26] claiming to represent God's ways. [97:30] Treat each person always on your campus [97:34] as a gift, treasure, imagebearer of the [97:38] king. There is neither male nor female, [97:42] slave or free, immigrant or citizen, [97:44] rich or poor. Every person is an image [97:48] bearer of creator God, equal as sinners [97:52] at the foot of the cross. So yes, heads [97:56] need to roll. Heads need to roll. [98:00] because they have kept us in a prison of [98:04] invisible bars [98:07] >> and it's a prison of trauma. [98:09] >> Well, that is very well said and Kathy, [98:11] I said this at the beginning, but it's [98:14] worth reiterating. [98:17] Going through this story, I know brings [98:19] up a lot, brings up all that trauma [98:21] again and you're sacrificing yourself. [98:27] >> Yeah. to be on this podcast. You're [98:29] sacrificing yourself [98:32] to speak and I pray along with you that [98:36] it's not for not. [98:37] >> Yes. [98:37] >> And to the Wheaten alumni, to the [98:41] current students. [98:42] >> Yes. [98:42] >> To supporters, [98:45] you make this college run. They cannot [98:49] run without you. [98:50] >> That's right. That's right. [98:52] >> So, the outcry needs to come from you. [98:55] >> Yes. And I would hope I would hope and [98:57] pray that some of the people listening [99:01] that they would be convicted. They would [99:03] do the right things without being [99:04] compelled [99:05] >> to do the right thing. [99:07] >> Yes. [99:08] >> But that's again all we can do, all I [99:11] can do, all you can do is speak. [99:14] >> Right. [99:14] >> And it really is up to those to care [99:17] enough to do something. [99:20] >> That's right. [99:20] >> And so that's the appeal we make. And [99:22] Kathy, I I just feel honored again to be [99:27] able to steward your story and to be [99:30] able to use this platform so that people [99:33] can hear your story. But it has been [99:35] just an honor to walk with you and also [99:39] your daughter and to be able to [99:43] help in the way that God's given me to [99:45] help. Yes. [99:46] >> But again, it's um it is an honor. So, [99:49] thank you. [99:50] >> Thank you. [99:55] And thanks so much for watching the [99:57] Royys Report, a podcast dedicated to [100:00] reporting the truth and restoring the [100:02] church. I'm Julie Roy. And just a [100:05] reminder that the Royy's Report is [100:06] viewer supported. So if you appreciate [100:09] our content, would you please consider [100:10] helping us out today with a donation? 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[101:04] Also, make sure you subscribe to the [101:06] Royysre Report on Apple Podcast, [101:08] Spotify, or YouTube. That way, you'll [101:10] never miss an episode. And while you're [101:12] at it, I'd really appreciate it if you'd [101:14] help us spread the word about the [101:16] podcast by leaving a review. And then, [101:18] please share the podcast on social media [101:20] so more people can hear about this great [101:23] content. Again, thanks so much for [101:25] joining me today and God bless.  📄 **Full text:** ![[Full Document Contents/Articles/Survivor Wheaton's President Let a Predator Strike Again.md|Survivor: Wheaton's President Let a Predator Strike Again by YouTube]] ## Highlights - But the allegations involved not just improper sexual touching, but criminal sexual assault. The email also stated that Weeden had hired a firm to review what led to Msaro's dismissal because the college had recently received further information. But according to Msaro's ex-wife Kathy Gallagher, Weaten College President Phil Reichen knew everything a decade earlier because she told him. I >> just said, "Phil, you've got to be the hero of this story. You can be the hero. ([View Highlight](https://read.readwise.io/read/01ks2rzxvtd6pe7848w7am2ch1)) - Note: Institutional cover-up enables continued abuse - Tags: atom/literature/h1 - It wasn't your presidency. You can bring this into light. You can tell the truth, publish the truth. You can tell my daughters the truth. You can see if there are other victims. Be the hero." But instead of being the hero, Reichen became the villain. >> He called me back and he had talked to the lawyer and he said, "These things had never happened in Weaten." >> And in this part two of my interview ([View Highlight](https://read.readwise.io/read/01ks2s03yfc713n8s9bv49gzsd)) - Note: Legal silencing mechanisms protect institutions - Tags: atom/literature/h1 - scapegoat either intentionally or unintentionally. >> I was the one at fault. And um they watched people walk around a room to avoid me. They watched people who had once been friends end up at Dennis's house for meals or whatever. They watched ([View Highlight](https://read.readwise.io/read/01ks2s0b3ydgnsk7b41kwb8m2g)) - Note: Victim impact multiplied by institutional betrayal - Tags: atom/literature/h1