Automattic Is Doing Open Source Dirty  ## Metadata - Author: [[ThePrimeTime]] - Full Title: Automattic Is Doing Open Source Dirty - Category: #articles - Document Note: --- tags: - #open-source - #wordpress - #business-ethics Author: DHH Source: [Automattic Is Doing Open Source Dirty](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLdwYl_RyB4) Reference: [YouTube Transcript] date created: 2024-10-14 09:15 --- # Title: Automattic’s Revenue Demands and Open Source Ethics ## Table of Contents: - [📝 Summary](#-summary) - [📖 Main Content](#-main-content) - [🗒️ Notes](#-notes) - [🗣️ Paraphrase](#-paraphrase) - [📰 Newsletter](#-newsletter) - [✅ Action Items](#-action-items) - [🧪 Hypotheses](#-hypotheses) - [📊 Methodology](#-methodology) - [❓ Questions](#-questions) - [🔮 Future Research](#-future-research) - [💡 Implications](#-implications) - [🧠 Learning Styles Assessment](#-learning-styles-assessment) - [📊 Accessibility Assessment](#-accessibility-assessment) - [🌍 DEIB (Diversity, Equity, Inclusion, and Belonging) Assessment](#-deib-diversity-equity-inclusion-and-belonging-assessment) - [✅ Logical Validity](#-logical-validity) - [🔍 SEO Evaluation](#-seo-evaluation) - [🎯 Conclusion](#-conclusion) --- ## 📝 Summary: This transcript covers the ethical and legal concerns raised over Automattic’s decision to demand 8% of WP Engine’s revenue, a move criticized as violating open-source principles and the GPL license. The conflict highlights tensions between monetizing open-source projects and maintaining community trust. --- ## 📖 Main Content: Automattic, owner of WordPress, is demanding a revenue share from WP Engine, arguing the latter hasn’t contributed sufficiently to WordPress. The video explains the shift in WordPress’s terms of service and explores concerns about the future of open source if companies start enforcing retroactive financial demands. This tension mirrors broader issues in software licensing and the boundaries of community-driven projects versus corporate interest. --- ### 🗒️ Notes: - **WordPress License Shift**: - Until 2024, WordPress allowed free use of WP branding. - Automattic introduced revenue demands, challenging open-source principles. - **Community vs Corporate Interests**: - Critics argue Automattic’s actions undermine the spirit of open source. - Concerns about setting dangerous precedents where success attracts financial demands. - **Legal and Business Concerns**: - Potentially illegal behavior resembling extortion through licensing changes. - Automattic previously had ownership stakes in WP Engine, complicating motives. --- ## 🗣️ Paraphrase: 1. **Original**: "The clarity and certainty of open-source licensing is what allows businesses to build on them without fear of sudden claims." **Paraphrase**: Predictable licensing frameworks empower businesses to confidently use open-source projects without worrying about surprise legal or financial demands. 2. **Original**: "Automattic’s new demands threaten the fundamental trust that open source relies on to function." **Paraphrase**: Automattic’s actions risk eroding the trust essential for the open-source community to thrive. --- ## 📰 Newsletter: 🎉 **This Week in WordPress: Navigating Open Source Challenges** In this issue, we tackle a pressing topic: Automattic’s revenue demand from WP Engine. The conflict raises fundamental questions about how businesses engage with open-source platforms and what this means for WordPress’s future. We also feature: - **Community News**: New plugins enhancing accessibility and UX. - **Pro Tips**: Avoid burnout—smart ways to contribute sustainably. - **Development Corner**: Deep dive into the latest WordPress 6.4 beta! --- ## ✅ Action Items: - Investigate how Automattic’s actions align with or challenge GPL principles. - Advocate for transparent licensing practices in open-source communities. - Engage the WordPress community to discuss alternatives to financial demands. --- ## 🧪 Hypotheses: - If more open-source projects follow Automattic’s lead, adoption rates will decline. - Businesses may increasingly opt for "source-available" over open-source licenses to avoid financial uncertainty. --- ## 📊 Methodology: - **Data Source**: Case studies of prior open-source conflicts (e.g., Redis Labs). - **Design**: Comparative analysis of licensing changes and community impact. - **Analysis**: Survey developers about their trust in open-source platforms post-conflict. --- ## ❓ Questions: - Could other open-source projects adopt similar revenue models? - How can the WordPress community foster accountability without financial coercion? --- ## 🔮 Future Research: - Investigate the impact of licensing ambiguity on startup adoption. - Study the correlation between financial demands and open-source project longevity. --- ## 💡 Implications: A shift towards demanding revenue from users could erode trust, driving developers away from open-source platforms. This would likely lead to fewer innovative contributions and a fractured ecosystem. --- ## 🧠 Learning Styles Assessment: 1. **Visual Learners**: - **Present**: Structured well; however, lacks visual aids. - **Improve**: Add diagrams showing open-source revenue models. 2. **Aural Learners**: - **Improve**: Include an audio summary of the key points. 3. **Verbal Learners**: - **Present**: Rich in examples and analysis. 4. **Kinesthetic Learners**: - **Improve**: Add interactive case studies. 5. **Logical Learners**: - **Present**: Clear logical breakdowns. 6. **Social Learners**: - **Improve**: Add discussion prompts for online forums. 7. **Solitary Learners**: - **Present**: Opportunities for reflection. 8. **Naturalistic Learners**: - **Improve**: Include real-world sustainability examples. --- ## 📊 Accessibility Assessment: - **Screen Reader Compatibility**: Needs semantic HTML improvements. - **Keyboard Navigation**: Test for keyboard-only usability. - **Contrast and Readability**: Ensure high contrast. --- ## 🌍 DEIB (Diversity, Equity, Inclusion, and Belonging) Assessment: - **Cultural Relevance**: Lacks diverse perspectives. - **Inclusive Language**: Mostly neutral; refine further. - **Neurodiversity Support**: Simplify lengthy paragraphs. --- ## ✅ Logical Validity: - **Positive**: - Clear causal reasoning on licensing issues. - Balanced counterarguments acknowledging Automattic’s position. - **Fallacy**: - **Ad Hominem**: Critiques of WP Engine’s behavior distract from legal arguments. --- ## 🔍 SEO Evaluation: - **Keywords**: "WordPress licensing," "Automattic," "open source." - **Meta Description**: Needs concise summary with target keyword. - **Title Tag**: Adjust to optimize for SEO. --- ## 🎯 Conclusion: The ongoing conflict between Automattic and WP Engine underscores the importance of predictable open-source licenses. Ensuring that licensing remains transparent and fair is critical for maintaining trust and fostering innovation in the open-source ecosystem. Short Summary for [Automattic Is Doing Open Source Dirty](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLdwYl_RyB4) by [Merlin](https://merlin.foyer.work/) "Automattic vs. Open Source Ethics: Demanding 8% Revenue from WP Engine Raises Concerns Beyond Wordpress" [00:06](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLdwYl_RyB4&t=6) Automattic demanding 8% of WP engine's revenues [02:21](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLdwYl_RyB4&t=141) Open source license doesn't entitle demands for contributions [06:29](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLdwYl_RyB4&t=389) Open source has no warranty or liability, users take full responsibility. [08:31](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLdwYl_RyB4&t=511) Automattic's questionable actions related to WP engine and Open Source licenses. [12:40](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLdwYl_RyB4&t=760) Automattic wants to change its license away from GPL, causing uncertainty and disagreement. [14:53](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLdwYl_RyB4&t=893) Affiliation with WordPress and use of WP in product names [18:43](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLdwYl_RyB4&t=1123) Businesses are restricted in changing Open Source licenses [20:31](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLdwYl_RyB4&t=1231) Discussion on WP Engine's compliance and behavior regarding headless CI [24:11](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLdwYl_RyB4&t=1451) Concerns about c - Document Tags: [[automattic]] [[matt mullenweg]] [[open source corporate contribution]] [[wordpress]] [[wpdrama]] [[wp engine]] - Summary: Recorded live on twitch, GET IN ### Article https://world.hey.com/dhh/automattic-is-doing-open-source-dirty-b95cf128 By: DHH | https://x.com/dhh?lang=en ### My Stream https://twitch.tv/ThePrimeagen ### Best Way To Support Me Become a backend engineer. Its my favorite site https://boot.dev/?promo=PRIMEYT This is also the best way to support me is to support yourself becoming a better backend engineer. MY MAIN YT CHANNEL: Has well edited engineering videos https://youtube.com/ThePrimeagen Discord https://discord.gg/ThePrimeagen Have something for me to read or react to?: https://www.reddit.com/r/ThePrimeagen Kinesis Advantage 360: https://bit.ly/Prime-Kinesis Get production ready SQLite with Turso: https://turso.tech/deeznuts - URL: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLdwYl_RyB4 all right automatic is doing opensource dirty automatic demanding 8% of WP engines revenues because they're not giving back enough to Wordpress is a wanting violation of General open- Source ideals and the specifics of the GPL license automatic is completely out of line and the potential damage to the open source World extends far beyond uh the WordPress don't let the drama or its characters distract you from that threat let me give you a bit of background on why uh what dhh said is so important first off there's some things you must understand it wasn't until 2024 that WordPress changed its terms of service to make WP like underneath the envelope of their trademark because for a long time WP in how it was described was use as free as you would like for WP so that means from what 2005 to 2024 w P was just free for anybody to use and then all of a sudden it's not free anymore and WP engine is now being sued for 8% of the revenue so that's kind of like the easiest most specific answers 0 to 60 on what is going on the real question has to be why is this happening now they have not oh by the way they have not officially trademarked it you are right but they say in their trademark SL their terms of service that they are in fact now trademarking it but I don't think that that is I don't think that's true even in the slightest so now that you kind of have at least the the groundwork for what is basically happening the drama around it is that a lot of people are obviously getting blocked people are worried about their future with WordPress and automatic demanding 8% at first I didn't really quite understand this and I I didn't really get some of it and I asked Matt I have a I actually have an interview with Matt and I asked him why now why not 10 years ago why not any of these times uh has he done anything why now and he never really gave a great answer he said that they didn't they weren't giving back enough which I want to be completely real here that is the entire purpose of Open Source is that open source you put it out there and when you put it out there and you say it's free for someone else to use you cannot demand they give back you do not get an you do not have the right to demand anything back and though yes we can say that automatic is being somewhat good in the sense that they're saying hey you can give back by either engineering hours given to Wordpress or uh by giving 8% of your Revenue you're going to say okay well at least it's not like fully about the money okay yeah it's about maybe G maybe it truly is about giving back but you don't get that right when you put it out there under the license you put it under with the trademarks that you made you don't get the right to demand people now give back now that there's $500 million yeah uh WP engine might not be a good open source Patron but that makes them dicks not illegal activity yes precisely there's a huge difference between being a dick and doing something that is illegal or against trademark or against the license like so these threats I actually do like as I've taken the time to think about this I actually completely agree and have moved over to the position that dhh is now writing about which is if they can make any leeway and any lawsuit actually does come forth and get fought and goes in the favor of Wordpress we are entering into a new world where open source is dead why would you ever use any open source product realizing that someone can change the license and then sue you for 8% of your money or some percent of it there's like it's crazy even if it's settled out of court I think WP engine should take them to court and then sue them for damages I don't think it should be settled out of court unless if it's in WP uh engine's favor and they can write about it like they need to go all the way this is like Cloud flare going against patent trolls like they need to go all the way you don't let people have room like this like you can't I'm going to address this one comment why can't WP engine just Fork the stuff they want if they have the engineers Etc stop complaining uh and write your own then uh then or pay up this has nothing like what you're saying is so far out of left field you don't even realize I don't I just think I honestly think you're trying to be a good citizen and you're just trying to say hey either do it like this is someone's product so either use the product according to the terms and services or just write your own which I totally get but this isn't that this is like me saying hey you can have this for free you can have this for free ohe you make money now actually you owe me 8% there's a huge giant difference between the two okay sorry I had to get all those things out a key part of why open source has been so successful over the last several decades is the charity let's is the clarity and certainty of its licensing regime which allows you to build a business on open source without fear of frivolous claims or surprise shakedowns this is a surprise Shakedown it's starting to sound this is like a mo it's it's actually like a mobster like oh you make a little money huh H hey I'd hate to see you in court buddy uh the terms of the deal are spelled out in the license agreement and the common ones like MIT BSD or GPL have all stood the test of time the most important part of such a license is usually the fact that software is offered without any warranty but some in also include Provisions that require any modifications to be released as open source as well yeah that's that's G that's some variant of GPL right GPL requires that if you use uh the software this open source software you are required to also release the what you built on top of it as open source if I am not mistaken right GPL G plus Linux Shut Up N dang it none of the major licenses however say anything close to it's free but only until the project owners deem uh you too successful and then you have to pay 8% of your revenues to support the project this is where things get real bad right uh that's a completely that's completely Bonkers an arbitrary standard based on a rule of spite not law agreed this is why licenses are important this is why people who build businesses off things expect them to exist but that's also why there's no warranty see here's the that people are missing out imagine that WP engine hires all these people starts working together starts building up an entire service and everything's going good and then WordPress starts absolutely screwing everything up and completely making every release more and more unusable and they're kind of having to go back and trying to patch and figure out what's happening security things are going out of control well guess what sorry no warranty it's open source you don't get the right to sue back you don't get the right to sue me because I don't provide good quality stuff sorry that's part of Open Source as well I have no liability in this I'm releasing it because I've released this under a specific license and you get to use it how you wish to use it right that's that yes a lot of companies yeah people say Source available so I've been trying to make this I've been trying to make the distinction between open source and public Source I release a lot of things as public Source but I don't release things I I don't do open source right I don't do contributions and everyone coming along no I just do public Source if you if you would like to look at what I've worked on you can and that's that and I typically make all my stuff MIT or good luck with that license no llms right uh but whatever my feelings about private equity in general or Silver Lakes management of WP engine in particular I care far more about the Integrity of Open Source licenses and that Integrity is under direct assault by automatics grotesque claim for WP engines Revenue agreed private like blaming private Equity is just such a like a room temperature your IQ take and you see it constantly across the internet right now which is just like oh yeah but I mean private Equity is bad am I right it's just like not all first off not all private Equity is bad okay I did skip a section we'll go back and we'll read this my bad um not all private Equity is bad like it's just a fact of life you cannot you cannot universally say they're all evil just like not all venture capitalism is in fact just completely evil though it is its primary purpose is to make money Venture Capital allows plenty of people who could not start a business to start a business private Equity allow plenty of companies who could not take it to the next level take it to the next level so there is plenty of okay things about it and you just got to understand that like that that part is fine I love the fact that someone who does not have a shot to be able to go full-time Plus hire people can actually go full-time and hire people I think that is a good thing for society and I think that's great for individuals but it also leads to shitty Behavior WP engine not that great right they don't really give back they claim they give back by sponsoring events but let's all be real you sponsor events not because you're giving back you sponsor events because you want people to give you more money you believe that the money you're putting in is going to generate more money out that's it I don't even have a dog in this fight only a set by the way I'm rereading a uh a thing before I don't even have a dog in this fight only a set of principles if anything I'd be naturally inclined to be on team word between creating one of the most widely used open source programs and powering half the internet there's every tribal reason to side with automatic over wp's engine private Equity owners at Silver Lake but whatever my feelings about private equity in general or Silver Lakes management of WP engine in particular I care far more about the Integrity of Open Source licenses and that Integrity is under direct assault by automatics grotesque claim for WP engines Revenue yes yes and yes it is more outrageous that automatic has chosen trademarks as their method to get uh their Capone when up until 2018 they were part owners of WP engine before selling their stake to Silver oh I did not know that so that's something I did not know I did not realize that WordPress actually owned WP engine that okay that that I'm not going to say that changes everything but it it certainly makes a big big difference right that's a that is a big big difference that what is going on here and so there you go pressible is in fact owned by automatic and then they make they turn off updates to WP and like this is pure like mobster level Behavior completely turn everything off for you make it so that you can't do business effectively and then show that you have an alternative hosting platform that provides the exact same things that they do I don't know if that is I'm not even sure if that's legal right I don't know the legality of it but I don't even have to know the legality of it to say that it's horrible oh my gosh this they actually made the situation worse by saying it was their intention to help WordPress dude you are owned by the you were owned by the company that made the situation for your direct competitor like what do you mean you tried to make the situation better this is actually worse all right and yet I can see where this is coming from Ruby on Rails the open source web framework I created has been used to create businesses worth hundreds of billions of dollars combined some of those businesses Express their gratitude and let's see and self-interest by supporting the framework with dedicated developers membership of the Rails Foundation or conference sponsorships but many do not and that is absolutely their right even if it occasionally irks a little yeah do honestly dhh probably is the most qualified person on Earth to speak to this not only is he experiencing what WordPress is experiencing but he is experiencing it at a level that is like greatly larger than probably word press itself right like he actually is getting he directly experiences this uh lonus lonus would also be another amazing person to speak on this right on Earth really I don't know it's hard it's hard right because yeah you could I guess you could argue okay fine fine you're right lonus is probably the the best person on Earth to be able to talk about this exact problem right fine granted uh that's the deal that's open source I give you a gift of code you accept the terms of the license there cannot be a second set of Shadow obligations that might suddenly apply if you strike it rich using the software then the license is meaningless the clarity is all muddled and the certainty is lost agreed WP engine must win and it must win not because I want WordPress to lose I want open source to win look automatic can change their license away from GPL at any time they wish the new license will only apply to the new code though and WP engine or anyone else are eligible to Fork the project that's what happened with Reedus after redis labs dropped their BSD license and went with a commercial Source available alternative valky was forked from the last free reddis version and now that's where anyone interested in open source reddis implementation is likely to go but I suspect automatic wants to have their cake and eat it too they want to retain wordpress's shine of Open Source uh but also to be able to extract their pound of Flesh from any competitor that might appear when whenever they see Fe fit screw that WP engine must win he's absolutely right and I think he gives one of the most Fair takes in the sense that is that he he likes WordPress he wants WordPress to win as far as WordPress goes but this particular action is just not okay that's just wishful thinking trademarks and patents still exist and they are not captured by all copyright licenses uh fair that is very very true but the problem is this is that if anybody would love to go to the wayb back license they the way back machine and and get me the exact license terms before the change I'd be glad to I'd be glad to throw that up there but the previous licenses said WP is free for anyone to use however they see fit approximately what it said so when it says that for multiple decades and people build businesses off that assumption you can't just change that including in trademark right like you can't just change your trademark that's like that's that's not even how trademark law works I'm like I only know bird law okay I only know bird law I'm not that great at Law in general but there ain't no way the missing key factor here is in Matt's argument that WP engine purposely LED users to believe they are affiliated with WordPress by using Wordpress as well as woo Commerce not WP in their product names and offerings yes now that is something that he can and he should be able to do something about but his big thing is he's mentioned WP many many many many times and included changing the trade mark or their terms of services by just all the sudden magically including WP Harvey Birdman aka the prime gen attorney at law exactly you can't just do that right you can't just change things where where's the one uh where's the part where it talks about uh WP let's see the abbreviation WP is not covered by the WordPress trademarks and you are free to use it in any way you see fit would anybody let's see uh okay good so I'm going to go like this I'm going to copy that in any way you see fit now remember that is like that's not that long ago now look at what it says I mean that was this year they've made this change by the way the abbreviation WP is not covered by the WordPress trademarks but please don't use it in a way that confuses people for example many people think WP engine is WordPress engine and officially associated with WordPress which it is not see like that's I'm sorry but you can't say this and then go to this right like that that's just not that's just not how it works you can't have someone build a business that becomes $500 million and then go o wait a second and then specifically call out WP engine again there's so many different ways in which we could say why Matt could have done it better let me just give you something uh if Matt Mullen W during his like big talk on what was it September 24th or whatever it was came out and said hey WP engine has been making hundreds of millions of dollars and they're just not giving back to the community I really think us as a community need to send them a clear signal that either they need to they need to really become active members in this community or they need to uh we need to Simply divest from them now it's up to you WordPress Community to vote with your dollars please if you can choose any other uh platform right like that'd be one thing and I would get that and I think everybody would actually get behind them I do I do I completely believe that's true that a lot of the WordPress Community would have got behind Matt and said absolutely I think that he is right that WP engine is making a ton of money from us and they're just not really giving back and we want to have a community that wants open source to be great but the problem is he didn't do that he said give me 8% or I'm going to like Nuke you out of or from orbit which is just so much different one is motivating the community to make a good decision the other one is trying to motivate the company with threats of extortion like those are very different by the way the extortion for those that don't know he literally texted effectively to put it into like very small words so I'm I'm obviously taken a huge license here uh but effectively said 8% or else I believe he even used the term or else directly it was like that bad I might have just accidentally verba him quoted exactly what he said he might have included the word nuclear in there 8% or else nuclear like right like that's crazy right the thing that confuses me about the whole WordPress situation is how did you not see the community loves you right like how did you not see that how did Matt not realize he had so much Community momentum behind him and he could have easily shifted the community into something else to sum everything all up d uh dhh again is correct about everything I think that open source has to win WP engine has to win despite the fact that we don't like what they do they have to win for the sake of everybody they have to win such that licenses have to be respected and open source has to be a gift in which you can rely on the license to be able to start a business on top of that and that's it the end no changing it at all no take backies no oopsy oopsy dupsies that's it it's just the way it has to be and then afterwards the best part about this is that afterwards after WP engine wins and everybody claps then can just choose an alternative platform that's different and you can say hey WP engine we don't like what you're doing hey I actually we actually do think you should give back you can still do that also right like you can do both things at the exact same time you can actually hold two things in your head that seem to be uh seem to be what's it called a contradictory bad take let us know all right let us know you have to say why WP engine has to lose why tell me one re tell me tell me why and it it better be it better be good because you are you are literally going to destroy all of Open Source now the thing that they that WP engine can lose on is that they had a product called uh WP uh they had a product called like WordPress blank and you could say absolutely they should have to lose on that one they renamed it and got away from it so if they got away from it I'm not exactly sure if there's some sort of pass damages that they can be sued for or whatever I I understand that headless WordPress I'm not sure if that's against the terms the hard part is I'd have to go look at it the exact terms because that's the tricky part is that there's these weird things that involve trademark terms that are like you can't use WordPress blank but you can use uh this is there any sort of substantial things WordPress uh word Mark let's see okay so you can't you just simply can't use WordPress so yeah there you go then yeah that would be absolutely right then then you could try to sue them over that one particular thing but that is different what is headless CI I don't know I think that that's fine you can say that they can lose to that specific thing on that specific item but to say that WP engine itself WP being in violation it's not WP has never been in violation now these sub ones that you can most certainly say now that's fine I I I won't agree I won't disagree with that one at all uh I don't think you should uh San wash what he did as honest he was dodgy and being uh dupc duplicitous in both interviews saying stuff like uh I had lunch meetings when you constantly ask direct questions to the point your question yes that part is fair but he also at least went on and asked he at least he he went on and tried that I think dhh is wrong he doesn't understand that the code is open source uh free to do whatever they are only blocked in WP org which is like the ey store of Wordpress they uh they have TOS there yeah that's an interesting one uh as far as the whole blocking on WP uh or on wordpress.org that one is much more hairy I think it WordPress can do that I don't think there's any I as far as I can tell I don't I don't I don't know if there's like a license agreement that they have to take that they have to accept any company like I don't know if that's a thing and so that one would be that one's at at least a lot more interesting right so also I am completely not uh not being able to block uh from servers is uh scary yes it is scary which means that you should just never build a business on top of Wordpress that's all it means is that WordPress is an un is an unusable platform that's how I would look at it is that WordPress is not is not usable if they're willing to block then yeah they blocked the guy who built WordPress API on I know I saw that which is crazy I am a WordPress developer for 12 years I remember from uh day one that we had to be careful uh with the fact that uh automatic has the WordPress trademark and we can let's see and we only word about okay well that's I mean yeah I would assume you'd have to be careful if I were to let's see if I were another host I would be looking at contingency plans yeah so that's the that's the crazy part anyways okay looks like there I mean I think one really obvious fact is that I am not a lawyer and I have absolutely no idea anything about this but I will say that I I I don't want the ability to just simply change how you feel about a company out of nowhere like I there's something inherently wrong about that and I do hope that they are able like I hope WP engine wins on the things that make sense for that entire sake that they win because of like that we shouldn't allow companies just to swivel on a dime and now say these things also I think that you I like I honestly think that WordPress turning off the access to WP engine for updating I actually just I would personally just never use WordPress because of that like I I actually think that WordPress is a bad thing now because that means that they can turn off your ability to use WordPress as a company whenever they see fit they don't treat people it's not like npm they now do that uh potential collab with legal legal let's go like to me that just sounds like why would you ever do that why would you ever put your lot in with a company that can do that that they sit there and they secretly hold a bunch of things that they can pressure you into giving you money right they can just literally sit there and just wait and when they realize that you're in a vulnerable position position they can just turn you off like to me that is that is more terrifying for any other reason to use it right like imagine npm just starting to turn off every major company's ability to update or download anything until they paid them money right like that's that's evil empire Vibes great you know even m i mean that's that's you must suspect any other company let's see that does open software I know crazy you mean extort it's practically extortion I don't see how that's not extortion npm could do that right npm technically could do that and if they did that nobody would ever use it like nobody should ever use npm ever again all right let's move on the end, Automattic Is Doing Open Source Dirty, ThePrimeTime, 01ja5hj2wr0fct3wr19vm1q7qw.