CHAOSS Weekly Community Call, Feb 24, 2026 ![rw-book-cover](https://img.youtube.com/vi/SKVUoOpZgcQ/maxresdefault.jpg) 🔗 **Source:** [CHAOSS Weekly Community Call, Feb 24, 2026](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKVUoOpZgcQ) There we go. Okay. Hi. You're here at the Chaos Weekly Community Call. It is February 24th. I am Elizabeth, the Chaos community manager. I guess I could change my name here. There we go. I'm Elizabeth. Uh, great to see you all here. Let's share the screen. Let's share the minutes. Um the sometimes my uh captioning covers everything that I'm I need. I don't like that. Why does it do that? I don't know. >> There we go. Um if you would like to add your name to the agenda and tell us your favorite thing about March since we're getting ready for March. I'm so over February and winter. Um that'd be great. So yeah. And yes, Don, I I would like to see some pictures if you are so inclined to take pictures because I need that in my life. >> I do. I'll send you some. I took some pictures and sent them to my mom when I was talking to her on the phone. So, I've got some right here. >> Yes. Excellent. Excellent. >> Very current. >> That is I really miss getting out with my camera mostly. Uh it's just I'm not a you know, some nature photographers are like out at 5:00 a.m. in the Arctic. No, >> I was going to say you can take pictures of snow. >> I did. I did. The first time it snowed. I was like, "Oo, this is pretty." Yeah. Let me get my camera. No, I don't know. I don't want it now. I want the flowers for sure. Um Oh, I've been signed out. Hope that didn't screw up our recording. There we go. Um anyway, let's go ahead and start with our agenda. Um, okay. So, this has been a conversation we've had a few times in this meeting about these minutes and this gigantic dock that we have. Um, so we decided to start a new dock every year like in March so that we will have the first few meetings for everybody still in the same dock. Um, and then there was an issue of well how are we going to get everybody to go to the next one. So, just chatting with Adrian this morning. He hopped on the newcomer hangout. So, we didn't have any newcomers, so we uh spent the time going over that process and some other um interesting things about the website and our GitHub plugin and all the good things. So, um thank you Adrian for thinking this through with me. Um so now, from now on, for starting next week, from now on, this is the only link anybody will ever have to remember is just working group minutes. Um, and then it it goes to an empty doc now, but it will be the new dock um for everybody. So, we don't have to remember where the minutes are, what year it is, anything. It will just it'll just magically happen. And then we are going to keep this also on the website and it'll be just the index. Here's all the years because it's all it's all there. It's in the chaos drive in Google and linked in um each of these tabs. It's linked here, you know. So maybe we will just put the link to the archive and just leave it at that instead of every tab. I would have to add then the year on every tab like no that's too much too much work. So, um, yeah. So, that's that's the new process and I hope that makes it so much easier for everyone. And it's on the on the back end, it's super easy to just change the redirect to because it can go wherever we want and then it would just be adding another line to this one document here. So, I hope that makes sense to everyone. Let me know what I'm missing in that process. There's glaring problems with that. So over each year we'll just have like a giant one giant archive dock for the year essentially. >> And then that top link is just like a is that the current year? >> It's it's yes. So yes. So this is uh just a redirect in our WordPress instance >> and then we'll just change where where it redirects to >> and if you want to go look at some minutes from two years ago, you click that second link. Yep. And it'll just like link out to the different archives. >> Yep. It'll just be an index of all the years. >> Okay. >> So, make it super easy. And then instead of each tab having the archived minute, you know, having this on every tab, it'll just be >> that link, the archive link. >> How old is this document? >> Oh, uh, this that's a great question. I want to say 2020, early 2024 maybe. So, maybe two years. Okay. Okay. >> Um, so yeah, so we've been just, you know, cop, you know, um, moving the stuff over to a new doc, but we've been all the the versions are still there. And so, you know, it's just >> I get it. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Okay. Yeah, that makes sense. >> Well, also, um, and the new doc take out these inactive ones, which we kind of kept around and like >> they can be in the archive, but they don't need to be in the current doc, I don't think. >> For sure. Yep. >> So, okay. Any other questions, comments, thoughts, stuff. >> Oh, that makes sense. Until we change it next time. >> Yeah. So, this will happen next starting the meetings next week. Um, and I'll change the calendars, of course, and I put it in the working group leader um Slack so that those folks know as well. But I'll just make sure everybody kind of knows as much as we can. So, okay. Um, the other uh thing is the daily saving time which is happening in two weeks. Um, and that causes chaos with 1s, not the good kind like we are. Um, yeah. So, it's the time when those of you who don't know, it's the time when the US starts daylight saving. A lot of people don't, some people do, some people never do. It's kind of a a mess. Um, and we have our meetings are tied to different time zones. So, like these meetings right here are going to change with daylight saving on March 8th. All of these meetings. So, if you're in a place that doesn't change or hasn't changed yet, these will all be at a different time for you. Um, these meetings are tied to West Africa time and do not change with DST. So, if you are in a place that does do DSD and has changed, these will be at a different time zone for you or time for you. You get where I'm going with this? So, the reason we have all of these tied to different times is because it makes more sense for folks who are in that area, right? So, like there's why would folks in Africa have to change their like nobody there does a DST. So, it doesn't make any sense for us to force them to change with the US. Um, same thing with the Chaos Asia. It doesn't make any sense. And then the UTC one, they decided to do that and that's I mean, why not? YOLO, you know, hey, what it works for them. That that's what would be the best for them. So, um Oh, I need Adrienne says I need to change the redirect on WordPress 301 permanent to three to temporary. >> Probably a bit of a tech. I don't know how much control you have on WordPress, but there are different types of redirects >> and we want the temporary one cuz this link is going to keep changing year over year and we we want people's browsers to keep checking the current redirect and not just saving this redirect to the 2026 doc forever. Especially because the more if people click on this before this gets changed, their browsers are going to remember the 2026 link >> like mine. probably you I think you can like clear your there's there's ways to clear it like your it's just a temporary storage in your browser but it's not something that frequently gets cleared by most people. So >> okay that is Adrian see this is why I love >> I'd sanity check that before I started changing all the links and all the um I mean I can still update the link I just don't want people to click it until we fix that. >> Yes, I appreciate that so much. Um, I Adrienne, what I need really is for you to just follow me around my day and just like point out the things that I'm missing or like like just clean up my mess as I go cuz you're amazing at that. Thank you so much. I would never have caught that ever. So, good call. Excellent work. I really appreciate you very much. >> Buy the Cheetos. You should buy >> Exactly. Just my crumbs. as I go along cuz I make I kind of do make a mess wherever I go. So, here we are. Um, sorry. Um, yeah. So, anyway, daylight saving is a mess. Um, but the good news is the chaos calendar will be the single source of truth because it is smart and knows where everything everything is. No, there is not an AI, Elizabeth. although they probably would do they would probably be more productive and better at things than I am. But you know what? It's okay. It's all right. Uh so yeah. So anyway, if you're subscribed to the chaos calendar, you'll be good. Uh if you're wondering, you can go now and see what time things will be for you later. Uh because it's smart that way and it already knows. Just make sure that you're looking at it in your time zone. So, okay, questions about that? Any questions? I wish there was an easy fix for daylight saving. I don't think there is. >> I just was reading through some of the daylight savings stuff and um not to make things any more complicated than they probably already are, but like like the meeting like if you are in a region that honors daylight savings, but the meeting is pinned to UTC, your meeting the meeting time for you is still going to change even if the meeting time for everyone else doesn't. >> Correct. Maybe we need to just write a blog post or something that's like the comprehensive guide to understanding when the crap you're supposed to be meeting. >> Well, and you know, a while ago, so we used to have the calendars tied to to Google and then we had all these different meetings and people would have to subscribe to everything or nothing. So, it was did not give us the um granularity that we wanted. So, we switched to team up and there they you know are we host on them and um it's been great like it that you can subscribe to just one calendar. We have a lot of flexibility with how that's run and it keeps track of all this stuff. So, it's wonderful. The only um drawback is there when we had it on Google, there was a nice Slack reminder that said, "Hey, there's a meeting happening. If you want to go to it, here's the here's the link." And then that that is broken. And I tried this is Adrian maybe another conversation you and I have to have >> conveniently. So, conveniently, Sean gave me, I guess, admin access to Slack like yesterday because I was trying to get I'm trying to set up a uh a Slack bridge because we have an internal maintainers chat for Augur on Slack and there's also a Discord server and it's like, hang on, half the maintainers are over here and half of them are over here. I just want to bridge these with a bot so that anything that gets sent in either place gets sent to the other place. Um, and I've just been trying to deal with a half unmaintained bridging software. So, but I could probably look at the Slack integrations while I'm in there. >> Yeah, I mean that would be great. I I was resorting to this and that theft and that worked. It worked for some meetings and not for others. And I don't I don't know why. And um then I got distracted and on to other things. So, I never had time to go back and really dig into what I had broken. But, it did work for a minute. I think that would be really helpful if we could have a Slackbot that just told people when meetings were happening. Um, >> I was actually, so I was talking to um Anna from the to-do group and they have a bot that um that does this. It posts in the channel when the next meeting is. It gives you like an hour notice or something. Um, and she recently just changed the way that she did that um to something that might work for us. >> Okay. >> And she she sent me all of the code. So, what I'm going to do is I'm going to send that I guess maybe to you and Adrien. >> Okay. Yeah, that would be great. I I'll just send you everything she sent me >> and then if that works or >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I'll send it to the two of you and then we'll see what happens. >> Yeah, that would be awesome. Um back when So that used to be a seamless integration between uh Google and Slack and then Slack broke that. So To-Do group had a workaround and I we borrowed it from them at the time and then we moved off of of Google so we didn't need it. Um but I never got back around to kind of closing that loop. So, yeah, that would be awesome. That would be >> Yeah, I guess it's a it's a Slack web hook and a Google script, >> right? Okay. Okay. And would that work if our calendar's still on team up? >> I have no idea. >> Okay. >> I'll be honest, she sent it to me because I was like, "Oh, that sounds really good." And then I just haven't had time to look at it. And so, >> so now I'm just passing the buck. You see how that works? >> Yeah, I love it. I I'm great at that. That's why I'm going to pass it right on to Adrian as soon as this call. No, I'm just kidding. Um, there is like Slackish integration, but it requires people to have a team up account. Like if we if we all were on like had something blah team up whatever an account there then it would be it would be seamless integration. But it's the fact that it's like we're not using team up for everything for everybody. It's not like a company that h you know what I mean like we're not here. So yeah, the Slack is >> it is it is specific to Google Calendar, but there might be >> I don't know. There might be a way to adapt it. So I've said what I have and if it doesn't work, we're no further behind than we were before. >> Right. Right on. I love it. Do it. Yes. Thank you very much. >> Yeah. Essentially, I just really don't like technology. Technology just Yeah. makes me makes me want to drink wine is what it does. But that's okay. Um, it is what it is. If anybody else has any ideas or experience in any of this and wants to speak up like even after the call, excellent. Please do. Please feel free. No. Uh, we're not going to be like, "No, you cannot you cannot help us with this. That would not that would not happen." So, that'd be great. Okay. Any final thoughts or anything before we move on? Okay. Um, Don put this on here, so I'm going to let her take that away. Yeah. So, this is um this is a random thought and it's it's but it's something I've been thinking about a lot recently. So, historically, the way that our software has worked. So, both Augur and Grimmar Lab, you give it a list of GitHub organizations or a list of repositories that you want it to analyze and it goes off. It collects all the data and then you can uh visualize it which is great when you're say a community manager and you're focused on a few specific repositories or organizations or when you know which organizations and repositories you want to look at. So like OSO wanting to look at all of the code that they own for example. Um the tools are great for that. But lately I've had a lot of people um come to me. There was somebody in one of the um one of the I forget it was like a workshop I think it was one of the one of the workshops that we had at Chaoscon EU and he was like yeah I want to better understand all of the open source you know work happening in China and I want to use chaos metrics to do that. Um and and yeah there's metrics that you can use but the software doesn't really doesn't really allow for that more more of an ecosystem analysis. Um, and this is becoming a lot more important as people are digging into supply chains as a whole where you might not know exactly which repositories in advance you need to collect data on. Um, and we have a package metadata working group which I know is is kind of kind of in this space. But I was just I was just curious if people have if people have thought about this because I feel like I feel like maybe maybe the chaos project needs to maybe we need to do more in this area. Maybe we need to just say that's not that's not our space. Um and you know there are other tools that do that like ecosystems for example. I don't have any I don't have any solutions. I just know that the number of times people have come to me with questions that were more supply chain or ecosystem related and had to say, "Well, yeah, but our our software really doesn't do that." So, I'm curious what other people think. In particular, Matt, I know you've done some research on supply chains. I'm curious what you think. >> Right. So, totally. Um, so I a couple things that immediately come to my mind is on the stuff that we've been doing around supply chains and people could tell me they don't agree with me, but I I treat ecosystem and supply chains as different things. And so Yep. And so I treat ecosystems like the CNCF as an ecosystem. Those projects may or may not be related to one another like technically um but they all are kind of in that cloudnative space. Um, so that's an ecosystem to me and then a supply chain has kind of an inherent connection between projects. Um, and then so I have not been looking at the ecosystem stuff at all. I've been looking at the supply chain stuff and we um have been gathering our data from two different places. So we were using deps.dev dev for the technical connections between projects. So, we were able to kind of sort out technical dependencies at least like one one level, you know, like not too deep because obviously supply chains can go on kind of forever. Um, and so there are I'm not sure who runs deps.dev, but I think like there are challenges in using it. So, for example, I think they just stopped supporting um Go as one of the things that they take a look at from a dependency perspective, which I think is kind of interesting because I thought it was a Google project, dup.dev. Anyway, um and so we look at it at two levels. One is just the technical dependencies and then we've been able to use augur data. So, we installed an augur instance to get social connections as well. So, we can take a look at like the people that are present in one you know say a focal project is what we'll call it as well as um any of the identified technically dependent projects one layer upstream. So you know Don if you were present in the focal project we can see based on our technical construction our dependency construction if you're present in any of say whatever the five projects that are upstream. So we are able to build these sociotechnical maps of projects with limitations, you know, like if the data is not available in depths.dev, then we just run into a problem. Um, and so it's it's working pretty well. And then once we can build that construction, we're able to kind of uh look back in time, you know, like say a six-month window or a three-month window or whatever the window is and see if there's any um predictability that was evident in that six-month window. So you know Don if you are present in both of the downstream and the upstream project what impact or if there's say you know 60% of the people are present in both projects does that have any say effect on the responsiveness of these projects. So we understand that say the responsiveness in this system is pretty solid. So yeah, I mean we are we can answer some of these questions or I think at least part build the maps at least from augur data but the dependencies the technical dependency stuff I don't think either of those either augur or grimmora lab provides that. >> Yeah and that was that was kind of some of the stuff that I was thinking about. So you know looking at you know for example like a lot of companies are looking at um you know CRA is is coming down the the pipe for those of you know those in Europe >> and um and that requires kind of a dependency level analysis that >> um yeah and so I'm I'm not saying we should change anything. I'm just I'm just curious if if there's maybe more we can do within chaos to maybe highlight some of you know some of maybe some of the ways that you've done some of the analysis with with augur um because I don't think that that's >> it's not really like we can't it's not native in like the visualizations in in 8 for example >> um so there's some some extra stuff that has to happen and I'm kind of wondering if that's something that would be useful for people. I you know I don't I don't know. But there's also lots of other types of analysis you know like like the you know geographical regions or there's a lot of stuff and people people kind of look at the chaos I have lots of weird conversations with people about the chaos project because they kind of look at us for like all metrics on on everything um related to related to open source and and all the data. They think we hold all of the data about all of the open source projects everywhere in the world. And so they're like, "Can't you just like run a run a thing and tell me, you know, where all the open source projects in China are?" Like, "No, we we don't we we just don't have that kind of data. That's not what we're that's not what we've been focused on." And I'm not saying we should I'm not saying we should have that data. I'm just I'm just curious Yeah. Yeah, I'm just curious if there's anything that we can do to help point people to maybe other things that do that or give them >> because there's like just the say a sociotechnical map that you can say here are the things that appear to be connected between technical dependencies and people like no nothing beyond that but here's a map of the things that you might be interested in. >> Yeah, I think that's something that some people would be interested in. Um, I think in a lot of cases I think they're not in some cases they're not really looking at people. They just want to know like what what projects and then I think in other cases people really want to know more about about the people who are behind them. >> Yeah. >> I think I think it just I think it just depends. I just you know people tend to think we have all the all the data and we really don't. And so I'm curious where other people have been drawing this line and whether there's something we should be doing differently. >> Okay. Um >> does um does compass do any of this? >> I don't think so. >> No, Compass is built on top of Grimmar Grimar Lab. So it has >> Okay. So just Okay. >> You have to you have to know which repositories and organizations you want to you you want data on before. >> Okay. Okay. Because I know that they did hold some data on some of the projects, but Okay. >> Yeah. And then, you know, the new SAS instances, both the one that that Sean runs and the one at at Red Hat, those um are kind of, you know, kind of getting to the point where they're helping solve this problem, at least for certain certain types of projects, like they have because of Red Hat's interest in the CNCF. I think they probably have most or all of the CNCF projects. So, you could probably pretty easily look at that as an ecosystem within, you know, at least the the Red Hat instance of Augur. Um but but there's lots of other other projects that they they don't have. They don't have all the projects uh in the world, nor should they. It would fall apart, I think, at that point. >> But I'm not looking for answers. We're not going to make a decision or anything about this. I was just it's just something I wanted people to think about. >> I mean, honestly, I think it's you could tell people I think it's a three-step process. So the first is to map the technical dependencies, which can be done from >> dubs.dev, >> and there are ways to to do that. The second is is that off of that technical map, you could map social dependencies if that's what you care about as well. >> And you know like the reason you might want to care about that kind of stuff is you want to understand your ability to influence your ability to have affect change like you know people matter in that system. >> Yep. >> Um and so that would be the second step if you want to do that. And then the third would be like what are the chaos metrics that you want to understand if they have predictive power in that in the system that you're taking a look at. So the individual project level metrics like do they change or are they affected by these different constructions. So that's how we've been treating it from a research perspective. Technical first, social second and then ask like sustainability related metrics questions >> third. Yeah, that's helpful. You know, I wonder I wonder if it might be good um for you all to do a maybe a blog post about that and just, you know, here's here's one way that you can approach this this type of analysis using some of the chaos tools. Maybe that would maybe that would help. >> Yeah, I don't think the that would just like kind of what I just said there. like here's your >> Yeah. super super high level like not I know you guys are publishing papers and so you can't go into the like the >> Yeah. Like I can't quite share the scripts yet probably just from a um but they'd be sharable once the paper's published you know. >> Yeah. But like you said at a high level you can these were the steps that we took and and this is how you might be able to do it. It would still they would still have to do all of that but >> Yeah. >> Yeah. That' be interesting. >> Okay. Yeah, >> that's a >> I think I think it's a great idea. First of all, I think looking at looking beyond the project level anymore is kind of important and understanding um the world where you live and the the things that you depend on >> is pretty critical. >> Anyone else have have thoughts on that? I googled augur because I don't know what it is and it's quite confusing. I found your GitHub repo but uh you guys love names that are common place not uh specific so it's it makes it difficult to research >> and there's another open source project called Augur that is something completely different. So did you find >> Ethereum right like blockchain? >> Yeah it's blockchain stuff. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I thought that's why I was like, you guys are not I'm not in another blockchain group, am I? Um, not that I have anything wrong with it. It's just too many crypto bros in my life. >> Yeah. And here's uh so the the Chaos Software page has links to the the sources of truth for for all of this >> software. Okay, cool. >> Might help. >> Um, yeah. >> I didn't know it existed. This is kind of interesting. I always wondered how you guys scraped Yep, there's a lot of GitHub API calls. >> Yep, I'm basically one of the more active maintainers of Augur currently. So, if you have questions about anything, let me know. I know we've already talked a lot. You still need to add me on Signal, by the way. >> I will. I uh joined the wrong Slack apparently. So, now I'm in the right Slack. So, I was looking for you in Slack, but >> Oh, did you join chaos.slack whatever instead of chaos-workspace.slack whatever? I joined the open futures slack, not the chaos slack, >> which is something that Emma Emma Irwin has been building. Yes. So, it's it's definitely in the same space. >> So, I can I can see the confusion. >> Yes. Very confusing. Um, but no, I'm in the 4,000 or 3,000 person Slack now. So, uh, yeah, I'll grab you your signal. >> Awesome. All right. Thanks. That was an interesting discussion. That was that was all I had. Thanks, Don, for bringing that up. Very cool. Um, looks like we don't have anything else on the agenda. Just two reminders about CFPs. So, if these are things you want to submit, then here are your deadlines and links to how to do that. So, both excellent conferences and yeah, you have you have a little bit of time, not a lot, but you have a little time to build that out. So, yeah. Anything else? We're a little early. Love it. Okay. Well, I'm going to stop sharing and I will let you all go. Um, enjoy the rest of your day and we'll see you around. Have a good one. Bye everybody., CHAOSS Weekly Community Call, Feb 24, 2026, YouTube, 01kp8h5403pe3fghzte2rer33e.