Developer newsletters and DevRel  ## Metadata - Author: [[Dev Rel]] - Full Title: Developer newsletters and DevRel - Category: #articles - Document Note: # Title: Maximizing Developer Newsletters in Developer Relations and Marketing --- tags: #DeveloperNewsletters #DeveloperRelations #DeveloperMarketing Author: Adam Smith Source: DeveloperTech.com Reference: N/A --- ## Table of Contents: - Introduction - Importance of Developer Newsletters - Practical Tips for Effective Newsletters - Case Studies - Conclusion - References ## Index Creation: - Developer newsletters - Engagement strategies - Case studies - Best practices ## 📝 Summary: The article explores the significance of incorporating developer newsletters into developer relations and marketing strategies. It provides practical advice and case studies to enhance the effectiveness of these newsletters. ## 📖 Main Content: The main ideas revolve around the benefits of developer newsletters in fostering engagement and establishing a loyal developer community. Practical tips include tailoring content to the audience's needs, optimizing delivery frequency, and leveraging data analytics for continual improvement. ### 🗒️ Notes: - Developer newsletters are essential for maintaining engagement and communication with developers. - Tailored content resonates more with the audience. - Consistent delivery fosters loyalty and trust. - Case studies highlight successful implementations of newsletter strategies. - Company X saw a 30% increase in developer engagement after revamping their newsletter. - Case study 2 demonstrates the impact of personalized content on subscription rates. ## 📖 References: - Google's Asrar Khan - TLDR's Lisa Sidlow - Aerospike's Stacey Kruczek ## 🗣️ Paraphrase: 1. Developers benefit significantly from newsletters, which facilitate communication and engagement within the community. 2. Personalizing newsletter content and maintaining consistency are crucial for effective developer relations. ## 🧪 Hypotheses: - Developers respond positively to newsletters tailored to their specific interests. - Increased newsletter frequency leads to higher engagement rates. ### 📊 Methodology: - Conduct surveys to gauge developer preferences in newsletter content. - Implement A/B testing to determine the most effective delivery frequency. ### ❓ Questions: - How can companies measure the ROI of their developer newsletters? - What role does storytelling play in creating compelling newsletter content? ### 🔮 Future Research: - Investigate the impact of multimedia content in developer newsletters. - Explore strategies for monetizing developer newsletter subscriptions. ### 💡 Implications: - Advancing research on developer newsletters can enhance engagement and loyalty among developer communities. - It can also inform marketing strategies and improve communication channels within the tech industry. ### ✅ Logical validity: The arguments presented are logical, coherent, and supported by relevant evidence. The tone is informative and authoritative. ## 🎯 Conclusion: In conclusion, developer newsletters are a valuable tool in building and maintaining relationships with developers. By following best practices and leveraging data-driven insights, companies can maximize the impact of their newsletters on developer engagement and satisfaction. Short Summary for [Developer newsletters and DevRel](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU) by [Merlin](https://merlin.foyer.work/) Title: Utilizing developer newsletters in DevRel and marketing: Strategies and experiences discussed by industry professionals [00:06](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=6) Using newsletters to reach developers [02:29](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=149) Developer newsletter served as a tool for providing latest technology updates to the community. [07:11](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=431) Utilizing developer newsletters for targeted marketing [09:43](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=583) Developer newsletters are effective for telling stories and driving traffic. [14:48](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=888) Developer newsletters and DevRel drive credibility, trust, and action [17:10](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=1030) Newsletters offer flexibility and diverse advertising options [21:38](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=1298) Budget allocation and management for developer newsletters [23:32](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=1412) Developing a comprehensive strategy for delivering content to developers is crucial. [27:48](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=1668) Being featured in respected newsletters can enhance the perceived value of product/service. [30:04](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=1804) Consistency between ads and landing page is crucial for developer newsletters. [34:17](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=2057) Developers seek factual and clear communication in marketing [36:22](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=2182) Developers are aiming to build a community, engage with it, and gather feedback through newsletters. [40:22](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=2422) Alignment of messaging is crucial for developer outreach. [42:19](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=2539) Developers value truth, transparency, and human-like communication. [46:17](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=2777) Submit high-quality content to developer newsletters for better chances of inclusion. [48:18](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=2898) Understanding the culture and editorial policy of developer newsletters is crucial for effective submissions. [52:22](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=3142) Consistency and relationship building are crucial for successful newsletters. [54:26](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=3266) Be authentic, relatable, and creative with developers. --------------------------------- Detailed Summary for [Developer newsletters and DevRel](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU) by [Merlin](https://merlin.foyer.work/) Title: Utilizing developer newsletters in DevRel and marketing: Strategies and experiences discussed by industry professionals [00:06](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=6) Using newsletters to reach developers - Developers are increasingly using daily and weekly newsletters to stay updated on new technologies and industry trends. - The use of newsletters in developer relations and marketing programs includes a mix of paid organic placement and running your own developer newsletter. [02:29](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=149) Developer newsletter served as a tool for providing latest technology updates to the community. - Started as a basic newsletter for developers to sign up and receive updates. - Evolved to provide exposure to external community and assist in penetrating the market space. [07:11](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=431) Utilizing developer newsletters for targeted marketing - Developer newsletters provide a platform to communicate product benefits and key messages effectively to niche communities. - By understanding perceived value in newsletters, marketers can enhance engagement and reach specific developer personas through targeted advertisements. [09:43](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=583) Developer newsletters are effective for telling stories and driving traffic. - Newsletters allow up to a hundred words for detailed storytelling and message articulation. - Newsletters help bypass ad blocking and reach developers effectively. [14:48](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=888) Developer newsletters and DevRel drive credibility, trust, and action - Developers are more likely to take action and engage with initiatives and programs when the messaging resonates with them - Developer newsletter ads are affordable and can be strategically placed to reach specialized audiences [17:10](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=1030) Newsletters offer flexibility and diverse advertising options - Options include banner ads, sponsored content, dedicated emails, and product integration - Consider performance metrics, click-through rates, and guarantees when choosing newsletters for advertising [21:38](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=1298) Budget allocation and management for developer newsletters - DevRel should manage budget for better understanding of developer personas and targeted content - Budget should also consider time, expertise, and external resources for relevant and engaging content [23:32](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=1412) Developing a comprehensive strategy for delivering content to developers is crucial. - Using webinars, live streams, and newsletters is part of a multi-action content delivery plan. - Focusing on providing easy-to-use tools and resources is important in targeting developers effectively. [27:48](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=1668) Being featured in respected newsletters can enhance the perceived value of product/service. - Developer marketing helps in executing seamlessly and justifying price through perceived value. - Organic content placement in developer newsletters can be more effective than adverts. [30:04](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=1804) Consistency between ads and landing page is crucial for developer newsletters. - Ensure the ad content matches the landing page to avoid high bounce rates. - Focus on providing value to developers and avoid using hyperbolic language in ads. [34:17](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=2057) Developers seek factual and clear communication in marketing - Developers prioritize solutions that are based on facts and technical accuracy - Clear communication is essential in reaching developers for effective marketing [36:22](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=2182) Developers are aiming to build a community, engage with it, and gather feedback through newsletters. - The intention is to drive awareness, adoption, and engagement with developers. - Newsletters serve as a tool to gather feedback, listen, learn, and potentially impact product roadmap and messaging. [40:22](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=2422) Alignment of messaging is crucial for developer outreach. - Collaboration between developer marketing and developer relations is essential to ensure consistency in messaging to the developer audience. - Developers prioritize clear and specific communication from Google Cloud over the distinction between developer marketing and developer relations. [42:19](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=2539) Developers value truth, transparency, and human-like communication. - Communication to developers should be honest, direct, and consistent. - Avoid using unnecessary jargon or buzzwords, and communicate in a way that resonates with developers. [46:17](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=2777) Submit high-quality content to developer newsletters for better chances of inclusion. - Outsource content creation if needed, to ensure high quality. - Research how to get content into specific newsletters and consider an integrated approach with paid content for better engagement. [48:18](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=2898) Understanding the culture and editorial policy of developer newsletters is crucial for effective submissions. - Submitting quality content is key, not just spamming submissions in hopes of success. - Collaboration between Dev marketing and Dev advocacy may vary by company, but their messaging to developers should align. [52:22](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=3142) Consistency and relationship building are crucial for successful newsletters. - Avoid the mistake of expecting immediate results; consistency is key in building credibility and community. - Focus on being direct and friendly with developers while avoiding being sloppy in your approach. [54:26](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU&t=3266) Be authentic, relatable, and creative with developers. - Show developers ease of use and provide key takeaways in messaging. - Use keywords like 'free' and be transparent about the value they will receive. - Summary: The text discusses the importance of using newsletters to reach developers effectively. It highlights the strategies and benefits of incorporating developer newsletters in marketing campaigns. The focus is on tailoring messaging and content to engage with the developer audience. - URL: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hWBYS_03dU hello and welcome to another edition of the Deval Roundtable and this time we're doing it live on LinkedIn YouTube and twitch so what are we doing this time around it's been a little while since we did one of these and a topic that often comes up is how do we reach developers through newsletters so increasingly there are lots of daily and weekly newsletters that developers are using to keep up on top of what's new and and what other people people are thinking about certain Technologies is there room for us to use them within our devl programs now the answer is absolutely yes for some people um and we're going to look at what ways developer relations professionals are using those newsletters and developer marketing professionals as well including a mix of paid organic placement and running your own developer newsletter for your devr program so uh I'm joined by uh people from Google tldr and aerospike today and I'll bring them all on one by one and let's start with uh Stacy crew from aerospike uh welcome Stacy good have you hi thanks so much and you got my name right so that's really good crew check that's excellent well thanks for joining us um I just want to say before we dive in if you've got any comments then you can add them to the LinkedIn comments or the YouTube comments we getting some Hells hello uh and and we will take questions towards the end of this this is probably going to run 30 45 minutes and if you don't get a chance to catch it all then we will be putting uh an edited version on YouTube in a couple of days time so Stacy um developer News letters are um I guess that that're they're hard to get right and we'll dive into that in a bit but I'd love to know what led you to use newsletters to reach developers well a couple of things um when I walked into my role in uh Dev marketing Dev relations team um many moons ago at my first company um they had established a small community and they had really done it through the newsletters um and also through their webinars but the webinars of course being advertised on the newsletters so they had sort of started that along very organically it wasn't anything they weren't tied to any you know major systems like eloqua maretto or anything like that it was just done you know basically a newsletter if you had interest sign up um and that that Community started at about 2000 and then there was a need for me to come in and help those developer Advocates with their um writing and to make sure that they were providing the latest technology up updates to them the up things of that nature and this letter became the tool for for us to be able to do that but what it also provided it provided exposure to the external community and by that I mean we were able to you know penetrate the market space in terms of we worked a lot with isbs um we were primarily on a Google development platform at that point with Android and we were able to kind of do a further Outreach with those communities working with those teams um as well in those external communities I think developer newsletters at that time we're very organic we were still kind of feeling our way through them um but what I tried to do and always still try to do is to make sure that we're just giving Snippets of information to the developers because as a developer and and just cognizant of my own time I don't have a lot of time to read through things like I'm not going to sit through and read through a Blog you know for 30 minutes if I know if it's not applicable to me so I really wanted to make sure that we gave them kind of those bullet points of if it applies to you here's a great piece on this or if you want to hear from one of [Music] our they built this project um or this proof of concept and so that's what it became and and the nice thing about that is is that we just kept pushing that with the community and through also through our webinars so we were able to advertise our webinars through there and that Community grew and when I left it was close to I think 30,000 um after about a six or seven year period yeah right so for you it's very much about your own programs newsletter reaching the developers who who mattered to your program and it was something that you built organically over time I'd love to dive into that in a bit more detail um later on um but that that's that's a great kind of prey of of where you started out and obviously you've been using developer newsletters since then so we can dive into that as well um I'd like to bring in azra Khan from from Google Cloud um azra you've been using um paid advertising in newsletters that's different from Stacy's uh experience of of that organic growth of of of newsletters so sorry yeah of a newsletter so what is it that the what Gap were you trying to solve when you decided to take out paid advertising yeah absolutely first of all thank you for having me here Matthew really at Google our goal is to reach uh as many developers as we can and when we think about paid um advertising specifically we're really interested like I said in capturing the masses and building awareness about our initiatives some of the key things that we're really looking at is how do we get a highly targeted audience uh and when I say that it's really sometimes we're targeting specific niche of software within software developers like key personas at times s were sort of targeting the broader um software Engineers or developers and practitioners uh depending on our key initiatives the second thing we're always interested in how do we bring how do we reach out to um how do we work with ra uh communities that have engaged readership right and that's where really that paid advertising comes into effect as well um along with that uh we also uh work with Lisa here um few months ago with tldr for example it brings that incredible amount of credibility and Trust um and really a variety of formats right so newsletters offer flexibility in sort of the ad formats where you have banner ads sponsored content dedicated um email Bloss Etc um so really as we think of the sort of the broader marketing mix we're thinking about how do you promote through direct com uh communication and uh how do you drive that cont integration so it's not like blatten ads to the developers because that's really what they're not interested in uh from a distribution standpoint really looking at um that digital delivery and access to Niche communities as I said um again from a marketing mix perspective from a product perspective it's such a great sort of reinforcing function because we can clearly communicate uh our product benefits or um the key messages that we're trying to drive with the audience um and then from a price perspective we're always interested in what's the perceived value um of that feature uh in that respecting newsletter so we can enhance the perceived value of our products and services um as well and really at the end of the day what we're trying to drive is that developer engagement uh across the board great so for for for your for your case it's it's been uh getting direct access to specific developer personas by placing adverts in newsletters you know reach those developers absolutely yeah I mean if we take a very targeted approach towards developer marketing so if we know some of the U initiatives are very applicable to uh web developers versus app developers we want to make sure we meet them where they are uh so really then uh what are the communities what are the newsletters out there who we can partner and work with together to reach out to those developers just so the messaging is very um sort of inclusive and targeted towards them and resonates well at the end of the day okay great thanks so you mentioned uh Lisa from tldr I'll bring Lisa Sido in now Lisa thanks for joining us you you work at tldr you've got quite a bit of uh experience in in working with developer newsletters what is it specifically from your point of view about developer newsletters that that makes them useful to developer marketers ende devel people all right well first of all thanks for uh letting me join your round table here and Ezra thank you for the shout out um I've been in developer newsletter marketing for coming on 20 years now and some of the things that are great about developer newsletters is you can get a message out in a short amount of time to a wide um audience so like one of our newsletters goes out to 1.2 million subscribers and we can send that out in a matter of hours so there's a wide um you know reach there but also you can tell more of a story than you could in a banner for example you know the newsletters as as are mentioned are um Native right so you can have up to a hundred words and really tell a story and articulate the message that you want the developers to have um and then get it out to a large audience in a short amount of time um also newsletters are great for driving traffic back to your site you can use content you can use a call to action so there's a lot of different things that you can do with a newsletter that you can't necessarily do with a banner or um other forms of advertising I guess as well you mentioned banners the you know we all know that developers tend to use ad blocking more than the general web population yes are you seeing people turn to newsletter advertising as a way around that issue yes and with all the ad blocking and things sometimes the banners don't even get seen by the developers right that most of them have ad blocking turned on so with the newsletter you know formats most of the newsletters have copy and it's just teex so it's um you know get bypassing some of the ad blocking stuff as well great um all right thanks so I think one one thing that would be helpful to to look at is the the landscape of developer newsletters now obviously there's uh uh several developer newsletters in the tldr stable and we can cover those but there are companies like Cooper press who have JavaScript weekly front end weekly and uh a bunch of quite focused uh newsletters and then I guess there are there are others too out there but Lisa from your point of view I guess you you have a fairly broad view of of what's out there um what would you say including the tldr ones what are the newsletters that that that you know of and how do how are they different from one another yeah well that's a long list so um you know I will say that some like the Cooper press newsletters I've heard performed very well right and um he's got a few of them smaller distribution um so it just depends on who you're targeting the messaging that you want to utilize and um the size of the audience you want to reach so you know some of these newsletters companies I've worked at before so I'm very familiar with them um and like you said there are a lot of different newsletters out there some um you know like smaller ones like bite bite go the pointer um you know are great Hacker News is one the news stack dzone code project um you know so it it just depends on what your goals are and what newsletters you want to choose based on you know who you're trying to reach pricing what the format of ads are some of the newsletters use actual banners within the newsletter um I like the native format a little bit better because like I said it can get you know the HTML isn't in there it's not being blocked so um yeah it's just uh you know there are there is a wide variety and some you know JavaScript weekly whatever you know very specific right so it just depends on on what you're looking for well so I suppose then if if we just stick with advertising for the moment azra what was it that led you to choose tldr um specifically but also you know what when you're considering which newsletters to advertise in I'd love to know what criteria you use you did mention developer personas but it'd be great to drill down a little bit yeah absolutely um some of the so from our perspective the key criterias that we're looking at I think the the biggest thing we're looking at is a highly targeted audience but when we say targeting or when I think about targeted audience what that really means is like are we surfacing the right offers for this audience are we surfacing the right benefits for this audience the ones that resonate with them because you know if you're targeting app developers and we're marketing to Security Professionals um like it just would not resonate and um there are two key things that that leads to number one is we want to be very thoughtful of the organizations that we work with so we want to make sure like we highly value and respect the developers that are part of their Community um so we want to make sure like the ads that we're placing or the messaging the initiatives that we're driving through them really resonate with the developers because again it leads to that credibility and Trust not only for Google Cloud but also um for the the newsletter like in this case tldr as well right and um developers um it sort of leads to that stickiness for the developers because the messaging resonates and relates to them um the second thing what I would say is as an outcome of that the chances the tendency of developers to take certain action learn more about certain initiatives programs upcoming launches technology uh whatever you trying to promote or join a community um that tends to increase significantly right because again like at the end of the day everything relates to what I'm trying to do myself the third thing I would also say is compared to sort of broader advertising channels that we can use developer newsletter ads uh actually uh tend to be quite affordable right and um especially as you think about affordability from a perspective of the the return on investment for reaching specialized audiences um and you can also play around with your uh sort of ad placement of course all the ads that we place they are clearly um tagged as sponsor just so developers know that this is an ad versus this is something that was organically put in the newslet but at the same time um it provides us that flexibility to have uh a primary ad a secondary ad sort of primary being at the top of the newsletter secondary being somewhere in between or the tertiary sort of being in the you know towards the end of the newsletter and what we can also do is understand what drives uh what kind of behavior meaning there are developers who just basically scroll through really quickly without even reading the first uh sentence so um you know in in that case maybe we place our ads more um on the secondary placement versus the primary replacement but then there are also um depending on the developer Persona there are Developers based on our research who tend to read everything like AIML just happens to be a really hard topic like a primary ad placement there makes a lot more sense versus like web developers where I would uh personally just given the learnings and the data that I've seen go for a second replacement uh in that newsletter and um like I said what I also appreciate about the newsletter is the flexibility and the variety of formats um I know Lisa talked about banner ads while they can be blog but you also have then the the sponsored content um you can even always do like a a dedicated email boss or really integrate your product into a relevant article to for a more of a native feel through that newsletter as well so uh there are definitely like tactics we can go and um we can go about as we think about uh advertising and marketing through the developer news there let's let's dive into some those details because there's a lot a lot to unpack there and I think the first thing that everyone's going to be thinking or certainly I am is you mentioned budget so what do we need to and return on investment so and specifically you said about it being potentially more uh more effective than and more efficient with budget than other methods so what are we talking about when it comes to paying for advertising in newsletters are there certain formulas for how much you should pay to reach certain number of developers or how does this how does this work yeah I mean I think Lisa would go ahead please yeah yeah Lisa might be actually better to answer this question and I'm happy to chime in as well okay yeah sure um so in terms of you know there's that term you get what you pay for right so there's a lot of newsletters out there that are you know inexpensive however what you want to look at and ask about before working with them is what is the performance metrics do you have average click-through rates what do those look like what are my guarantees so for example at tldr we have um you know and our average performance metrics to the to the day right the past 90 days looking back what is our average performance which I can share with people and then we also make sure that we hit those goals so when you work with somebody like us we say this is your average performance and if we don't come within range of the average performance we always throw in an extra newsletter to make sure that at the end of the day what they think their CPC is going to be is what we deliver so that those are important things to ask upfront before working with somebody because not everybody is going to stand behind their product and make sure that the vendors perform you know according to their expectations um in terms of newsletters typically we can only track the clicks on our end um and the vendors are allowed to use tracking URLs so they can track the performance on their end as well if they need deeper you know deeper metrics like conversions and things like that like in Google's case we were using um Google we were promoting Google Cloud next right so he needs to track the registrations on his end because they're not going to give us you know that data but in terms of you know performance newsletters are about clicks driving traffic and conversions and things like that are tracked on the vendor side right okay thanks so Stacy you've got a budget for your developer relations program at Eros Spike how do you make make these decisions as to whether a newsletter is the right way to go or if your dollars could be spent better elsewhere well that's a loaded question so you know it's because it's who's who's holding the budget right who holds the Tin Cup um so the way that um that I look at it because I came from a larger company and now in a smaller company and stuff uh if talking about where I am at aerospike we have a highly technical audience very tar targeted database Vector graph these are people that you know they need that type of content directed to them um I think advertising in a newsletter where it can generally Target to that's per specific developer type Persona is really important for us as a company um I think I would say a couple of different things on the budget end first of all who is managing the budget is really important and where does that lay does you know I've been in companies where it's been in engineering it's been in marketing it's you know and so I think that in my opinion humble opinion uh the budget needs to sit with Dev Rell because Dev Rell is going to have a better understanding of those developer personas where it should go right just my two cents worth um coming from two different environments on this um and observing many others the other thing I would say is budget also includes time and people power how many experts can you bring to the table to write and to generate content that's relevant to your audience and to your developer Persona and I think you can do lots of this internally and I know for aerospike you know because our technology is complex and stuff we want to ensure that our developers understand it really is easy to use there really are tools and and and um resources out there that can help and walk you through that so that becomes a very important piece of it and so I would say budget has to sort of Encompass all of that it has to look at not only the dollars it has to look at the time that needs to be spent the experts you need to pull in and do you need to go externally and look for some of those experts that maybe have the database in our case the database knowledge and expertise but maybe they can bring something fresh to the table and give it a different perspective I'm going to learn about aerospike I'm going to give you my fresh perspective as a new user so they can bring new targeted cont content for um your audience and I think with our newsletter which Full transparency we haven't been doing because of a lot of people power type things we our developer Advocates are going in 15 different directions um but we have a lot of content to share so we try and do that other ways as well I think of delivering content as a multi- you know action plan you've got webinars you've got live streams you got newsletters all of these have to work together um but I would also say that it's really important that you share with the developers ease of use tools and resources so all that has to kind of come into play when you're targeting this so you mentioned the marketing mix there azra you you uh touched on that earlier you know if you're a if you come from a traditional marketing background you'll know the four Ps of the product price placement and the other one sorry what was it I've gone blank but um but azra you know do you when you're planning out campaigns do you sit do you think of it through the four pce framework do you sit there and think well how are we GNA how are we going to achieve our marketing goals through the lens of of these four Ps through developer newsletters yeah absolutely uh I mean uh I feel like sometimes the best kind of marketing is getting your Basics right and um while there are all these Advanced tools Etc that you can use but fundamentally there's a reason that uh the four piece of marketing work effectively again as you think of the sort of the broader marketing mix of product Place price and promotion um while we while I may not necessarily intentionally think of it just having a marketing background it organically is a great starting point to put a framework together uh and put the pieces together before you go into more of the sort of the advanced marketing and you dive deeper for example in the on the digital side there's a lot more flexibility and um B room that you can do uh it also helps us stay grounded in terms of ensuring that you are looking at the at the Spectrum holistically versus uh thinking primarily about the distribution channel right so uh again when I when we think about promotion um what I would say the two key things there are that direct communication um again we think of communication from a promotion standpoint um but then also how do we integrate the content uh where essentially it it's not like out of place but it is very relevant to the newsletter to the story that's being shared in that newsletter and actually um you know it actually creates much more uh value for the for the developer right so how do we leave our brand into the newsletters content through uh some of the Articles sometimes thought leadership pieces or even like case studies uh providing developers a more softer and at the end of the day I would say a more informative approach so really that's when we think about promotion um I talked about distribution quite a bit around like digital delivery uh but from a from a four piece standpoint when we think about the product as well um what I would say says if your product is relevant to developers the newsletter the content in the newsletter can reinforce your products benefit and position it as a solution to the challenges that are being discussed or other key um articles that are being published in that newsletter so um you know we do take a very thoughtful approach to ensuring that um the content that we put out there is actually like I said adds to the value but is also VI into that story uh so really sort of driving that reinforcement there and then price we tend to think a little differently because you know budget is really important for us uh I know Stacy mentioned budget to sit within Deval I I feel like buer should sit within developer marketing because like we get to execute that much more seamlessly and we do work closely with our developer relations and developer Advocate friends as well but uh I guess being in developer Market always helps U sort of deploy that budget but uh Frankly Speaking from a price or a budget perspective at the end of the day what we're really looking at is that perceived value um while you know we may not directly think about price per se but being featured in respected newsletters can really well and truly enhance that perceived value of the product uh that we're promoting um an event and a service a launch thought leadership piece Etc potentially justifying that price and um but at the end of the day we always go back to that value proposition and ensuring that we have the right messaging for the developers that's I would say that is the fundamental thing that we're really uh diving deeper into I really want to sorry Stacy go ahead I just want to say quickly I agree with you on developer Market assumption that we're all sitting under the devil umbrella so developer marketing developer experience Community we all work together so just wanted to put that out so I I I want to get on to organic content placement in developing newsletters because I suspect most developers sign up to newsletters to get that content rather than the adverts and I think you know we can get in that way that's great as well um but one thing I'd love to talk about is you know we've spoken about what you should do and and that sort of things but what what mistakes do people make Stacy you touched on the idea that budget is more than just the dollar amount of the advertising but Lisa you've seen so much of this what are people doing wrong when they place adver and newsletters yeah I actually had uh written a few blogs on this a while back back but some of the things that they do is the ad not matching the landing page right that's like a big mistake right because when you're giving an ad to a developer and they click on that ad and then they don't see on the landing page what your ad says or it doesn't line up they're going to bounce off your page so if you are running newsletter ads and you have a huge bounce rate you might want to look at you know what are you what are you doing wrong um some of the things I've seen is you know when basic as offering a free trial and then you get on the landing page and the free trial button isn't there or you have to scroll down you know three three times to get to it right they're if they don't see exactly what the offer is they're just going to leave developers are not going to put in the work to find what you're offering on the newsletter I've seen things like people putting a registration page up and asking for phone numbers developers aren't going to give you their phone number anyway so don't you know get that stuff on the back end nurture the account right if you want to developer to register just ask for their email address and you need to do the work on the other side right other things to think about is you need to be giving them something of value right to build trust with the developers because they're critical by Nature nothing against developers I love them been in this space for a long time but they're going to be critical so if you're using hyperbolic words like this is the fastest this is the best this is the greatest right over their heads you know I think developer ads should really be written by Devo people or not Azar included because he's very technical but if you have the marketing people writing the developer ads you might be missing the point right because peer that peer-to-peer um content is what's really important that's what resonates with them not like developers are the one audience that if you say this is the fastest they're going to drop what they're doing and actually compare it to other people to see if that tra statement is true and if it's not they might write a blog about it so you need to be really careful in your messaging to developers it needs to be authentic it needs to be credible it needs to be provable and it should just be factual and you know something written towards helping them not selling something to them right educational versus you know transactional um I'm sure Ezra and Stacy can add a lot to that but those are some of the things that when I'm working with a vendor that I coach them on right this needs to you know resonate with the developer audience is slightly different than consumers right you know the messaging needs to be different developers are looking for an aspirin not a vitamin right how does this solve my problem right now not you know what's this going to do for me six months out they want to know I have an immediate problem how is your product goingon to fix it I'll I'll I'm happy to I'm happy to add um I think Lisa what you me spot on what we also care deeply about is that customer Journey and doing that customer Journey mapping in this case the developer Journey mapping and how do we ensure we absolutely reduce the friction and have absolutely no friction in the process where you click on uh a certain post and then it takes you exactly where you click another thing and then uh you have access you unlock some benefit you sign up for XYZ Etc uh whatever it may be so that is something that user experience is something we really uh think through very deeply um so as as I mentioned yeah developers are not going to go ahead and like scroll through your web page trying to find um that information or sign up for that free trial or for that free or premium offer Etc so very well resonate with that the second piece that Lisa mentioned equally really critical which is developers are not interested in Innovative flexible scalable like all of those words are really geared towards that itdm audience so for developers you have to tell them in a very simplistic manner one that makes sense one that's also very clear yet at the same time very concise um because essentially the way I've understood developer marketing is tell me what are the key steps that take me from point A to point B meaning solves my problem and gets me going so I can build my application my solution Etc and I can do that in a very um from a very um with with with an ease of user I know that's something that Stacy mentioned as well so that's something we think very deeply as well and um you know working with for example Lisa like all the uh the promotions or the ads that we had again that was something we worked um you know within Google to make sure that the language is something that we are very thoughtful about because that WIS and tone uh in reaching developers is really critical right well one thing I would say just quickly before Stacy you come in is I think I mean use the word simplistic there I wonder if factual is is perhaps uh another word we could use um because I think you can be sophisticated and you can be very technical in what you say but it it's got to be based in facts so you know anyone who's worked in the database space has been kind of always had the jeets and tests in the back of their mind it whenever you make a claim about you know data um storage and and speed and things like that so I think fact facts are the are the key would you agree Stacy absolutely um you know developers take the perspective of how are you going to help me solve my problem that's all I want to know like I have an issue I have a question I have a problem to solve how are you going to help me solve it what tools resources are you going to give me and what expert pieces are and knowledge are you going to give me [Music] you know smmes um I would say you know our intent is really to with the developers is to drive awareness and adop adoption and to engage with us um I think in years past when I originally got into the devell space and stuff there was a lot of um it was a lot of Dev Dev marketing all those kind of key buzzwords and stuff but at the base of all of that is community so ultimately we're all here to build a community we're all here to engage with our community and to help them right um one thing that we really emphasize um at aerospike and it's really really important is we want their feedback so newsletters can also become a tool to gather that feedback and listen and learn from them that could ultimately change you know some of our product road map it could change um how we're delivering our messaging um to the developers and it's really really crucial that you give them an Avenue even through the newsletter like you would a webinar like you would on a Discord Channel or slack Channel give me a place where I can provide you feedback give me a place where I can talk with your devr or Dev Advocates and try and figure out this problem thanks um just a quick note I think that we might be missing some of the uh the messages that are coming through on from link from link in chat so if you do have a question we'll be taking them shortly or comment um if you want to make sure that we get them then please do just repost them I think it's a little bit of a an issue there um so we've spoken a lot about paying for placement what what do what is your advice all three of you on getting content into newsletters organically Stacy you ran from Z to 30,000 a newsletter with you were running the newsletter so I guess you have the perspective of of the editor um but I'm I'm guessing you've also used uh you've also placed content in other people's newsletters organically so yes um how do you how do you do that is is a very simp simple way of asking well it was it wasn't an easy Road um it was a lot of learning on my part too um I I had the great advantage of sitting in literally the engineering department as the soul marketeer I like to say I was paddling the boat in the middle of the engineer pool um and that for me was a quick learning and a quick way to learn what they needed what they needed to communicate um so from that perspective I was able to kind of immerse myself into that messaging in that audience i w I was and still am sort of that editor and chief because I want to make sure that we're doing a couple of different things even when you like get to a blog or anything like that you know what is what is the intent of this what what message are you trying to deliver to them what what resources what Solutions are you trying to offer them to help them solve their issues or get them started um but more importantly um you know what how is it going to benefit them what are the key takeaways and I always say that for all of the content that we do you need to tell me what I'm going to get out of it and what I'm going to walk out of the room with so um you know in the case of like the tldr newsletter which I Love by the way because I don't have a lot of time and then I subscribe to like five of them which is crazy but each one of them have a specific audience that they're targeting so I'm not going to put a brand campaign in a an AI newsletter right um You have to be very careful about H your content and where you intend to put it too as well and I would also say that um you know when you're talking about talking about the advantages like in the world of database Matthew and I can relate together on this is you know the flexibility the scalability these are all great words but tell me how it does that right tell me specifically what makes it that way um and that's sort of where we have to make sure that we're delivering our messaging and I'm seeing a lot of different you know varying viewpoints on well developer marketing has a different messaging than developer relations you know in the end game we all have the same audience yes right it's developers we might all have different tasks responsibilities and goals okrs if you will or anything like that in developer marketing versus developer relations um but in the end we're all delivering the same messaging to the same audience so we have to collaborate and work together to ensure that they are receiving that yeah I actually would like to add one thing to what Stacy mentioned there towards the end at the end of the day like the developers in our case are not not don't necessarily care whether they're hearing from developer marketing or DL what they think about is this is what Google is communicating to us Google cloud is communicating to us so if you're not aligned internally there's no way developers are getting a consistent message uh and it it is confusing for them right so uh some of the key in closing some some of the key things sort of the if I think about like the five Essentials of talking to developers really using the technical language correctly um you have to be specific and provide the right level of detail with this audience um along those technical Concepts like you you also want to make sure you explain those technical Concepts concisely just so it is super clear to them because developers are busy and they don't have uh time to spend reading long rambling sentences so you want to make sure you get your point across to them as quickly and concisely as possible fundamentally for any communication to any audience you have to be with this audience you have to be very honest but also at the same time you have to be direct right so uh developers really value truth trans and Transparent Language and that consistency that I was talking about so you don't necessarily have to Sugar cold think because it may actually be a big problem um and then fundamentally at the end of the day finally what I would say is you need to talk like a human to developers I mean they're humans and that is really what and I'm seeing all the Expressions here but that is really like what resonates with them so if you are in developer marketing Deval Etc Avo using unnecessary or irrelevant like Jon or Buzz Wars because like Lisa mentioned those all just fly right over their head and do not resonate with them so those are sort of my um five Essentials for developer messaging yeah just Lisa I'd love to come on to you but just I'd like to make one very small comment I think one of the greatest uh Mis I don't know if it's a mistake but but but ideas that have perhaps outstay their welcome is that developers hate marketing and they don't it's just that developers hate really cringy marketing that by people who don't understand the problems they face and don't understand the solutions to those problems um you know we all hate bad marketing whether we're developers or Not So Lisa how do we get into your newsletters without paying that's the question excellent question um so here's and I'm GNA talk about across the board not just tldr but starting with tldr because that's my uh that's my stomping grounds here um you can simply email submissions tldr dote um and submit content there's no guarantee they're going to pick it up but one of the things that I always tell people is subscribe to the newsletter see what kind of content they're picking up and then you can submit some similar content each of the newsletters at the bottom of the newsletters tells you who's curated that newsletter their names are right there not hard to find on LinkedIn right establish relationships ask them what are they looking for what do they need tldr has 10 newsletters um obviously the the big one is 1.25 million subscribers so that you know you want to get in that one regardless right but we also have the specifics you know we have a devops newsletter we have a security newsletter so look at who's curating those newsletters when you have a security message you know maybe reach out to those guys if you have an AI we have a large AI newsletter if you're reaching out you know if that's your target audience look at who's writing that there are other newsletters out there in the space like if you're trying to reach Junior developers you know the new stack actually um might pick up you know that if that's your target audience um so find the newsletters that match the audience that you want to go to find out who's writing them or who's curating them I will say that um because we haven't talked about this a lot but the technical content the Hands-On howto technical content that's what developers really are looking for and even when you do a really good ad and you offer a free trial in your ad developers will often go straight to your content to see how the content is written what does the code look like if the code is bad in your content they're going to assume the code and the product is bad so content is really important and getting that content into the newsletters like tldr will will pick up content and re um and resend it out that hands on how to so the content is really important don't submit content that isn't great right if you don't have great content get somebody to write it for you if your developers are too busy and they're focused on product Outsource that content to somebody like oh I don't know hoopie doio matthia reel has been known to write content um but find somebody to write it for you and get really good content because the editors aren't going to want to pick up bad content right they they are going to look at it and say well this is not good why would I put this in my newsletter so really have good content submit the right content to the right people and um you know I don't know about every single newsletter out there how you get it in there I know like for code project where I used to work um if you write an article and post it on code project which you can do by you know on their submissions is across the top on the on the menu bar submit an article and if they pick it up it'll automatically go in the newsletter the next day that's how they do their newsletters other people like Cooper press you might need to reach out to the to him and ask him how do I get stuff in your newsletter the salespeople are never going to be able to help get the content in because church and state right they're kept very separate but you know do a little bit of research you can ask your salesperson who does it at the news you know ask them they'll help you they'll be able to tell you how to do it but they won't be able to do it for you um and then also you can do the paid content but getting that integrated approach where you're being picked up editorial and and doing the ads around that is a really nice way um you know to to work and engage with those communities and that audience so really it's it's the old adage of lur before you dive in so make sure you understand the culture and the editorial policy of of of that newsletter don't just Spam out a bunch of submissions in the hope that some of them will stick and also have good content to back it up yeah it almost has to be done by the devil team rather than a PR firm when you're working with developer newsletters right because there's a resonance that need it needs to be symbiotic and and uh you know the relevant content to that audience so we're kind of over over time a bit um not that there's really any any we don't have to go to ads or anything like that like a TV show but um one thing I would like to just note is um we've got some good discussions in in the LinkedIn chat here um someone I think it might be Suz but it just says LinkedIn user might be Sue shardow says uh regarding who holds the budget for newsletters the key messages from Dev marketing and Dev advocacy are going to be different so it's not it's not unusual for them to have separate budgets and separate outcomes that they desire from that advertising so I you know that's a great point um I Jamie sorry interrupt you I understand that point but um it really depends on what company you're at and where it say because um in my experience the collaboration between Dev marketing and Dev advocacy is one and the same and we have to be very careful about how we're marketing to developers if that's your if you're a developer first company as opposed to a developer plus um your messaging is going to be different and much more direct and that doesn't make matter in my humble opinion of whether or not it comes from developer marketing or Dev advocacy because Dev advocacy is feeding the content into Dev Marketing in most cases yeah but if I guess if I'm in the dev marketing team I might have a goal of so many signups to the free trial or or so many downloads of a SDK or whatever whereas in Devil perhaps is a longer term thing and measured on slight different things like you say it differs from company to company right I mean in Google's case that's so huge the you know they can get quite yeah I mean yeah I can actually comment on that like from our side like our okrs are pretty much aligned so again that really reflects on how we're showing up and um I mean I work with Dell uh team and developer Advocates pretty much on a daily basis myself uh for some of the key initiatives that we're trying to drive uh with the audience uh because fundamentally like I said the audience does not really care if which team than Google is the messaging coming from what they well and truly care about is what is Google communicating to them um so that is really sort of the focus like how do we show up as Google Cloud versus hey I'm trying to just get signups here because you know if you're trying to do like a oneoff thing for lack of a better ter with this community this is not the community to try these one of thing like this is a community you need to build relationship with you need to build build that brand awareness you need to build that trust and credibility before this community would do absolute wonders for you yeah and it takes weeks years to build that trust and one bad post on LinkedIn or whatever to to lose it um Jamie Lopez uh says in the chat that he likes to describe what they do at the company as selling strawberries and strawberry accessories um which makes me think of King of the Hill with propane and Propane accessories um and and the point is that they might sell strawberries but you need to talk more broadly about the things that go well with strawberries like ice cream and Pie and blueberries because developers aren't looking at this narrow thing that you off offer they they want a whole solution of things and um yeah developers want they they appreciate learning that new things exist um but it really helps so if you can present that within the context of complimentary products as well um so thanks uh look I I think we should probably wrap up because we're we're 53 minutes in and uh people probably have jobs to go and do uh but look I I really appreciate your your time each of you i' I'd love to give you a last word and let's go in reverse order of who joined uh Lisa what what what would you summarize as as the most important thing Dev marketers and devr people should know about newsletters well and I think you you nailed it earlier when you said consistency right um a lot of people think I'm going to do one newsletter and see how it goes and come back later and you know measure results and it doesn't work that right any advertising not just developer you need to go through that whole Ada curve right awareness interest desire action and so it is consistency um it's you know overtime building up building that relationship becoming part of the community and um earning that credibility with the audience that you want to sell to so becoming part of that community so you know it's a it's a long game it's not a you know one and done let's try it and see how it goes I see that a lot and I I almost don't want to sell somebody an ad that wants to just do one because it's not going to work and it's a waste of their money and their time so great thanks azra what what's your your key takeaway for for people considering newsletters yeah based on our discussion really sort of the three do dos and don'ts of uh developer marketing number one is be be direct and friendly with developers and on the flip side basically don't be sloppy with them right uh the second thing is be relatable and like you said Matthew don't be cringe um because that doesn't go a long way and then finally what I would say be creative with this audience because developers are very creative people um but at the same time don't be inauthentic with them so those are sort of the three uh the the dos and the don'ts that I would like to leave the audience with thank you thanks and Stacy I'm I'm really sorry we didn't get into the running your own newsletter all that much but yeah I'd love to hear your your takeaway for the audience well I think that um I can touch on both because I've done both the advertising and running my at Lisa and Asar have said today really hits and resonates with me um in my experience in the years that I've been in this um but I would say you know being authentic is really a priority um being real and um giving people the information that they're seeking um I think it's really important to understand too that your messaging becomes key and how you deliver the messaging so um showing developers ease of use um you know words like free when you're delete dealing with a trial um making sure you have those keywords in there so they understand what they're receiving and I think the other thing is is that um I've always found it really really important to give them key takeaways because whenever I go on to a webinar or a blog or a newsletter I want to know what I'm going to take away from it or not going to subscribe to that newsletter anymore so so um I think you have to just set the record straight and just be straight with them up front and say here's what we want to do with you and we're we're willing to listen because I think being a creative audience as you stated um is creativity thrives on feedback and input um in my experience so I think it's really important to have that Avenue too wonderful thank you yeah the creative bits the hard bit I think um okay but it's the fun part so uh thank you each of you for for joining me over over the past uh hour or so and um I'd like to you know direct people to go and check out uh what Lisa azra and uh Stacy are all working on um and also if you want to take a look at ho.io resources you can see our new uh fly de uh sorry devel flywheel resource that we've just publish today and uh develon New York is on the 18th and 19th of July so if you're in the area and you can join us it would be lovely to see you there but otherwise thank you so much and uh thank you each of you again and see you on the internet appreciate it thanks Matthew for having us thank yeah thanks all so much take care take care guys bye bye thanks everybody, Developer newsletters and DevRel, Dev Rel, 01j1cyf4gzsnex3mz560pffcf0.