How to Stay Visible in the AI Search Era  ## Metadata - Author: [[The Duct Tape Marketing Podcast]] - Full Title: How to Stay Visible in the AI Search Era - Category: #podcasts - URL: https://share.snipd.com/episode/ba6beda2-fa98-432c-a703-32587ddc5682 ## Document Notes ## Highlights - **Early SEO Was About Tricking Engines** - John Jantsch recounts starting with search experiments in 1998 and chasing page-one rankings. - Early tactics were about tricking engines, which became irrelevant as algorithms matured. Transcript: John Jantsch Hello and welcome to another episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast. This is Jon Jantz and I'm doing a solo show. I'm going to talk about search engine optimization or as I've started to call it, search visibility because the game has changed. Now, the first question you might be asking yourself is, why is Jon wearing a cowboy hat? Those of you that are on the video version, I'm wearing a Stetson Open Road. This is the straw version in the cognac color. It's my favorite summer hat. I just decided it's Friday when I'm recording this. I just decided to put it on and wear it for the show. My grandfather and father had this style hat and a number of US presidents over the years chose this as their primary hat as well. So Stetson Open Road, there you have the story. All right. As I said, I'm going to talk about search engine optimization, what we've always long called, not always, believe it or not, a 20-year history with something called search engine optimization, Which is really moving completely. ([Time 0:00:08](https://share.snipd.com/snip/6e62d6d8-2d57-467d-b79a-53b29f2ac3ef)) - **Search Became An Answer Engine** - Search evolved from simple ranking signals to complex features like mobile, local, and featured snippets. - Today many searches end with no click because AI overviews and zero-click answers provide the result directly. Transcript: John Jantsch There's been lots of changes over the years, different algorithms, different things, different search engines come along, but this is a fundamental shift in how that tactic or approach Really is going to be applied going forward and what it actually is even going to mean to business and website owners going forward as well. So I thought I would start with, before I jump into like EAT and, you know, generative AI and AI overviews and things, just do like a 30 second kind of timeline on search. Well, I started actually playing around with search in 1998. And really, again, it was my first website and it was, you how do we rank and get on page one? You know, what are the things we need to do? I won't go into what all those things were, but most of them are not relevant today. At least, you know, that was in the early days of search engines. They were little infants and they were, you know, the game was to trick them into putting your stuff on page one. That lasted until about 2010. And then, you know, the search engines just got more and more complex and more and more, you know, ability to understand what a page really was about rather than what we wanted them to Think it was about. And so now you start having mobile be part of the deal. You've got the local search packs, you've got answer boxes starting to show up about the, you know, from 2010 to 2016, roll up to about 2017. And now all of a sudden, voice search is a factor, featured snippets become a factor. Near me becomes a factor also searched for. So a lot of things just keep getting injected. And of course, all the while, the ad units and how they display all over the page are changing as well and are really shifting what even ranking on page one even meant anymore. So I guess fast forward to today, 2024 or so it happened, you know, AI overviews, SGE from Google, 60% of U.S. Google searches ending with no click at all, according to Search Engine Land. The infamous zero-click searches, instead of a list of 10 links on a page, we're now to the point where maybe you get featured as a source in an AI answer and hope that generates a click. But six to seven times out of 10 today, that search is just going to end in somebody getting the answer or getting the information that they wanted. ([Time 0:01:12](https://share.snipd.com/snip/a58cb0ab-ccc0-4d50-afbb-3a00142c52cb)) - **Focus On Search Visibility Not Rank** - Replace chasing single keyword ranks with building overall search visibility and brand share of answers. - Visibility includes mentions, knowledge panels, local pack slots, and presence in AI answers. Transcript: John Jantsch So what I'm talking about now is this idea of a complete mindset shift away from search engine optimization, away from trying to rank for keywords, and more about this idea of search Visibility. It's kind of your brand's share of the answers, the mentions, the knowledge panel, real estate, local pack slots, really clicks for everywhere that a prospect looks. I think that's what we have to do today. So chasing one phrase or two phrases or something, it's really going to have a very little value unless it's just a very high intent phrase that if somebody searches that, they're not Looking for an answer, they're looking to purchase. Those are really going to be the highly sought after, I guess, types of searches. Depressions. It's really going to be this whole collection, and this is going to be hard for people to measure, but this whole collection of like branded SERP coverage is really going to be the, you Know, the example. So I'll use a case that a local dentist publishes like, does whitening hurt? They have an FAQ, short TikTok video, Google business posts, a patient story. You know, now they have the chance to actually own the FAQ snippet for that. Maybe the local local rank map pack for that. Maybe a YouTube carousel. I mean, so that's how I think we have to start thinking about these is, you know, there's no more there's no more, you know, I want to show up on for this key search. It's how do I put myself into this idea of answers? ([Time 0:03:39](https://share.snipd.com/snip/e3780923-673d-4181-9512-2fb00285ddfd)) - **Users Now Ask Very Specific Queries** - Search behavior now supports long, precise queries and voice-like inputs to return tailored results. - Users receive highly specific answers instead of generic lists, reducing the value of shallow content. Transcript: John Jantsch And the consumer behavior has changed so dramatically. Search behavior has changed so dramatically. We were all very conditioned to type in six, eight words for what we were looking for and then hoping, or maybe refining that search if we didn't find what we were hoping for. But now we can actually, instead of typing in, you know, plumbing contractor in my town, you know, now it's plumbing contractor with 24 hour service, more than 4.7 star reviews within Two miles from whatever. I mean, you can type that long search in now and you're going to get that very specific. In most cases, you're going to get that very specific result returned to you that you were able to kind of custom tailor to what you wanted rather than saying, okay, Google, give me what You think I want. So one of the things that, and I have to set this up a little bit, that we have to start thinking about when it comes to our content, writing the 101, the how-to blog content, and many people Are finding that they're losing all the search traffic that used to come for that because why would they send them to your page? They can answer that very easily because it was just basic information to begin with. So you're wasting your time if you continue down that path of just creating the 700 words on blah, blah, blah. ([Time 0:05:20](https://share.snipd.com/snip/a6172e6a-4d4a-40ef-bb0d-64ac9dd226af)) - **Prove Experience, Expertise, Authority, Trust** - Demonstrate E-E-A-T by adding real case studies, examples, and evidence of experience. - Include author credentials, links, mentions, and trust signals like policies and contact info. Transcript: John Jantsch It's practically worthless. So Google has this new, fairly new, couple of years acronym called EAT, and there's two E's in there. So E-E and forgive me if you know all about this, but I'll explain it in very basic terms for those who may not understand it. But the idea behind it is that they want to see not just not just expertise. That's one of the E's, but they want to see experience. Have you actually done what you're talking about? They want to see authoritativeness. That's the other A or I mean, that's the A. So they measure that by, you know, are you getting links, mentions? You know, are you in local press? I mean, are you appearing in industry lists? So they're measuring, like, are you an authority on this thing that you're talking about? So experience, expertise, authority. And then the last one is trustworthiness. Are there signals of trust, warranties, refund policies, secure checkout badges, real contact info. I mean, all those kinds of things go into the mix as well. So it's no longer enough to write this article about how to do something. You have to actually have a case study in there. You have to have examples of maybe you doing it in actual real time or behind the scenes so that it's very clear that you're not just talking about this. This is something that you do. This is something you're an expert on. This is something somebody can trust for you to do for their business. ([Time 0:06:58](https://share.snipd.com/snip/718396a9-e34c-412a-9a42-a0760fd461f1)) - **Knowledge Graph Rewards Credible Sources** - Google’s Knowledge Graph update pushed credibility signals, prioritizing real people and brands. - This shift reinforces that demonstrating authority and verifiable experience matters more now. Transcript: John Jantsch So in March, 2024, I'm reading a stat here. Knowledge Graph update extended each signals by 38% to really surface credible people and brands, again, according to Search Engine Lance. So that certainly signals that this is not going away. I mean, that this is going to be a significant, you know, piece as well. ([Time 0:08:22](https://share.snipd.com/snip/bcb4937e-d8c0-454d-a4e1-ab2ca0bffab0)) - **Audit Content And Add Structured Summaries** - Audit content gaps: export URLs, list top customer questions, and use Search Console to map answers. - Add FAQs, TL;DR summaries, and tables of contents to make content scannable and AI-friendly. Transcript: John Jantsch Okay. Number one, audit your content gaps. So export all of your site URLs, list the top 25 customer questions and use, you know, use Google search console. Again, what we're trying to do is find how can we become an answer engine? So take a lot of your content. And again, this is a place where some of the AI tools are really good at this. You've written good, useful content. How could it be better? How could it answer more questions? How could you add FAQs to the end of all of your service pages? How could you add a table of contents to your long form content? How could you add a description box? Some people call it too long, didn't read TLDR. You've probably seen that. How can you add that at the top of your content so that these, they're not really search engine spiders, but so that the AI tools that are going out there and trying to surface good sources For content can have a very quick view of what it's about. It gets very user-friendly. It's very structured in a way that shows kind of the hierarchical structure. ([Time 0:09:03](https://share.snipd.com/snip/467b4f5a-f9c0-4a89-b72a-cb9b48f2b37a)) - **Create Hub Pages As Ultimate Guides** - Build hub pages that group related articles into one ultimate guide for a service or topic. - Structure hubs so visitors and AI can jump to sections like countertops, cabinets, lighting, and finishes. Transcript: John Jantsch I have for years been talking about this thing called hub pages. I mean, the idea behind that is that if you write about, I'll use an example, if you're a kitchen remodeler and you've got a whole bunch of blog posts about various aspects of remodeling A kitchen, what if you turn that, instead of just having them randomly placed on a blog out there in the ether, what if you turn that into a kitchen, the ultimate guide to remodeling a kitchen, And you took all of your content that you've written over the years and you placed it on that page? I don't mean physically all of it on that page, but at least structure it in such a way that somebody can jump around to how to pick countertops, how to pick cabinets, how to pick finishes, How to pick lighting. And then those all kind of becomes a playlist for anybody who's thinking about designing or remodeling a kitchen. So we've been talking about that for, I would say, at least eight or 10 years. And the good news is it was a very effective SEO tactic. I mean, as soon as we would build those for people, it would immediately change how Google viewed their website. But it's also very user-friendly. Somebody comes to that hub page and they are interested in information. It's like, here's the whole guide on what I'm trying to do rather than I just found one. I went out, randomly searched and found one blog post on something. So again, doubly good news is that those pages really are highly rewarded in an AI world as well. ([Time 0:10:51](https://share.snipd.com/snip/9545268a-de9a-4ae6-87cd-21370ecc1352)) - **Put FAQs Everywhere On Your Site** - Add FAQs to every service, product, and about page to answer common and overlooked questions. - Use FAQs to educate prospects and highlight what makes you different from competitors. Transcript: John Jantsch FAQs, and again, in an answer engine world, having answers to the questions that people ask clearly makes a lot of sense. It's also been a very useful piece of content anyway, but now really being rewarded in this answer engine world. So every single one of your service pages, every single one of your product pages, even your about us page now, I think should actually, whether it's structured as a Q&A or just has an FAQ section at the bottom of it and, you know, pay some attention to the questions you're being asked. Again, the AI tools are pretty good at that, surfacing, you know, common questions around things, but you might think in terms of even some of the questions that you're not being asked Unnecessarily, but you should be. People should be paying attention to. So you can use that as an opportunity to educate around like why you and what you do that's different than competitors, for example, that they might not actually be asking about. Monthly case studies, measurable results, quotes from customers, those kind of trust elements, even badges that symbolize that you're in professional organizations and things Or you've achieved certain certifications. ([Time 0:12:30](https://share.snipd.com/snip/db17b79a-e83d-4cdb-81e7-ace7f0291c8d)) - **Refresh Content Regularly** - Refresh older content quarterly by adding links, proofs, FAQs, and TL;DR sections. - Regular updates increase reward in AI-driven search and keep content credible. Transcript: John Jantsch So what I'm telling people, and I need to do this myself as well, is we've got reams and reams of content that we wrote years ago. It needs to be freshened up. In fact, about every quarter, you ought to make a goal of saying, hey, I've got these five blog posts that are decent blog posts. How could I freshen them up, add more links, add more experience, add more proof in these? Maybe I can structure them with a table of contents in that TLDR. Maybe I could add FAQs to them. You will be highly rewarded for refreshing that content. And last thing I would say is start thinking, and this is particularly true for local businesses, not as much for somebody who's really more of a national scale. But that Google business page, think of it as another publishing platform. Now, you don't own that platform, of course, but you have a lot of leeway in how optimized it is, all the photos, the videos that you can add there, all the service descriptions you can ([Time 0:13:51](https://share.snipd.com/snip/96b7416e-081a-46ee-a2c6-b1cd30e275c1)) - **Use Google Business As A Publishing Channel** - Treat your Google Business Profile as a publishing platform and post regularly with photos and service details. - Reuse shortened versions of existing content and post weekly to boost visibility and trust. Transcript: John Jantsch But that Google business page, think of it as another publishing platform. Now, you don't own that platform, of course, but you have a lot of leeway in how optimized it is, all the photos, the videos that you can add there, all the service descriptions you can Add there, and you can post there. I would be taking, again, in some cases daily if you've got a lot of content, but certainly weekly, create a Google or post in your Google business page that can come from. ([Time 0:14:34](https://share.snipd.com/snip/f8a9849f-e65f-499e-9d8a-a86b15755697)) - **Find Where AI Sources Its Answers** - Test AI tools by searching queries you want to win and note the sources they cite. - Join directories or forums the AI pulls from if you want to appear in its sourced answers. Transcript: John Jantsch The other thing I would tell you to do is to do a bunch of searches in some of the AI tools that are searches you'd love to show up in. You'd love to win. Now, hopefully you show up in some of those. So I use my kitchen contractor, remodeling contractor. So best kitchen remodeling contractor in X-City would be a link that or something that they'd want to really show up for. Right. Take note of who shows up. That's important. But also one of the things the AI tools do is they tell you the sources that they went to to to make that determination. And in some cases, these are directories. In some cases, common in the remodeling industry is one called Howes that they actually got a lot of that information from. ([Time 0:15:18](https://share.snipd.com/snip/c81830ae-7658-4fcb-9c9f-b5a084f24773)) - **Write For Human Questions Not Algorithms** - Stop obsessing over head keywords and stop writing for algorithms; write for human questions. - Use tools like Answer The Public to discover real customer queries and prioritize structured schema for FAQs. Transcript: John Jantsch Stop obsessing over a handful of head keywords. It just doesn't matter anymore. Don't write for algorithms. I think this has always been true. Think in terms of the human question behind any query that somebody is asking. We use a tool called Answer the Public. I highly recommend that you go there. And if you're at a loss for what questions people are asking in your industry, that can be a great resource for that. Frankly, the AI tools are pretty good at it. They can surface what questions people are asking in certain industries. You can't sit and forget your website. If I go and I look and there's your last blog post was 2022. We probably got some work to do. This is something that you just need to make it a weekly, monthly, quarterly plan that you're going to do X, Y, and Z and just commit to doing it. Don't obsess over all the tools. I mean, don't go down the rabbit hole. I mean, structured schema is important. There are plugins that can actually do that so that when you write FAQs, the underlying code tells Google or tells whoever is visiting your website, this is an FAQ section. So spend some time on that part. ([Time 0:16:29](https://share.snipd.com/snip/1985f159-caca-43a3-903e-57f6d76f7c48)) - **Start By Doing One Thing Consistently** - Pick one improvement today: add FAQs, case studies, or optimize your Google Business profile. - Commit to a regular cadence so your website doesn't go stale and you stay visible in search. Transcript: John Jantsch If you got some ideas today, pick one. If you don't have any FAQs, that's where I would start. If you don't have any case studies, I would certainly think in terms of that. If you haven't visited your Google business profile, I would highly recommend that you think in terms of your strategy there. So pick one of the things that I mentioned here today and just start working away at it. I mean, don't listen to all the gloom and doom and look at your Google analytics and say, oh, my traffic, search your traffic's down. Because there's a good chance that a lot of that search traffic wasn't that meaningful anyway. It was somebody looking for that how-to article. They were not actually looking for your product or service. ([Time 0:17:44](https://share.snipd.com/snip/61419de6-7cfd-46d5-82d4-cb57c47825ff))