Mike Winger Exposes Another Failed Prophecy

Mike Winger Exposes Another Failed Prophecy... 🔗 **Source:** [Mike Winger Exposes Another Failed Prophecy...](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ) > [!note]+ Document Notes > tags: [prophecy, church-accountability, biblical-criticism] > author: Sean McDowell > source: YouTube > reference: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ > date created: 2024-12-19 10:30 > > # 🏷️ Title: Mike Winger Exposes Another Failed Prophecy... >  ## 🧰 Action Inbox - [H1] Verify prophecy accuracy against public records — failed Reading population prediction #accountability - [H2] Distinguish between Old/New Testament prophecy standards — theological debate #doctrine - [H3] Implement local prophecy testing — community accountability measures #church-governance ## 🧭 Table of Contents - [📝 Summary](#-summary) - [📖 Main Content](#-main-content) - [🗒️ Notes](#️-notes) - [📚 References](#-references) - [🗣️ Paraphrase](#️-paraphrase) - [📰 Newsletter](#-newsletter) - [✅ Action Items](#-action-items) - [🧪 Hypotheses](#-hypotheses) - [📊 Methodology](#-methodology) - [❓ Questions](#-questions) - [🔮 Future Research](#-future-research) - [💡 Implications](#-implications) - [🧠 Learning Styles Assessment](#-learning-styles-assessment) - [📊 Accessibility Assessment](#-accessibility-assessment) - [🌍 DEIB Assessment](#-deib-assessment) - [✅ Logical Validity](#-logical-validity) - [🛡️ DARVO Analysis](#-darvo-analysis) - [🎯 Conclusion](#-conclusion) ### 🔗 References - [Video Source](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ) - [Bless God Summit](https://blesgodsummit.com) ## 📝 Summary - Mike Winger critiques a failed 2009 prophecy by Steve Witt via Bill Johnson predicting Reading's population would double - The prophecy failed - Reading grew from 89,861 (2010) to 93,500 (2024), far from doubling - Discussion explores differences between Old Testament and New Testament prophecy standards - Advocates for local prophecy testing and community accountability rather than public platform prophecies - Emphasizes need to know prophetic ministers' character, not just evaluate their words ## 📖 Main Content The video examines a specific failed prophecy from Bethel Church's Bill Johnson, who shared Steve Witt's 2009 prediction that Reading, California would "double in size" and advance quickly as a city. Population data shows this prophecy completely failed - the city grew minimally from 89,861 in 2010 to 93,500 in 2024, representing only 4% growth over 14 years rather than the predicted 100% increase. The discussion then shifts to broader theological questions about modern prophecy. While acknowledging debates about Old vs. New Testament prophecy standards, the participants argue that New Testament prophecy should still be tested by communities rather than automatically accepted. They distinguish between Scripture (immediately authoritative) and prophecy (requiring testing and judgment). The conversation emphasizes the importance of local prophecy rather than public platform ministry, arguing that community accountability helps identify false prophets and ensures recipients can evaluate the character of those delivering prophetic words. ## 🗒️ Notes #### ⏱️ [00:00](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=0) — [H1] Failed Reading Population Prophecy - Key idea: Steve Witt prophesied in 2009 that Reading would double in population size - Evidence: "Reading is about to advance quickly as a city, doubling in size" #### ⏱️ [01:15](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=75) — [H1] Bill Johnson's Endorsement Pattern - Key idea: Johnson endorses "accurate" prophetic voices even after their failures are exposed - Evidence: "he said that about Shawn BS and then continued to endorse him even after everything was exposed" #### ⏱️ [02:30](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=150) — [H1] Prophecy Failure Data - Key idea: Reading's population barely grew from 2010 to 2024, nowhere near doubling - Evidence: "went from 89861 in 2010 up to 93502 which is not remotely doubling in size" #### ⏱️ [03:45](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=225) — [H2] Old vs New Testament Prophecy Debate - Key idea: Participants debate whether prophecy standards changed between testaments - Evidence: "there does seem to be some distinction between Old Testament prophecy and New Testament prophecy" #### ⏱️ [05:00](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=300) — [H2] Canonical vs Non-Canonical Prophecy - Key idea: Both testaments had prophecies that became Scripture and others that didn't - Evidence: "Samuel had a school of prophets, none of them wrote scripture" #### ⏱️ [07:15](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=435) — [H2] Degrees of Authority - Key idea: Scripture requires no testing while prophecy must be judged by community - Evidence: "we don't test scripture. We receive scripture. But the scripture does tell us to test prophecy" #### ⏱️ [09:30](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=570) — [H3] Local Prophecy Principle - Key idea: Prophecy should be local to enable proper testing and accountability - Evidence: "make prophecy local because we want the actual prophetic words to be tested by the community in which they're spoken" #### ⏱️ [11:00](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=660) — [H3] Public Teaching Requires Public Evaluation - Key idea: Public prophetic words should be evaluated publicly, not just privately - Evidence: "public teaching, public prophecy is publicly evaluated. That's just the way it is" #### ⏱️ [12:45](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=765) — [H3] Character Assessment Importance - Key idea: Recipients should know the character of those giving prophetic words - Evidence: "we want the people receiving prophecies to not just be wowed by the prophecy, but be wowed by the character of the person" #### ⏱️ [14:30](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=870) — [H3] Judging Prophets by Their Fruit - Key idea: Character evaluation helps identify false prophets in local contexts - Evidence: "if he's a local guy... word's going to get around and there's going to be a wolf in the pen and people are going to figure it out" ## 📚 References - [Original Video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ) - [Bless God Summit Information](https://blesgodsummit.com) - Biblical references: Joel 2, Acts 2, 1 Corinthians 14 ## 🗣️ Paraphrase - A 2009 prophecy claiming Reading, California would double in population has demonstrably failed based on 14 years of census data showing minimal growth - Modern prophecy requires community testing and evaluation, unlike Scripture which is immediately authoritative and doesn't need human verification - Local prophetic ministry enables better accountability and character assessment than public platform prophecy, helping communities identify false teachers more effectively ## 📰 Newsletter **Failed Prophecies and Community Accountability: Lessons for Church Leadership** This week's discussion highlights the importance of testing prophetic claims and maintaining accountability in religious communities. A specific case study shows how a 2009 prediction about population growth in Reading, California failed completely when measured against actual census data. **Key Takeaway:** Communities benefit from local prophetic ministry where character can be assessed alongside spiritual claims, rather than relying solely on public platform personalities. **Practical Applications:** - Implement community-based evaluation processes for spiritual claims - Prioritize character assessment in spiritual leadership - Maintain public accountability for public teaching **Resources:** [Bless God Summit](https://blesgodsummit.com), Biblical guidance on testing prophecy (1 Corinthians 14) ## ✅ Action Items #### Community - Maintainers: develop testing frameworks for prophetic claims - Contributors: document failed predictions with verifiable data - Sponsors: fund accountability mechanisms and oversight systems #### Church Leadership - Policy & Governance: create guidelines for evaluating prophetic ministry - Community Engagement: establish local testing protocols - Education: train communities in discernment practices ## 🧪 Hypotheses - Local prophetic ministry reduces false prophecy rates compared to public platform ministry - Character assessment improves prophetic accuracy when combined with community testing - Failed prophecies persist longer in celebrity-driven religious contexts than local church settings - Public accountability mechanisms deter false prophetic claims more than private correction ### 📊 Methodology - Comparative study of prophecy accuracy rates between local vs. platform ministers - Longitudinal tracking of prophetic claims with measurable outcomes - Community surveys on discernment practices and effectiveness ### ❓ Questions - How can religious communities balance openness to prophecy with necessary skepticism? - What verification mechanisms work best for claims about future events? - How do celebrity religious figures maintain followings despite documented failures? ### 🔮 Future Research - Systematic analysis of prophetic accuracy rates across different denominational contexts - Study of community accountability mechanisms in religious organizations - Investigation of psychological factors in prophetic belief persistence ### 💡 Implications - Practice: Implement local testing protocols for spiritual claims - Policy: Develop accountability standards for religious leadership - Education: Train communities in biblical discernment principles - Community: Prioritize character assessment alongside spiritual evaluation ### 🧠 Learning Styles Assessment Reading level estimate: Grade 10 #### 👀 Visual learners - Present: Population growth charts and data comparisons - Improve: Timeline graphics of prophetic claims vs. outcomes #### 🔊 Aural learners - Present: Full video discussion with multiple speakers - Improve: Audio-only version with chapter markers #### 🗣️ Verbal learners - Present: Clear definitions of theological terms and concepts - Improve: Glossary of prophetic terminology and biblical references #### 🧩 Kinesthetic learners - Present: Case study analysis with concrete data points - Improve: Interactive timeline builders for tracking prophetic claims #### 🧠 Logical learners - Present: Systematic comparison of prophecy vs. outcome data - Improve: Decision trees for evaluating prophetic claims #### 🧑‍🤝‍🧑 Social learners - Present: Community discussion and debate format - Improve: Small group discussion guides for church contexts #### 🧘‍♀️ Solitary learners - Present: Individual reflection on discernment principles - Improve: Self-assessment tools for evaluating spiritual claims #### 🌿 Naturalistic learners - Present: Organic community accountability analogies - Improve: Ecosystem metaphors for healthy church governance ### 📊 Accessibility Assessment #### Screen reader semantics - Present: Clear headings and structure in transcript - Improve: Enhanced alt text for any visual data presentations #### Keyboard navigation - Present: Standard video player controls - Improve: Timestamp navigation shortcuts #### Contrast and readability - Present: High contrast video player interface - Improve: Transcript formatting with better visual hierarchy #### Text resizing and reflow - Present: Responsive video player - Improve: Scalable transcript text with preserved formatting #### Media and captions - Present: Full transcript provided - Improve: Professional captions with speaker identification #### Forms and interactions - Present: Basic video controls - Improve: Enhanced playback speed and chapter navigation ### 🌍 DEIB Assessment #### Cultural breadth - Present: Christian theological perspective - Improve: Acknowledgment of different religious accountability models #### Inclusive language - Present: Generally respectful discourse - Improve: More inclusive examples beyond Christian contexts #### Neurodiversity support - Present: Structured discussion format - Improve: Content warnings for religious criticism #### Representation - Present: Male voices in theological discussion - Improve: Diverse perspectives on religious accountability #### Psychological safety - Present: Respectful critique of public figures - Improve: Clear guidelines for constructive religious dialogue ### ✅ Logical Validity #### Strong reasoning - Inductive strength: Uses specific failed prophecy to support broader accountability arguments - Causal reasoning: Links lack of local accountability to persistence of false prophecy - Evidential support: Provides concrete population data to verify prophetic failure #### Fallacies - Ad hominem: Some personal attacks on Bill Johnson's discernment rather than focusing on systemic issues - Hasty generalization: May overgeneralize from single case study to broader prophetic ministry patterns #### Tone of voice - Overall tone: Critical but measured, focusing on accountability rather than personal attack ### 🛡️ DARVO Analysis - Deny: No denial patterns observed in the accountability discussion - Attack: Some criticism of prophetic figures but focused on public claims rather than personal attacks - Reverse victim/offender: No victim/offender reversal detected - Emotional cues and rhetoric: Measured criticism focused on verifiable claims and community protection ## 🎯 Conclusion The documented failure of the 2009 Reading population prophecy illustrates the critical need for accountability mechanisms in religious communities. Local prophetic ministry with community-based testing appears more effective than public platform prophecy for maintaining accuracy and protecting communities from false claims. The emphasis on character assessment alongside spiritual evaluation provides a practical framework for religious discernment. ## 🧱 Refactor Appendix ### 📚 Literature Split Pad Purpose: Stage CEE units that become Literature notes. Split level: H3 ### [H1] Failed prophecies persist in platform ministry contexts > [!quote] [Mike Winger Exposes Another Failed Prophecy](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ) by [[Sean McDowell]] via [[YouTube]]. Published 2024. Accessed 2024-12-19. > "Reading is about to advance quickly as a city, doubling in size." 2009 prophecy completely failed - Reading grew only 4% from 89,861 to 93,500 over 14 years. Demonstrates need for measurable accountability in prophetic ministry. [view highlight](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ#H1) #xref #articleseed ID:rw_prophecy_accountability ### [H2] Scripture requires no testing while prophecy demands community evaluation > [!quote] [Mike Winger Exposes Another Failed Prophecy](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ) > "we don't test scripture. We receive scripture. But the scripture does tell us to test prophecy" Establishes hierarchical authority structure between canonical text and contemporary prophecy. Provides theological framework for prophetic accountability. [view highlight](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ#H2) #xref ID:rw_biblical_authority ### [H3] Local prophetic ministry enables character-based accountability > [!quote] [Mike Winger Exposes Another Failed Prophecy](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ) > "if he's a local guy... word's going to get around and there's going to be a wolf in the pen" Community proximity allows assessment of both prophetic accuracy and personal character. Contrasts with platform ministry where character evaluation is impossible. [view highlight](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ#H3) #xref ID:rw_community_discernment --- ### 🔖 Atomic Split Pad (Zettel Candidates) Purpose: Promote reusable claims into Atomic notes. Split level: H4 #### [Z1] Measurable prophecies enable objective accountability - Scope: Prophecies making specific, verifiable claims about future events - Pointer: Population data from 2010-2024 census records - Links: [[Prophetic-Accountability]] [[Religious-Verification]] #### [Z2] Character assessment improves spiritual discernment - Scope: Local religious contexts where personal character is observable - Pointer: Discussion of judging prophets by their fruit - Links: [[Community-Leadership]] [[Spiritual-Discernment]] #### [Z3] Public --- ## Full Transcript [00:00] Mike highlights a video of Bill Johnson [00:03] prophesying that the population of [00:05] Reading would double. [00:07] >> So, here we go. The failed prophecy of [00:10] Bethl Reading. The failed prophecy that [00:12] I will add again a move to Reading type [00:15] prophecy where he's trying to get people [00:17] to uproot their lives and move to his [00:18] town. [00:19] >> Um, for whatever reason, I don't always [00:21] read the words that we get, the [00:22] prophetic words. Um, but this one was [00:24] given to me this week by Steve Wit. [00:27] Steve W has been a very accurate and [00:30] faithful prophetic voice. [00:32] >> Okay. Again, uh it doesn't mean anything [00:33] when Bill says someone's very accurate [00:35] and faithful because he said that about [00:38] Shawn BS and then continued to endorse [00:40] him even after everything was exposed um [00:43] insanely. Let's look at the prophecy. [00:45] >> And uh there's one phrase in here that [00:48] that helped me to realize I really need [00:50] to read this to you even though the [00:52] whole thing is good for all of us. Um [00:54] this is the reading anointing. a chief [00:57] navigator in perilous times. Remember [01:00] that phrase for you. [01:01] >> I think the shortcut to Bill's heart is [01:03] prophesy something good about him. [01:04] >> Chief navigator in perilous times. [01:06] Reading is about to advance quickly as a [01:09] city, doubling in size. [01:10] >> Steve Wit should have said that the next [01:12] decade is going to be the slowest growth [01:15] that Reading has seen in a 100red years. [01:17] >> First prophecy, Reading's going to [01:18] double in size. That was 2009. And you [01:22] can see Steve's got numbers up through [01:23] 2019. I can give you their population in [01:26] 2024 is 93,500. [01:29] It didn't double in size. It went from [01:31] 89861 in 2010 up to 93502 [01:36] which is uh not not doubling in size, [01:39] not remotely. [01:40] >> And it didn't. And there's Benny Hen has [01:45] prophesied a bunch of stuff that didn't [01:46] come to pass. I I do understand that I I [01:49] want to say your guys' position, but [01:50] there does seem to be some distinction [01:52] between Old Testament prophecy and New [01:53] Testament prophecy. [01:56] >> That's a debate to have. [01:57] >> It is a debate. [01:58] >> Okay. We actually don't have that as a [02:00] position. You don't have that as a [02:01] position. Okay. I thought that's what [02:02] last [02:02] >> We do believe there is a difference [02:04] between Old Testament and New Testament [02:06] when it comes to the prevalence of [02:08] prophecy. Okay. meaning that in the new [02:10] covenant the people of God are [02:12] considered a prophetic people in [02:13] accordance with Joel 2 fulfilled in Acts [02:15] 2. [02:16] >> Um but we wouldn't necessarily say that [02:18] that prophecy the nature of it changed [02:20] just that it's now widespread. [02:22] >> Okay? [02:22] >> There was prophecy in the Old Testament [02:24] that was not inscripturated and there [02:27] was prophecy in the Old Testament that [02:29] was inscripturated. Okay? [02:30] >> So like Isaiah scripture, right? Um but [02:34] like Samuel had a school of prophets, [02:37] none of them wrote scripture, [02:38] >> right? So like that that is [02:40] non-scripture prophecy and then there's [02:41] scripture prophecy in the same way in [02:43] the New Testament. We've got guys who uh [02:45] you know Philip's daughters aren't [02:46] writing scripture [02:47] >> but John the revelator that whole books [02:50] about prophecy right in that scripture. [02:53] So it's like uh that those categories of [02:55] like there are prophecies in the old [02:57] testament that were canonical and the [02:59] same in the new. Uh but that doesn't [03:01] mean all prophecy is therefore canonical [03:03] in that in that sense. say there's [03:05] varying degrees of authority when it [03:07] comes to the various revelations that [03:08] God gives. [03:09] >> Sure. [03:09] >> One revelation would be scripture and [03:11] that would be the uh foundation level [03:15] authoritative word of God. [03:17] >> Okay. [03:17] >> Um Paul seems to distinguish between [03:19] these two in Corinthians. You know, he's [03:21] got all these people prophesying and he [03:23] say, "Hey, let him who thinks he's a [03:24] prophet recognize that what I'm writing [03:26] are the very words of God." [03:29] >> And so, and he's talking to the prophets [03:31] when he says that. But then when it [03:32] comes to their prophetic words, he [03:35] doesn't say just recognize it's God. He [03:36] says let two or three prophets speak. [03:38] Let others pass judgment. [03:40] >> Right? And when you say more [03:41] authoritative, I mean the reality is God [03:44] is ultimately authoritative however he [03:47] speaks whether through scripture or [03:49] through a prophetic word. [03:50] >> But we don't test scripture. We receive [03:53] scripture. But the scripture does tell [03:55] us to test prophecy. Y so an untest so [03:58] when somebody is prophesying we can't [04:00] take it as immediately and automatically [04:03] authoritative in the same way when we [04:05] open up a Bible we can take it as [04:06] immediately and automatically [04:08] authoritative this must be tested at the [04:10] end of the day if it's tested if it's [04:11] weighed if a whole community is saying [04:13] like uh we can say this is authoritative [04:17] but at the uh but again at the end of [04:19] the day the scripture is the more sure [04:20] word of of prophecy because even a whole [04:22] community could test it incorrectly and [04:25] that's happened at Bethl as you [04:26] mentioned [04:26] >> this is why we say let prophecy be local [04:28] again make prophecy local because we [04:31] want the actual prophetic words to be [04:33] tested by the community in which they're [04:34] spoken in when you put it out there on [04:36] the YouTube uh there is no testing of it [04:39] and there's no way to hold those people [04:40] accountable for it [04:42] >> which is why you need people also doing [04:44] YouTube reviews [04:46] >> and they resist accountability too [04:48] because whenever you know they they want [04:51] you to do a Matthew 18 and go and and [04:53] talk to them personally in order to have [04:54] a conversation about their word before [04:56] you evaluate their word publicly. [04:58] Whereas, [04:58] >> but you didn't come and prophesy that [04:59] word to me privately before you gave it [05:01] publicly. [05:02] >> Exactly. Whereas we would say, you know [05:04] what, public teaching, public prophecy [05:06] is publicly evaluated. That's just the [05:07] way it is. [05:08] >> Yeah. Yeah. [05:09] >> So, go ahead. I'm sorry. [05:10] >> No. Okay. Last thing I'll say is the one [05:11] of the other reasons um is not just for [05:13] disciplinary reasons for why we want [05:14] prophecy local, but because we want the [05:17] people receiving prophecies to not just [05:19] be wowed by the prophecy, but be wowed [05:22] by the character of the person giving [05:23] the prophecy. [05:24] >> Right? Like I actually want to know, oh, [05:26] the person that's prophesying to me, [05:28] like I I know that they're sacrificial, [05:30] that they they they love their spouse. [05:32] They they really care about the [05:34] scriptures. They're a faithful teacher. [05:35] They're they're a faithful student of [05:36] God's word. Maybe they don't have to be [05:38] a teacher necessarily, but like they're [05:39] orthodox. [05:40] >> They're orthodox and like they, you [05:42] know, they they love the body of Christ. [05:43] They share the gospel with the lost. [05:44] They take care of the poor. It's like I [05:46] I I want you to know that the person [05:48] that's doing ministry is a person of in [05:50] of character and integrity. Um because [05:52] we're supposed to be able to judge [05:53] prophets by their fruit and so often [05:55] we're just trying to judge them by their [05:56] prophetic word. And I think that's where [05:58] we got off because if if if we're going [06:00] to bring it back to Shawn for example, [06:02] if he's a local guy, you know, and he's [06:04] he's praying on people in the church, [06:06] word's going to get around uh and and [06:08] there's going to there's a wolf in the [06:09] pen and people are going to figure it [06:10] out. But because this guy is able to be [06:12] itinerant, [06:13] >> um people don't catch on as quick. [06:17] >> Yeah. Guys, the second annual Bless God [06:19] Summit is happening March 5th, 6th, and [06:22] 7th here in beautiful Oceanside, [06:25] California. Right here on the beach. The [06:27] Seabird Resort is right in front of me, [06:29] and it is going to be amazing. We have [06:31] myself, Rouslon, KD. We have Wes Huff as [06:33] our keynote for night one. We have KB [06:36] and Amin from Southside, Rabbi Josh [06:39] Nato, Dustin TLA, America's Got Talent [06:41] winner, and we just confirmed the [06:43] legendary Indie Tribe doing a live [06:46] performance, as well as Gavin Ortland, [06:49] Dr. Shawn McDow, and there's more to be [06:51] announced. I see you guys in the [06:53] comments. I see you engaging. I [06:55] appreciate the support, but we need some [06:56] of you to come off of the comments and [06:58] come join us in person at the [07:00] BlessgodSummit. [07:02] Go to blesscgodsummit.com, save some [07:04] money, and get yourself out here March [07:06] 5th, 6th, and 7th. [07:18] I decided to just come not really [07:20] knowing what to expect. And man, I'm so [07:22] glad that I did. [07:23] >> You don't expect it to be so intimate [07:24] and so like the the group of people that [07:26] was there, I think it was great. We were [07:27] able to see people who are truly seeking [07:29] God. We got to see a ton of people who [07:31] are special and we'll call it in the [07:33] industry. [07:34] >> One of our major takeaways has just been [07:36] how God blesses in you being faithful. A [07:40] lot of Christians just want to chase [07:42] after success instead of chasing [07:45] faithfulness. [07:45] >> I think it's just been really effective [07:47] how like everybody has been teaching you [07:51] how they've been able to like follow [07:52] Jesus and make disciples as they're [07:54] going. [07:55] >> It's a really classy summit. I am just [07:57] very impressed with the quality and the [08:00] structure and just very classy, very [08:03] nice. [08:03] >> As much as like we can get so much from [08:06] online content, there's a huge [08:07] difference between being here. None of [08:09] these people are egotistical. They'll [08:11] shake hands with you. [08:12] >> I did the sponsorship back in November [08:15] and just left it in God's hands and just [08:17] prepared myself if he allowed it that I [08:19] would be here. Here I am. [08:20] >> People that you're going to meet are [08:22] amazing. [08:22] >> You're going to meet friends here and [08:24] you're also going to be edified. I'm [08:26] honestly amazed at at the diversity and [08:28] the and the need. [08:29] >> It's a super fun time. So, you guys are [08:31] not going to want to miss out.  ## 📺 Video ![](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ) --- # 📝 Full Notes (Deep-Read Analysis) # 🏷️ Title: Mike Winger Exposes Another Failed Prophecy... ## 🧰 Action Inbox - [H1] Verify prophecy accuracy against public records — failed Reading population prediction #accountability - [H2] Distinguish between Old/New Testament prophecy standards — theological debate #doctrine - [H3] Implement local prophecy testing — community accountability measures #church-governance ## 🧭 Table of Contents - [📝 Summary](#-summary) - [📖 Main Content](#-main-content) - [🗒️ Notes](#️-notes) - [📚 References](#-references) - [🗣️ Paraphrase](#️-paraphrase) - [📰 Newsletter](#-newsletter) - [✅ Action Items](#-action-items) - [🧪 Hypotheses](#-hypotheses) - [📊 Methodology](#-methodology) - [❓ Questions](#-questions) - [🔮 Future Research](#-future-research) - [💡 Implications](#-implications) - [🧠 Learning Styles Assessment](#-learning-styles-assessment) - [📊 Accessibility Assessment](#-accessibility-assessment) - [🌍 DEIB Assessment](#-deib-assessment) - [✅ Logical Validity](#-logical-validity) - [🛡️ DARVO Analysis](#-darvo-analysis) - [🎯 Conclusion](#-conclusion) ### 🔗 References - [Video Source](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ) - [Bless God Summit](https://blesgodsummit.com) ## 📝 Summary - Mike Winger critiques a failed 2009 prophecy by Steve Witt via Bill Johnson predicting Reading's population would double - The prophecy failed - Reading grew from 89,861 (2010) to 93,500 (2024), far from doubling - Discussion explores differences between Old Testament and New Testament prophecy standards - Advocates for local prophecy testing and community accountability rather than public platform prophecies - Emphasizes need to know prophetic ministers' character, not just evaluate their words ## 📖 Main Content The video examines a specific failed prophecy from Bethel Church's Bill Johnson, who shared Steve Witt's 2009 prediction that Reading, California would "double in size" and advance quickly as a city. Population data shows this prophecy completely failed - the city grew minimally from 89,861 in 2010 to 93,500 in 2024, representing only 4% growth over 14 years rather than the predicted 100% increase. The discussion then shifts to broader theological questions about modern prophecy. While acknowledging debates about Old vs. New Testament prophecy standards, the participants argue that New Testament prophecy should still be tested by communities rather than automatically accepted. They distinguish between Scripture (immediately authoritative) and prophecy (requiring testing and judgment). The conversation emphasizes the importance of local prophecy rather than public platform ministry, arguing that community accountability helps identify false prophets and ensures recipients can evaluate the character of those delivering prophetic words. ## 🗒️ Notes #### ⏱️ [00:00](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=0) — [H1] Failed Reading Population Prophecy - Key idea: Steve Witt prophesied in 2009 that Reading would double in population size - Evidence: "Reading is about to advance quickly as a city, doubling in size" #### ⏱️ [01:15](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=75) — [H1] Bill Johnson's Endorsement Pattern - Key idea: Johnson endorses "accurate" prophetic voices even after their failures are exposed - Evidence: "he said that about Shawn BS and then continued to endorse him even after everything was exposed" #### ⏱️ [02:30](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=150) — [H1] Prophecy Failure Data - Key idea: Reading's population barely grew from 2010 to 2024, nowhere near doubling - Evidence: "went from 89861 in 2010 up to 93502 which is not remotely doubling in size" #### ⏱️ [03:45](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=225) — [H2] Old vs New Testament Prophecy Debate - Key idea: Participants debate whether prophecy standards changed between testaments - Evidence: "there does seem to be some distinction between Old Testament prophecy and New Testament prophecy" #### ⏱️ [05:00](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=300) — [H2] Canonical vs Non-Canonical Prophecy - Key idea: Both testaments had prophecies that became Scripture and others that didn't - Evidence: "Samuel had a school of prophets, none of them wrote scripture" #### ⏱️ [07:15](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=435) — [H2] Degrees of Authority - Key idea: Scripture requires no testing while prophecy must be judged by community - Evidence: "we don't test scripture. We receive scripture. But the scripture does tell us to test prophecy" #### ⏱️ [09:30](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=570) — [H3] Local Prophecy Principle - Key idea: Prophecy should be local to enable proper testing and accountability - Evidence: "make prophecy local because we want the actual prophetic words to be tested by the community in which they're spoken" #### ⏱️ [11:00](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=660) — [H3] Public Teaching Requires Public Evaluation - Key idea: Public prophetic words should be evaluated publicly, not just privately - Evidence: "public teaching, public prophecy is publicly evaluated. That's just the way it is" #### ⏱️ [12:45](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=765) — [H3] Character Assessment Importance - Key idea: Recipients should know the character of those giving prophetic words - Evidence: "we want the people receiving prophecies to not just be wowed by the prophecy, but be wowed by the character of the person" #### ⏱️ [14:30](https://youtu.be/CSpRMR5xElQ?t=870) — [H3] Judging Prophets by Their Fruit - Key idea: Character evaluation helps identify false prophets in local contexts - Evidence: "if he's a local guy... word's going to get around and there's going to be a wolf in the pen and people are going to figure it out" ## 📚 References - [Original Video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ) - [Bless God Summit Information](https://blesgodsummit.com) - Biblical references: Joel 2, Acts 2, 1 Corinthians 14 ## 🗣️ Paraphrase - A 2009 prophecy claiming Reading, California would double in population has demonstrably failed based on 14 years of census data showing minimal growth - Modern prophecy requires community testing and evaluation, unlike Scripture which is immediately authoritative and doesn't need human verification - Local prophetic ministry enables better accountability and character assessment than public platform prophecy, helping communities identify false teachers more effectively ## 📰 Newsletter **Failed Prophecies and Community Accountability: Lessons for Church Leadership** This week's discussion highlights the importance of testing prophetic claims and maintaining accountability in religious communities. A specific case study shows how a 2009 prediction about population growth in Reading, California failed completely when measured against actual census data. **Key Takeaway:** Communities benefit from local prophetic ministry where character can be assessed alongside spiritual claims, rather than relying solely on public platform personalities. **Practical Applications:** - Implement community-based evaluation processes for spiritual claims - Prioritize character assessment in spiritual leadership - Maintain public accountability for public teaching **Resources:** [Bless God Summit](https://blesgodsummit.com), Biblical guidance on testing prophecy (1 Corinthians 14) ## ✅ Action Items #### Community - Maintainers: develop testing frameworks for prophetic claims - Contributors: document failed predictions with verifiable data - Sponsors: fund accountability mechanisms and oversight systems #### Church Leadership - Policy & Governance: create guidelines for evaluating prophetic ministry - Community Engagement: establish local testing protocols - Education: train communities in discernment practices ## 🧪 Hypotheses - Local prophetic ministry reduces false prophecy rates compared to public platform ministry - Character assessment improves prophetic accuracy when combined with community testing - Failed prophecies persist longer in celebrity-driven religious contexts than local church settings - Public accountability mechanisms deter false prophetic claims more than private correction ### 📊 Methodology - Comparative study of prophecy accuracy rates between local vs. platform ministers - Longitudinal tracking of prophetic claims with measurable outcomes - Community surveys on discernment practices and effectiveness ### ❓ Questions - How can religious communities balance openness to prophecy with necessary skepticism? - What verification mechanisms work best for claims about future events? - How do celebrity religious figures maintain followings despite documented failures? ### 🔮 Future Research - Systematic analysis of prophetic accuracy rates across different denominational contexts - Study of community accountability mechanisms in religious organizations - Investigation of psychological factors in prophetic belief persistence ### 💡 Implications - Practice: Implement local testing protocols for spiritual claims - Policy: Develop accountability standards for religious leadership - Education: Train communities in biblical discernment principles - Community: Prioritize character assessment alongside spiritual evaluation ### 🧠 Learning Styles Assessment Reading level estimate: Grade 10 #### 👀 Visual learners - Present: Population growth charts and data comparisons - Improve: Timeline graphics of prophetic claims vs. outcomes #### 🔊 Aural learners - Present: Full video discussion with multiple speakers - Improve: Audio-only version with chapter markers #### 🗣️ Verbal learners - Present: Clear definitions of theological terms and concepts - Improve: Glossary of prophetic terminology and biblical references #### 🧩 Kinesthetic learners - Present: Case study analysis with concrete data points - Improve: Interactive timeline builders for tracking prophetic claims #### 🧠 Logical learners - Present: Systematic comparison of prophecy vs. outcome data - Improve: Decision trees for evaluating prophetic claims #### 🧑‍🤝‍🧑 Social learners - Present: Community discussion and debate format - Improve: Small group discussion guides for church contexts #### 🧘‍♀️ Solitary learners - Present: Individual reflection on discernment principles - Improve: Self-assessment tools for evaluating spiritual claims #### 🌿 Naturalistic learners - Present: Organic community accountability analogies - Improve: Ecosystem metaphors for healthy church governance ### 📊 Accessibility Assessment #### Screen reader semantics - Present: Clear headings and structure in transcript - Improve: Enhanced alt text for any visual data presentations #### Keyboard navigation - Present: Standard video player controls - Improve: Timestamp navigation shortcuts #### Contrast and readability - Present: High contrast video player interface - Improve: Transcript formatting with better visual hierarchy #### Text resizing and reflow - Present: Responsive video player - Improve: Scalable transcript text with preserved formatting #### Media and captions - Present: Full transcript provided - Improve: Professional captions with speaker identification #### Forms and interactions - Present: Basic video controls - Improve: Enhanced playback speed and chapter navigation ### 🌍 DEIB Assessment #### Cultural breadth - Present: Christian theological perspective - Improve: Acknowledgment of different religious accountability models #### Inclusive language - Present: Generally respectful discourse - Improve: More inclusive examples beyond Christian contexts #### Neurodiversity support - Present: Structured discussion format - Improve: Content warnings for religious criticism #### Representation - Present: Male voices in theological discussion - Improve: Diverse perspectives on religious accountability #### Psychological safety - Present: Respectful critique of public figures - Improve: Clear guidelines for constructive religious dialogue ### ✅ Logical Validity #### Strong reasoning - Inductive strength: Uses specific failed prophecy to support broader accountability arguments - Causal reasoning: Links lack of local accountability to persistence of false prophecy - Evidential support: Provides concrete population data to verify prophetic failure #### Fallacies - Ad hominem: Some personal attacks on Bill Johnson's discernment rather than focusing on systemic issues - Hasty generalization: May overgeneralize from single case study to broader prophetic ministry patterns #### Tone of voice - Overall tone: Critical but measured, focusing on accountability rather than personal attack ### 🛡️ DARVO Analysis - Deny: No denial patterns observed in the accountability discussion - Attack: Some criticism of prophetic figures but focused on public claims rather than personal attacks - Reverse victim/offender: No victim/offender reversal detected - Emotional cues and rhetoric: Measured criticism focused on verifiable claims and community protection ## 🎯 Conclusion The documented failure of the 2009 Reading population prophecy illustrates the critical need for accountability mechanisms in religious communities. Local prophetic ministry with community-based testing appears more effective than public platform prophecy for maintaining accuracy and protecting communities from false claims. The emphasis on character assessment alongside spiritual evaluation provides a practical framework for religious discernment. ## 🧱 Refactor Appendix ### 📚 Literature Split Pad Purpose: Stage CEE units that become Literature notes. Split level: H3 ### [H1] Failed prophecies persist in platform ministry contexts > [!quote] [Mike Winger Exposes Another Failed Prophecy](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ) by [[Sean McDowell]] via [[YouTube]]. Published 2024. Accessed 2024-12-19. > "Reading is about to advance quickly as a city, doubling in size." 2009 prophecy completely failed - Reading grew only 4% from 89,861 to 93,500 over 14 years. Demonstrates need for measurable accountability in prophetic ministry. [view highlight](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ#H1) #xref #articleseed ID:rw_prophecy_accountability ### [H2] Scripture requires no testing while prophecy demands community evaluation > [!quote] [Mike Winger Exposes Another Failed Prophecy](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ) > "we don't test scripture. We receive scripture. But the scripture does tell us to test prophecy" Establishes hierarchical authority structure between canonical text and contemporary prophecy. Provides theological framework for prophetic accountability. [view highlight](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ#H2) #xref ID:rw_biblical_authority ### [H3] Local prophetic ministry enables character-based accountability > [!quote] [Mike Winger Exposes Another Failed Prophecy](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ) > "if he's a local guy... word's going to get around and there's going to be a wolf in the pen" Community proximity allows assessment of both prophetic accuracy and personal character. Contrasts with platform ministry where character evaluation is impossible. [view highlight](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ#H3) #xref ID:rw_community_discernment --- ### 🔖 Atomic Split Pad (Zettel Candidates) Purpose: Promote reusable claims into Atomic notes. Split level: H4 #### [Z1] Measurable prophecies enable objective accountability - Scope: Prophecies making specific, verifiable claims about future events - Pointer: Population data from 2010-2024 census records - Links: [[Prophetic-Accountability]] [[Religious-Verification]] #### [Z2] Character assessment improves spiritual discernment - Scope: Local religious contexts where personal character is observable - Pointer: Discussion of judging prophets by their fruit - Links: [[Community-Leadership]] [[Spiritual-Discernment]] #### [Z3] Public --- # 📄 Full Transcript *Auto-generated from YouTube captions · timestamps roughly every 30 seconds · [watch on YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSpRMR5xElQ)* **[00:00]** Mike highlights a video of Bill Johnson prophesying that the population of Redding would double. So, here we go. The failed prophecy of Bethel, Redding. The failed prophecy that I will add again a move to Redding type prophecy where he's trying to get people to uproot their lives and move to his town. Um for whatever reason, I don't always read the words that we get, the prophetic words. Um but this one was given to me this week by Steve Witt. Steve Witt has been a very accurate and faithful prophetic **[00:31]** voice. >> Okay, again, uh it doesn't mean anything when Bill says someone's very accurate and faithful cuz he said that about Shawn Bolz and then continued to endorse him even after everything was exposed. Um insanely. Let's look at the prophecy. And uh there's one phrase in here that that helped me to realize I really need to read this to you, even though the whole thing is good for all of us. Um This is the Redding anointing, a chief navigator in perilous times. Remember that phrase for you. I think the shortcut to Bill's heart is prophesy **[01:03]** something good about him. Chief navigator in perilous times. Redding is about to advance quickly as a city, doubling in size. >> Steve Witt should have said that the next decade is going to be the slowest growth that Redding has seen in 100 years. First prophecy, Redding's going to double in size. That was 2009. And you can see Steve's got numbers up through 2019. I can give you their population in 2024 is 93,500. It didn't double in size. It went from 89,861 in 2010 up to 93,502, **[01:35]** which is uh not not doubling in size, not remotely. >> And it didn't. And there's Benny Hinn has prophesied a bunch of stuff that didn't come to pass. I I do understand that I I want to say you guys' position, but there does seem to be some distinction between Old Testament prophecy and New Testament prophecy. Mm, that's a debate to have. >> It is a debate to have. >> okay. We actually don't have that as a position. You don't have that as a position. Okay, I thought that's what last time >> we do believe there is a difference between Old Testament and New Testament **[02:06]** when it comes to the prevalence of prophecy. Meaning that in the new covenant, the people of God are considered a prophetic people. It accords with Joel 2, fulfilled in Acts 2. Um but we wouldn't necessarily say that that prophecy, the nature of it changed. Just that it's now widespread. Okay. There was prophecy in the Old Testament that was not inscripturated. And there was prophecy in the Old Testament that was inscripturated. Okay. So like Isaiah, scripture, right? Um but like Samuel had a school of prophets. None of them wrote scripture. **[02:38]** Right? So like that that is non-scripture prophecy. And then there's scripture prophecy. In the same way in the New Testament, we've got guys who you know, Philip's daughters aren't writing scripture. But John the Revelator, that whole book's about prophecy, right? And that's scripture. So it's like that those categories of like there are prophecies in the Old Testament that were canonical, and the same in the new. But that doesn't mean all prophecy is therefore canonical in that in that sense. You could say there's varying degrees of authority when it comes to the various revelations that God gives. **[03:09]** >> Sure. One revelation would be scripture, and that would be the foundation level authoritative word of God. >> Okay. Um Paul seems to distinguish between these two in Corinthians. You know, he's got all these people prophesying, and he say, "Hey, let him who thinks he's a prophet recognize that what I'm writing are the very words of God." And so and he's talking to the prophets when he says that. But then when it comes to their prophetic words, he doesn't say just recognize it's God. He says, "Let two or three prophets speak. Let others pass judgment." **[03:39]** >> Right. And when you say more authoritative, I mean, the reality is God is ultimately authoritative however he speaks, whether through scripture or through a prophetic word. But we don't test scripture. We receive scripture. But the scripture does tell us to test prophecy. So an untest So when somebody is prophesying, we can't take it as immediately and automatically authoritative in the same way when we open up a Bible, we can take it as immediately and automatically authoritative. This must be tested. At **[04:10]** the end of the day, if it's tested, if it's weighed, if a whole community say like we can say this is authoritative. But at the But again, at the end of the day, the the scriptures the more sure word of prophecy because even a whole community could test it incorrectly and that's happened at Bethel, as you mentioned. This is why we say let prophecy be local again. Make prophecy local because we want the actual prophetic words to be tested by the community in which they're spoken in. When you put it out there on the YouTube, uh there is no testing of it. And there's no way to hold those people **[04:40]** accountable for it. Which is why you need people also doing YouTube reviews. Yeah. And they resist accountability, too, because whenever it you know, they they want you to do a Matthew 18 and go and and talk to them personally in order to have a conversation with about their word before you evaluate their word publicly. But you didn't come and prophesy that word to me privately before you gave it publicly. >> exactly. Whereas we would say, you know, what? Public teaching, public prophecy is publicly evaluated. That's just the way it is. Yeah. Yeah. So go ahead. I'm sorry. No, okay. Last thing I'll say is **[05:11]** the one of the other reasons is not just for disciplinary reasons for why we want prophecy local, but because we want the people receiving prophecies to not just be wowed by the prophecy, but be wowed by the character of the person giving the prophecy. Yeah. Right? Like I actually want to know oh, the person that's prophesying to me, like I I know that they're sacrificial, that they that they they love their spouse, they they really care about the scriptures, they're a faithful teacher, they're they're a faithful student of God's word. Maybe they don't have to be a a teacher necessarily, but They're orthodox. >> They're orthodox and like they you know, **[05:42]** they they love the body of Christ well and they share the gospel with the lost, they take care of the poor, it's like I I I want you to know that the person that's doing ministry is a person of of character and integrity because you're supposed to be able to judge profits by their fruit. And so often we just try to judge them by their prophetic word and I think that's where we got off because if if we're going to bring it back to Sean for example, if he's a local guy, you know, and he's he's praying on people in the church, word's going to get around. And and there's going to there's a wolf in the pen and people are going to figure it out. But because this guy's **[06:12]** able to be itinerant, um people don't catch on as quick. Yeah. Guys, the second annual Blessed God Summit [music] is happening March 5th, 6th, and 7th here in beautiful Oceanside, California. Right here on the beach, the Seabird Resort is right in front of me and it is going to be amazing. We have myself, Ruslan KD. [music] We have West Huff as our keynote for night one. We have KB and Ameen from Southside Rabbi, Josh, Nado, Dustin Tavella, [music] America's Got Talent winner. And we just confirmed the **[06:43]** legendary Indie Tribe doing [music] a live performance as well as Gavin Ortlund, Dr. Shawn McDowell, and there's more >> [music] >> to be announced. I'll see you guys in the comments. I see you engaging. I appreciate the support. But we need some of you to come off of the comments and come join us in person [music] at the Blessed God Summit. Go to blessedgodsummit.com, save some money, and get yourself out here March 5th, 6th, and 7th. **[07:15]** >> [music] >> I decided to just come not really knowing what to expect and man, I'm so glad that I did. >> expect it to be so intimate. [music] And so like the group of people that was there, I think it was great. We were able to see people who were truly seeking [music] God. We got to see a ton of people who are specially we'll call it in the industry. One of our major takeaways has just been how God blesses in being faithful. A lot of Christians just want to chase after success instead of chasing faithfulness. **[07:45]** >> I think it's just been really effective how like everybody has been teaching you how they've been able to like follow Jesus and make disciples as they're going. It's a really classy summit. [music] I am just very impressed with the quality and the structure >> [music] >> and just a very classy, very nice. >> Much as like we can get so much from online content, there's a huge difference between being [music] here. None of these people are egotistical. They'll shake hands with you. >> I did the sponsorship back in November and just left it in God's hands and just **[08:17]** prepared myself if he allowed it that I would be here. Here I am. >> People that you're going to meet are amazing. >> You're going to meet friends here and you're also going to be edified. Honestly amazed at the diversity in the in the need. >> It's a super fun time. So you guys are not going to want to miss out.