The Battle for the Soul of the Catholic Church  ## Metadata - Author: [[Fresh Air]] - Full Title: The Battle for the Soul of the Catholic Church - Category: #podcasts - URL: https://share.snipd.com/episode/ce989295-32da-41dd-a810-d9d862b63046 ## Document Notes ## Highlights - **Sister Pascalina's Influence** - Sister Pascalina, Pius XII's housekeeper, may have been a highly influential woman in the Catholic Church. - She reportedly urged Pius XII to condemn the Holocaust and sheltered Jews in Vatican City. Transcript: Dave Davies You know, I want to begin by talking just briefly about Pope Pius XII. He's the first pope in your book. He was there during World War II, and it's kind of striking and ironic that during World War II, the Pope in the Vatican at that time had a great familiarity with and affection for Germany. He'd been a Vatican diplomat in Germany. He is known for not having spoken out against Nazi crimes despite substantial evidence that he was aware of them. But there's even more. You tell a story in the book which was new to me of this Pope Pius before he was Pope, when he was an archbishop in Munich, meeting personally with a then-rising Adolf Hitler. What happened here? Philip Shenon I think it's fair to say that Pacelli loved Germany more than he loved his homeland, Italy. Dave Davies Pacelli being the name of the cardinal before he became Pope, yeah. Philip Shenon Right. And he is the Vatican's diplomatic representative to Bavaria and later to Germany for a dozen years after World War I. And he, in Germany, becomes much more alarmed about the potential rise of Marxist than fascist. And the story told by his former housekeeper is that he meets with Hitler in the diplomatic residence in Munich and hands him an envelope. Peter stuffed with cash that he wants Hitler to use to campaign against Marxists in Germany. And the housekeeper and certainly others around Pius over the decades believed that his love of Germany affected much of his decision-making and led to this decision throughout World War II to remain silent about the Holocaust. Dave Davies This housekeeper, Sister Pascalina Leonard, it turns out was a very close advisor of Pius, wrote these interesting diaries. And it said that she actually advised him to speak out against the Nazis during World War II when all this was happening, right? Philip Shenon It's fascinating to discover her because there's reason to believe that this nun, Sister Pascalina Leonard, this sort of tough-willed barbarian nun, may have been one of the most Influential women in the history of the Catholic Church. She was very close to Pius for decades. She was this housekeeper, but she also seems to have been a close advisor. And she tells the story. There's some dispute about what she says about Pius, but she tells a Boston newspaperman that throughout the war, she pressed Pius to speak out against Nazi Germany to protest the Holocaust, And Pius would not give into her pressure. There's also reason to believe that she had a hand in saving thousands of lives in Rome, the lives of Roman Jews, because when Nazi Germany marched into Rome in 1943, she pressured Pius To shelter thousands of Jews in Vatican City. And her role in the Vatican has largely gone untold because there's been an effort to make sure it's not told, that there was a fear that the disclosure of her influence on Pius would be Scandalous. Certainly the thought that a woman had this much influence on a pope would have been seen as scandalous at the time. ([Time 0:01:53](https://share.snipd.com/snip/65811b59-5cde-4568-afec-44251d159bef)) - **Pius XII's Plea for Mercy** - Pope Pius XII's will, discovered after his death, was surprisingly short, a bleak plea for mercy. - This fueled debate, with some theorizing he sought forgiveness for his silence on the Holocaust. Transcript: Dave Davies Before we leave Pope Pius, I want to mention the will. When he died, there was a very short will which was discovered, and, well, it was kind of surprising. What did it say? Philip Shenon Over the centuries, popes had left wills. They left documents that sort of established how their earthly belongings would be divided up and to thank their maids and advisors and to sort of highlight the accomplishments of Their papacy. When Pius dies, there's a frantic search for his will, which is eventually found at the bottom of a locked desk drawer in the papal apartment. And his deputies are stunned by it because it's so short and it's simply a bleak plea for mercy. It's eight sentences long. He says nothing about his earthly belongings. He says nothing about his gratitude towards his aides and advisors, no mention of the accomplishments of his papacy. It's a plea for mercy from God. And he talks about the need for forgiveness from those who he has sinned against or scandalized. There's a fierce debate after his death about why he would feel the need to make this bleak plea for mercy. There's certainly a theory offered that he knew that when the truth about his actions or inactions during World War II in terms of not speaking out against the Holocaust became known, It would forever tarnish his legacy, that he needed God's mercy for his failings during World War II. ([Time 0:05:07](https://share.snipd.com/snip/ae329ded-aabb-4e7a-9d2f-06503fea6293)) - **John XXIII's Reforms** - Pope John XXIII, succeeding Pius XII, signaled a departure from his predecessor's grimness. - Known for jokes and mocking infallibility, he initiated the Second Vatican Council for church reform. Transcript: Dave Davies So in 1958, after Pope Pius dies, the cardinals in the Vatican gather to select the new pope. We're all familiar with this ritual. They settle on an Italian bishop, Angelo Giuseppe Roncalli, who takes the name Pope John XXIII. He's short, quite overweight, not the most imposing figure visually. But you say, without saying so directly, he made it clear quickly that things were going to be different from the grim sobriety of the previous pope. What did he do? Philip Shenon Well, he's really the hero of this book, but he is this roly-poly Italian man, balding, treasures his peasant roots, who suddenly finds himself thrust into the leadership of the Roman Catholic Church. And he makes clear from the very start that, as you say, the grim sobriety of Pius's reign is over. He loves telling jokes. He loves mocking the idea of an infallible pope. He is really a blank slate when he's elected in terms of doctrinal matters. But he quickly makes clear that he's ready to overhaul the Catholic Church. He's ready to invite the world's bishops to come to Rome to remake it as they see fit without his interference. And this leads to the Second Vatican Council, where the world's bishops are invited to Rome and told they can remake the church as they wish without his interference. All ([Time 0:06:36](https://share.snipd.com/snip/2b235391-6ef3-4713-865e-deb5a1241f9e)) - **Origins of Priestly Celibacy** - Priestly celibacy, not biblically mandated, was decreed by Pope Gregory in the 11th century. - This rule likely aimed to address promiscuity and redirect wealth to the Church. Transcript: Dave Davies Right. Let's talk about some of the issues of potential reform that came up at the Vatican II Council, some issues that the church was confronting. One of them was the longstanding practice of requiring priests to remain unmarried and celibate. Now, there's a fascinating history here, right? This was not always the case, right? Philip Shenon You know, going into this project, I think I had in the back of my mind the idea that, you know, the doctrine of priestly celibacy, that the priest couldn't marry and have families and All the rest of it, that this was sort of eternal and had been decreed in the Gospels. Well, that's not true at all. It's not in the Gospels. In fact, most of Jesus's apostles and, you know, the larger band of disciples, they were married. The apostle Peter, the first bishop of Rome, had a wife and a mother-in And in three of the four Gospels, Jesus heals his mother-in What happens is after the first thousand years after The crucifixion, a thousand years in which priests got married and had kids and knew the comfort and the chaos of a family, a strong-willed pope in the 11th century by the name of Gregory Decreed that from that moment on, priests and bishops could no longer marry. They had to be, in fact, fully celibate, and that included men who were then already married. Gregory's motivation, historians will tell you, had something to do with the scandals of a group of shockingly promiscuous bishops in Rome. But there's also reason to believe it had something to do with money, that if priests were allowed to marry and have children when they died, their estates, you know, their homes or anything Else of value would be turned over to their survivors. Well, if you decree that priests can't marry, they can't have kids, the money goes to the church. And over the history of the church, many priests, many bishops had come from families of great wealth or royalty, in fact. And if you decree that they can have no family to leave their wealth to, that wealth comes to the church. So Gregory's decision promised, you know, a vast new source of income for the church. ([Time 0:07:55](https://share.snipd.com/snip/27854ffc-b336-4328-8a28-88be22034d8d)) - **Birth Control Ban** - The Catholic Church's ban on birth control, implemented in the 1930s, caused hardship for families. - Theologians argue there's minimal biblical basis for this ban. Transcript: Dave Davies Was another issue involving sexuality, and that is birth control. I mean, it was against Catholic doctrine. There was thought that perhaps it's time to change that. You write about a Belgian bishop, Leo Joseph Sunens, who talked about his experiences hearing the confessions of women and what this restriction meant for them in their lives. Philip Shenon Well, for generations, for centuries, Catholics understandably wanted to control the size of their families. But the church opposed birth control and put that into writing in the 1930s. The pope at the time decreed that birth control was a sin and therefore was banned for all Catholics. And that was issued in response to what was the sudden availability of reliable birth control in the form of latex condoms. And priests at the time, and in the decades that followed, commonly heard from women and from married couples that this was a terrible burden on them. They needed to be able to control the size of their families. They needed to be able to feed the kids they already had. And theologians will tell you there's actually not much justification for the ban. The New Testament says almost nothing about birth control. And by the time the Second Vatican Council was underway, there were many priests who intended to make sure that the ban on birth control was lifted. ([Time 0:10:55](https://share.snipd.com/snip/c550a3e7-8656-430c-b14b-defde39b0642)) - **End of Latin Mass** - Vatican II allowed Mass in vernacular languages, a significant change from the centuries-long Latin tradition. - Latin was adopted only in the 4th century, not the original language of the Church. Transcript: Dave Davies Was one really significant change, which was it was decreed that the priest did not have to conduct mass solely in Latin, which meant that people around the world could understand more Of what was being said. That was really the one enduring change, wasn't it? Philip Shenon There were several. I mean, the Vatican II, it really was a revolutionary gathering, even though I think to this day, most devout Catholics, including lots of devout Catholics I know, can't really tell You what happened at Vatican II, in part because it was conducted in Latin. There's still a lot of confusion about exactly what happened and when. But since the 4th century, the church had decreed that all worship services be conducted in Latin, even though over the centuries Latin became sort of a dead language to the world. Certainly by the 20th century, most Catholics didn't speak it. Even most bishops didn't really understand it. And there'd been an effort over the centuries, and certainly in the 20th century by many theologians, to try to convince popes to allow the mass to be said in the vernacular, in local Languages. And popes had resisted that aggressively. Second Vatican Council, this question came before the world's bishops. And it was clear that most of them were eager to see an end to the Latin mass, at least an end to the exclusive use of Latin. And something that I learned in the course of this that I hadn't really understood before is that, you know, Jesus did not speak to his disciples in Latin. He spoke to them in Aramaic, which was similar to Hebrew. And then for 300 years after the crucifixion, the language of the church was Greek. And it's only in the fourth century when church power moves to Rome that Latin is introduced. So you can argue that Latin really hasn't been the appropriate language for hundreds of years, and this move to the vernacular becomes very popular. And today, all Catholics can see and hear the changes of Vatican II for themselves by hearing the mass performed in languages they understand. ([Time 0:12:26](https://share.snipd.com/snip/8ecac36c-d1c7-477f-aa86-595903e05ddd)) - **McCarrick's Promotion Despite Warnings** - Cardinal O'Connor warned Pope John Paul II against promoting McCarrick due to sexual predation allegations. - The Pope ignored this, promoting McCarrick to Cardinal and Archbishop of Washington D.C. Transcript: Philip Shenon Think the single most eye-popping document I came across in all my years of research was a letter written in 1999 by Cardinal John O'Connor of New York, arguably the most powerful churchman In America, to Pope John Paul II. And to back up a bit, Cardinal O'Connor had just been informed that he was about to die. He just had brain surgery. He had only weeks to live. And one of his final acts on this earth was to write this letter in late 1999 that was a dire warning to the pope that he must not promote Archbishop Theodore McCarrick, who was then based In Newark, New Jersey. He must not be promoted to any higher office in the church because of widespread well-known evidence that he was a sexual predator. And O'Connor offers quite explicit information about McCarrick, including the fact that he liked to invite young men to his home for dinner and then insist that they sleep with him In his bed. Even though this letter is presented to the Pope by a respected senior churchman in the United States, Pope John Paul ignores this warning from Cardinal O'Connor and ignores warnings From lots of other senior Vatican officials who also know about McCarrick, and still promotes him to a membership in the College of Cardinals, and makes him Archbishop of Washington, D.C. And McCarrick then goes on for decades to continue to be involved in sexual misconduct with young men and boys. You ([Time 0:27:36](https://share.snipd.com/snip/47a0f1d0-c519-4473-ac2d-ec303075fa05)) - **McCarrick's Gift to Benedict XVI** - McCarrick gave a $250,000 check to Pope Benedict XVI. - This large gift raised concerns about potential bribery and influence within the Vatican. Transcript: Dave Davies Know, his case also brings up something which kind of shocked me when I read it in your book was that it's perfectly acceptable for bishops in the Vatican to accept large cash gifts. And in fact, there was one that Father McCarrick himself, when he was under suspicion of sexual abuse, gave a $250,000 check to, I believe it was the newly elected pope, then Benedict XVI. Is this right? Philip Shenon This has been going on for centuries, that bishops and cardinals in Rome can accept large cash gifts. And there's always been concern that essentially this is a form of bribery, that you could buy the favor of a bishop or cardinal by giving him a big gift or by giving him a trip or by giving Him the renovation of his apartment, as often happens. And McCarrick was well known in Rome as a man with access to a lot of cash. He was one of the best fundraisers in the church. He gave a lot of big gifts to bishops and cardinals. And certainly it appears that he's giving these gifts in part to buy their cooperation and to allow himself to advance within the church to prevent any sort of investigation of his sexual Misconduct. Check ever written from his personal charity account was a check for a quarter million dollars to Pope Benedict shortly after Pope Benedict was elected in 2005. And this comes at a particularly important moment for McCarrick because he's now facing mandatory retirement age of 75. He wants to remain in his post. And so the concern is that he made this big secret gift to the pope in hopes of staying in place in Washington. And in fact, that's what happened. He was then allowed to remain in his post for another couple of years. I should point out that Benedict and his aides denied that was any sort of quid pro quo. But McCarrick remained in place in Washington, a decision made by the Pope shortly after McCarrick presents the Pope with a quarter million dollars. I ([Time 0:29:23](https://share.snipd.com/snip/39c20525-f7a5-4a0d-ada2-713ea834d4b9)) - **Pope Francis and Limited Reform** - Pope Francis, like John XXIII, rejected opulent papal traditions, enhancing his moral legitimacy. - While making overtures to marginalized groups, substantial doctrinal changes remain limited. Transcript: Dave Davies I want to talk about Pope Francis, the current pope who, as you and I record this, is suffering from pneumonia. I hope he does well and recovers. He was elected in 2013 and he took the name of Francis of Assisi, the 13th century cleric who wore rags and focused on the needs of the poor. It's interesting that when he took office, the initial impression kind of reminds you of John XXIII, the guy who initiated the Second Vatican Council, in that Francis sort of rejected Some of the finer trappings of the office. Tell us about that. Philip Shenon The comparison was made pretty early on that Francis was much like John XXIII in that he was talking about sort of an end to the closed fortress authoritarian church. He wanted to move the church toward declarations of mercy and tolerance, that he wanted to put the church out of the business of heresy hunting. And he also, I think, delighted millions of Catholics by sort of rejecting all the sort of pompous trappings of the papacy. He refused and continues to refuse to live in the papal palace. He lives in a small guest house. He refused, you know, the big Mercedes sedan that popes had traditionally used. He's, you know, by giving up the trappings of power, he's got a moral legitimacy that has a lot of appeal to millions of Catholics. Dave Davies So, you know, what about some of the rules that had been in place for so long that had been controversial, like the refusal to provide communion to Catholics who had been divorced, giving Sacraments to gay couples, that kind of thing. What's actually changed? Philip Shenon Little has changed in terms of formal doctrine. And I think one great concern about Pope Francis is that since he hasn't made these sort of substantial changes in church teachings, a future pope could just reverse them as easily as Francis put them into place. But Francis has gone out of his way to reach out to gay Catholics, to divorced Catholics. He's made it much easier for divorced couples to get annulments that allow them to remarry. He's also allowed them to receive communion, which had been denied to divorced Catholics for centuries. He made it possible a couple of years ago for priests to offer blessings at gay weddings, even though that decision created an awful lot of scandal among conservative Catholics around The world. ([Time 0:32:33](https://share.snipd.com/snip/de15cc42-fea8-40be-95ba-1701113ea72f))