TikTok Is Coming for eBay - DTNS 5143  ## Metadata - Author: [[Daily Tech News Show]] - Full Title: TikTok Is Coming for eBay - DTNS 5143 - Category: #podcasts - URL: https://share.snipd.com/episode/6d227ef7-f613-4057-b38b-f113fc0f30b5 ## Document Notes ## Highlights - **TikTok Shop's Rapid Rise** - Echo Tick estimated TikTok Shop sold ~$19B worldwide from July–September, placing it nearly level with eBay's $20.1B in the same quarter. - TikTok's U.S. sales grew rapidly and made the U.S. its largest market outside China during that period. Transcript: Robb Dunewood There's an analytics firm out there called Echo Tick that pulled price and sales volumes of individual products on the TikTok shop. So that's stuff you can see. Anybody can see that stuff. But it did it on a massive scale so that it could estimate that TikTok shop sold about $19 billion worth of products worldwide from July through September. Now, Music Ally points out that Echo Tick's business is to provide analytics and other tools to creators. So, you know, if they can show the TikTok shop is booming, that's probably better for its business as well. But these numbers are checkable. They seem to be rather reliable. And that would make U.S. The largest market for TikTok shop. Now, if you're like, hey, U.S. Bigger than China? No, TikTok doesn't operate in China. Duyen operates in China. It's pretty much the same thing as TikTok, but it's a separate app. So that is not included in here. So we leave China out. U.S. Becomes the largest market for TikTok shop. And U.S. Made four to four and a half billion dollars of that 19 billion dollars. That's a rise of 125 percent from the previous quarter. The next markets after it are Thailand, Indonesia, Vietnam and the Philippines. Those are smaller markets, though. So you lump all four of those together, they're actually bigger than the U.S. ([Time 0:02:27](https://share.snipd.com/snip/3f330a19-3024-44db-adc9-9cabc4ab4f38)) - **Live Streaming vs Short Clips** - Live shopping drives massive e‑commerce engagement in China but remains a smaller slice in the U.S., where short influencer clips dominate. - TikTok reports fast year‑over‑year growth in live sessions and sales, though from smaller bases. Transcript: Robb Dunewood Live streaming shopping in China is a whole other world. You have the equivalent of mainland Chinese celebrities to Taylor Swift and Beyonce showing up on live stream shopping in China. They have comedians, they have variety shows. It is a much bigger deal than what you think of in the US, which is QVC. So it has made slow progress in the US because Beyonce is not going to go on a TikTok live stream, not for the amount of money they're going to pay her. However, it is one of ByteDance's main revenue generators in mainland China. Livestream e-commerce accounts for around 50% of DuYan's traffic. Total shopping is only 20% of U.S. Traffic. And that's not live. That's just total shopping on U.S. TikTok. Live is a smaller percentage of that. About one out of 10 of the 20% who do shopping do it from live. Nevertheless, TikTok told Wired that TikTok shop live shopping sessions were rising up 72% year over year in September and that sales are up 120% year over year in June. When you're coming from a smaller number, you can get those bigger percentage rises, but still it's significant when you got $19 billion in sales. ([Time 0:04:16](https://share.snipd.com/snip/d84f2fee-11d7-481f-8573-bb9b59aa062f)) - **Creators Fuel U.S. TikTok Commerce** - U.S. TikTok adoption skews toward influencer-led discovery rather than celebrity-driven livestream spectacles seen in China. - That makes TikTok Shop's U.S. growth more about creators and product demos than megastar events. Transcript: Tom Merritt I knew the TikTok shop was big here in the U.S. I didn't know that it rivaled eBay. Maybe because I'm born in the 70s, when I think of like an online shop where you go and buy stuff that regular people are selling. EBay is the first place that I think of. But I would venture that if you're born probably in the 90s or later that TikTok shop or even Facebook marketplace, you probably think of those places first. But for this to be rivaling eBay, and I knew it was big. I didn't know it was that big. Robb Dunewood Yeah. I think in the broadest sense, those are comparable, but you go to eBay for different reasons. You go to eBay often to find used things or discounted items. Whereas you're going to TikTok, you are possibly not shopping for a particular thing. You're just shopping, quote unquote, right? You're seeing what people are talking about or you've got a broad idea of like i need a clothing steamer but what's the best one let me look on tick tock and see what people are ([Time 0:05:38](https://share.snipd.com/snip/bc73b618-ef92-4e28-8411-7a2708050e32)) - **Buyer Returned Amazon For TikTok Find** - Robb recounts a buyer who returned an Amazon purchase after seeing a better product on TikTok Shop. - The anecdote illustrates TikTok's power to displace purchases through compelling video demos. Transcript: Robb Dunewood You're just shopping, quote unquote, right? You're seeing what people are talking about or you've got a broad idea of like i need a clothing steamer but what's the best one let me look on tick tock and see what people are saying i see One in action uh i can tell it works because it's on the video and then i buy it uh there was in the wired article on this uh an anecdote of somebody who bought one on amazon then saw one on TikTok That looked better, bought it from TikTok shop and returned the one on Amazon because it did work better. ([Time 0:06:29](https://share.snipd.com/snip/574c477c-3cba-4b52-920d-4b3b03974cf6)) - **Regulatory Uncertainty Benefits ByteDance** - TikTok's regulatory future in the U.S. remains uncertain but postponements benefit ByteDance while revenue grows. - Any enforced change risks disrupting creator and seller behavior and could drive users elsewhere. Transcript: Robb Dunewood Meanwhile, it's revenue and its importance to the economy keeps growing. Tom Merritt I do wonder as well, because if I'm bite dance at this point, it's like, let's just keep doing what we're doing and keep kicking this can down the road, proverbially, as you just said, Because why change if you don't have to? I think something eventually is going to happen, but eventually could be a very, very long time from now. And even if something does happen in January, it's not like that's going to be U.S. TikTok in January. We still could be six months, a year out before we actually see something running here. And I know a big concern for a lot of creators on TikTok is that, well, what happens to TikTok Shop? That doesn't come to the U.S. That's still a bite dance type of thing. So how does that how do those waters get navigated? I don't know that that's been figured out yet. Robb Dunewood Yeah, the things that I've read and like you say, nothing nothing has been definitive. So this could change or the reporting could be, you know, off base. But what I've read is that sales of advertising and TikTok shop will continue to be run by ByteDance. It's the algorithm, it's the recommendations, it's the hosting of the personal data that would be moved to a US company. But it sounds like what they would like to do is just move all that backend stuff and then leave everything else the same so that TikTok shop keeps rolling along, makes a bunch of revenue, And that new company gets a cut of that. Tom Merritt Yeah, it'll be interesting to see. That's what we're being told, but we have to actually see this stuff put into implementation and actually work. And the thing that I would imagine that anyone involved in US TikTok is thinking right now, whatever we do, we cannot interrupt what people already do because we know that people are Fickle. If it doesn't feel like TikTok, they'll go do something different. And that really worries still a lot of people who are selling on TikTok shop. ([Time 0:09:15](https://share.snipd.com/snip/b90a8cf6-5e62-481b-abee-07cce5700f3e)) - **Smaller Studios Embrace Generative VFX** - Smaller studios use generative models widely for VFX and crowd replication while staying within union rules. - That adoption saves money and lets niche creators compete with higher production value. Transcript: Robb Dunewood Yeah, it seems like this is an example of a smaller studio with a dedicated audience being able to work within the rules. Nobody's accusing anybody of breaking any of the SAG-AFTRA rules that were negotiated about likenesses and training, but maybe working outside the opinion, because inside of Hollywood, The opinion is we don't like AI. We want the studios to use it as little as possible. But here you have a company that's like, hey, you know what? It made our video better. It made our offering better. And we didn't have to break the bank to do it. Tom Merritt Yeah, this is where I think the studios are in between a rock and a hard place. They do not want to lose the industry, the people who are working in the industry. But I don't even want to say that it's a uniquely American thing. This is a thing kind of globally. But you can go somewhere else because the laws are different. They are the rules are different there with the unions and such that it's way less expensive to create content someplace else than it is to create content here. That is ultimately going to have to be wrestled with, because I don't see this going away. I don't see a time where we're going, you know, when companies are going to say less, let's be less productive than we can be. Let's spend more money than we need to. Some might, but most won't. So this is something that's going to ultimately have to get figured out and have to be addressed. Robb Dunewood Wonder projects here in the United States, working within the rules, saving money. ([Time 0:16:10](https://share.snipd.com/snip/ef0b0894-fa7f-479a-b8b1-8faf7a4df403)) - **TSMC Growth Needs Context** - TSMC reported 16.9% sales growth, still meeting expectations though slower than prior quarters. - This is not definitive evidence of an AI chip bubble bursting; watch the next quarter for clearer signals. Transcript: Robb Dunewood And it's going to keep getting better right it's going to keep getting harder to tell when it was used. Speaking of the halo effect of all this stuff, TSMC reported a 16.9% rise in sales last quarter. Now it's double digit growth. You might say like, that sounds great, but it is the slowest growth for TSMC, which has been going gangbusters since February, 2024. Now it's still met analyst expectations. So you might see headlines on this that seem to contradict each other. One outlet's going to go with like TSMC disappoints, is AI slowing? Others are going to say TSMC meets analyst expectations and projects strong growth continuing. Those are all true. It's just, you can only fit one in the headline. So you're trying to decide which tactic you're going to take to bring in the readers. The analysts expected a seasonal slowing, and that's what's attributed to this. If there is a softening in demand for chips, you're going to see it in next quarter sales. So if you are concerned about this, look at TSMC's next quarterly report. ([Time 0:19:22](https://share.snipd.com/snip/705fc944-ba6a-4f8d-804b-cc72ee49c78f)) - **Satellite Features And Hidden Cameras** - Apple is working on satellite connectivity features and richer satellite messaging, but these are long‑term projects. - Underscreen camera rumors for 2027 grabbed attention because visible hardware changes remain big consumer hooks. Transcript: Tom Merritt He knows that Apple is working on additional features that are powered by satellite connectivity, bypassing carriers. That includes 5G NTN, which supplements 5G service with satellites, satellite connectivity options for app makers, satellite powered Apple Maps, rich messaging like photos and Easier usage so you don't have to point your phone to the sky. But grabbing more attention is a post from Weibo's digital chat station, which claims Apple's underscreen camera is on track to arrive in 2027. Robb Dunewood Now, German's out there probably going like, I wrote about that too. I just didn't write about it this week. I like to kind of look at German's rumors now, or his leaks, I would say. They're not really rumors. They're things that he's finding out from inside and evaluate whether they're worth the hype. Because it seems like he's very smart to publish these on Sunday, knowing that Monday news is always a little slower and it'll get pickup. But, you know, different weeks have different levels of revelation to them. I think the idea that Apple is making progress on connecting directly to satellites, which bypasses carrier, is an interesting thing to watch. These features could be interesting as well. They are not an indication that that is making fast progress, but it means Apple's still working on them. So that's how I take that. Whereas Weibo going like that underscreen camera, it's on track to arrive in 2027. That tells me digital chat station, very good at reading the tea leaves of what will be picked up by SEO. ([Time 0:22:50](https://share.snipd.com/snip/82e85451-5e0b-4212-9765-58bf48a7832e)) - **OTA Updates Don't Equal A 'Kill Switch'** - European transit operators tested Yutong buses and raised concerns about OTA firmware updates that could stop vehicles. - Vendors and security experts stress that OTA capability isn't a 'kill switch' and proper safeguards and approvals mitigate risk. Transcript: Robb Dunewood It's something you can imagine. It's something you want to see. It's something Android phones already have to a certain extent. But LG is working on some better technology to make it work even better. And apparently that's what Apple is possibly taking advantage of here. So, yeah, it the imagination. Denmark and Norway public transit providers are investigating reports that there are kill switches in the chips used on buses made by China's Yutong. Yutong is the world's largest manufacturer of buses. I take a little exception to calling these kill switches. Jepa Gard, chief operating officer of the Danish public transport provider Movia, told NBC that over the air firmware update capability. In other words, these buses have software and systems that you can push an update to over the air. You don't have to go plug them into anything to update the firmware. Means that the buses can be, and I quote, stopped remotely either by the manufacturer or by a hacker. He said this is not just a concern for Chinese made buses, but for all buses that are made with updatable software. Norway's bus operator Ruter performed tests on two Yut and one Dutch model. They were able to stop the Utah models, though they could not remotely operate them. They couldn't stop the Dutch model because it didn't have over-the updates. Utah notes that the vehicle data for EU operators is stored on AWS in Frankfurt, Germany. It's encrypted, that you cannot access it without customer authorization. So when they push an over-the update, somebody at the operator of the bus has to approve it to go to the buses. However, the UK has picked up this story and is now investigating its Utah-made buses as well. Thanks to RWNash for submitting this one on the subreddit. Tom Merritt But Rob, feels a little like uh people who run buses discovered what over-the updates are capable of so this is this is where the headline was written to get people to say oh look at that We could create a headline that says apple pushes out an update that could turn off your iphone yeah they absolutely can. They do it several times a quarter when they update what, you know, I think we're at iOS or not just iOS, but we're Apple OS is all of them are 26.1 right now, 26.2. They could literally put something in there by intention or by omission. You know, they did something getting to get tested. Something got past someone. They could literally turn your phone off. But we don't think of it like that when it comes to phones. But when it comes to buses, when it comes to these things that are mass transportation, I think we're thinking to movies like Speed and things where there are car chases to where the hacker Was able to hit the kill switch on the car carrying all the money on the armored car. And that's how they were able to get up to it and rob it and have this giant heist. That's what we think about. But it really is just, if you allow something to over the air be updated, there is a potential that the update could cause the thing to stop working as intended. That's always going to be there for the history of things being updated over the air. Robb Dunewood And could theoretically either utang itself or uh the or a malicious actor uh push an update at a bus in order to try to get it to malfunction and stop yes that can also happen to your cars Uh that can happen to anything potentially the question isn't can it happen the question is how likely is it to happen and what utah is saying is not bloody likely uh but but you know you You should invite sure you should investigate and make sure uh that you can keep it from happening uh and most of the security professionals that have been interviewed for these stories Have said the same thing which is like yeah sure it's possible uh but if you're why it's important to secure these systems to make it unlikely that it would happen. But there's no kill switch. There's this idea that there's someone in China that could press a button and all the buses in Norway stop. That's not how this works. This is just a capability that every over-the system is subject to. And I think folks are getting a little out of hand on that, maybe because they're overthinking, maybe because they have a propaganda goal. ([Time 0:24:54](https://share.snipd.com/snip/fc7c0940-8aca-437d-a75d-269e9c888b52)) - **Harden Over‑The‑Air Update Security** - Secure OTA systems with strong encryption, authorization, and phishing protections to reduce remote‑update risks. - Treat OTA as a standard engineering risk and audit processes to make malicious updates unlikely. Transcript: Robb Dunewood And could theoretically either utang itself or uh the or a malicious actor uh push an update at a bus in order to try to get it to malfunction and stop yes that can also happen to your cars Uh that can happen to anything potentially the question isn't can it happen the question is how likely is it to happen and what utah is saying is not bloody likely uh but but you know you You should invite sure you should investigate and make sure uh that you can keep it from happening uh and most of the security professionals that have been interviewed for these stories Have said the same thing which is like yeah sure it's possible uh but if you're why it's important to secure these systems to make it unlikely that it would happen. But there's no kill switch. There's this idea that there's someone in China that could press a button and all the buses in Norway stop. That's not how this works. This is just a capability that every over-the system is subject to. And I think folks are getting a little out of hand on that, maybe because they're overthinking, maybe because they have a propaganda goal. But it is interesting to see this come out of Scandinavia, where you usually don't see the more sensational things come from. Tom Merritt I think something that would be as sensational, maybe even less sensational, would be Don Cheadle speaking in a British accent, driving a white van with a big piece of tech that has liquid In it for some reason, next to the bus and firing something off and the van kind of implodes, but the bus also stops. I think that that is as likely to happen as someone actually having a kill switch that says, oh, we've got a button. We can make this bus stop. So it's if you allow something to be updated over the air, there's just going to be the potential that, you know, bad firmware. Something could happen is generally not going to be a malicious actor. Well, it could be a hacker trying to do something maliciously, but it's not going to be the company that created it trying to wreck their business model. There's no good to the company putting a kill switch in their devices because they would never sell those devices any longer if that came to light. Robb Dunewood Yeah, no, that's the ultimate point for the business side of this. ([Time 0:28:04](https://share.snipd.com/snip/8d072085-7a95-4f97-b5df-676503325e2c)) - **Watch EU's November 19 AI Move** - EU's upcoming 'digital omnibus' may create exemptions allowing companies to use personal data to train models. - Watch November 19 for regulatory moves that could reshape AI training rules in Europe. Transcript: Robb Dunewood If you want to understand the news in the future, pay attention to these. Tom Merritt Political obtained draft documents that indicate the European Commission will unveil a digital omnibus package of bills on november 19th which would among other things grant exemptions Robb Dunewood To companies to use personal data to train models set your clock for november 19th for when everyone gets even more outraged about this in europe uh u.s video sharing and cloud service Provider rumble has agreed to acquire German data infrastructure company Northern Data. And notably, cryptocurrency company Tether is an investor in both of those companies as well as a customer. Tom Merritt Coinbase is launching a platform to let individuals buy digital tokens before they are listed as an ICO on Coinbase's exchange platform. Ooh, the return of ICO buzz. Robb Dunewood On the Made by Google podcast, Gemini product manager David Sharon revealed why they called Gemini 2.5 flash image Nano Banana. Apparently, it's because it was late at night and they needed to come up with a name to submit it anonymously to LM Arena because they didn't want to admit it was Gemini at the time. So a product manager named Nina came up with it. Who knows why, but ([Time 0:30:39](https://share.snipd.com/snip/48c42f56-9df0-452d-aaa2-ad00835ad108))