Where Have All the Ultra-Slim Phones Gone - DTNS 5132  ## Metadata - Author: [[Daily Tech News Show]] - Full Title: Where Have All the Ultra-Slim Phones Gone - DTNS 5132 - Category: #podcasts - URL: https://share.snipd.com/episode/c5656bcd-23ad-4a23-b800-7f2b398959bd ## Document Notes ## Highlights - **Slim Phones Lost Their Market Moment** - Both Apple and Samsung pursued ultra-slim phones but are now cutting or canceling those models due to weak demand and lineup confusion. - Slimness didn't translate to perceived consumer value compared with trade-offs like smaller batteries and higher prices. Transcript: Jason Howell No all over that's it that sounds dangerous i'm jason howell i would now let's start with what you need to know with a big story yeah so i would say today's big story isn't big in the sense That everybody's talking about it, but it's big in my mind, just from a curiosity standpoint. Earlier this week, Tom and Sarah briefly mentioned on this show that Nikai's supply chain sources are claiming that Apple is drastically cutting orders for the iPhone Air to 10% compared To September. Now, we have notable Apple analyst Ming-Chi Kuo also sharing that demand for the slim and light iPhone by most suppliers, they're reducing their capacity by more than 80% by the first Quarter of 2026. Some components expected to be discontinued by the end of this year. So major change there. And so I, you know, I read this and then I remembered like we actually just talked about on Android faithful reports from last week that Samsung has canceled reportedly, of course, you Know, this is behind the scenes stuff. So not confirmed at this point, but canceled the Galaxy S26 Edge, which would be the follow up to the S25 Edge that came out for the first version of it this year. A swift reversal, I would say, in its plans to try and carve out a new variant for its S26 lineup. And now we have a report by reputable leaker Ice Universe, pretty reputable, I'd say, sharing that the Galaxy S26 series, the whole series, might actually get its release date pushed By a few months to March of next year. Other leakers also pointing to a similar prediction. Some of those reports are suggesting that the cancellation of the Edge series could at least be a piece of the puzzle. And so I guess the big question that I have about this is how do two major companies who have pretty good track records, I'd say, at getting some of these things right? And granted, you can't get everything right. But they both were on the slim and light train with the iPhone Air and then the S series, the Galaxy S Edge. They both really carved out and kind of made a case for like, this is another major part of our offering. And yet it really seems, in fact, key bank capital markets found, quote, virtually no demand for the iPhone Air. And, you know, we're kind of hearing the same thing about the S25 Edge. I'm just curious how they get it wrong. ([Time 0:02:48](https://share.snipd.com/snip/af7b9db1-b459-4c92-a8ce-3cab05259df9)) - **Hands-On With The Edge Phone** - Jason described his hands-on experience with the Edge as "neat" but not transformative for daily use. - He emphasized battery anxiety and fewer trade-offs made the novelty less compelling. Transcript: Jason Howell Mean, you know, it's a thinner phone. It's not necessarily a smaller phone was kind of my experience, right? Like it's still more or less the screen is basically the same size as most other phones that I use. It's just the thickness quotient was definitely a good deal smaller. I kind of found my time with the Edge to basically be, oh, that's neat. But it really didn't go much further than that, especially when you consider the tradeoffs. You know, it is more expensive. I think we were looking at it prior to recording and the S25 Edge is what, $1,100? So it's not priced inexpensive. It's not like you're getting a smaller phone and you're paying less for it. You're getting one less camera as far as the Edge is concerned. You're getting a thinner phone, yes, but you're also getting a smaller battery. And battery anxiety is something that largely I think people have. Thankfully, we have stopped experiencing quite the way that at least in the Android world, we experienced, you know, say five or 10 years ago, even. Yeah. It's it's different now. And it's hard to go back to battery anxiety land. It's hard to like suddenly find yourself considering the fact that, oh, I might not make it through the day when we've become so used to it. ([Time 0:06:47](https://share.snipd.com/snip/e1ebc3ea-0e1b-4b29-89da-9e9fdf33c0ef)) - **Perceived Value Beats Engineering Feats** - Jason found the S25 Edge technically neat but not meaningfully smaller and not worth premiums given trade-offs. - Consumers likely saw thinness as less valuable than battery life, camera count, or price. Transcript: Jason Howell Mean, you know, it's a thinner phone. It's not necessarily a smaller phone was kind of my experience, right? Like it's still more or less the screen is basically the same size as most other phones that I use. It's just the thickness quotient was definitely a good deal smaller. I kind of found my time with the Edge to basically be, oh, that's neat. But it really didn't go much further than that, especially when you consider the tradeoffs. You know, it is more expensive. I think we were looking at it prior to recording and the S25 Edge is what, $1,100? So it's not priced inexpensive. It's not like you're getting a smaller phone and you're paying less for it. You're getting one less camera as far as the Edge is concerned. You're getting a thinner phone, yes, but you're also getting a smaller battery. And battery anxiety is something that largely I think people have. Thankfully, we have stopped experiencing quite the way that at least in the Android world, we experienced, you know, say five or 10 years ago, even. Yeah. It's it's different now. And it's hard to go back to battery anxiety land. It's hard to like suddenly find yourself considering the fact that, oh, I might not make it through the day when we've become so used to it. So, but, but how much is the general consumer looking at an iPhone Air or an S25 Edge and thinking that like, yeah, is a general consumer looking at this phone and going, well, that's great, But will it last throughout my day? Will I have battery anxiety? I'm not certain that they all are, you know, thinking of it that way. Huyen Tue Dao Maybe they are. It also seems kind of odd. I think we've, it's like, where does this phone fit in the lineup? Because they are not cheap phones. They're like upper mid pricing or lower, lower, lower, lower, upper, upper, upper middle. Like they're not, as you said, they're not cheap phones. And I just feel like just compare, comparing, you know, a 1100, $1,000 slimmed down phone with some trade-offs, but that, you know, has that, you know, light, very carryable, you know, Characteristic. I just like, it feels like, I wouldn't say they're cannibalizing their other offerings, but it's a kind of a funny place to sit, isn't it? Like I feel, especially with both Samsung and iPhone and I mean, like most manufacturers, but like specifically Samsung and iPhone have just so many different offerings, like it's Already so many different levels. It just feels like it's kind of confusing um yeah that maybe they don't have a clearer even even with the thinness the fact that you know as you said there's plenty of trade-offs like battery It maybe there's just something about it just not fitting in or just it just seems like an oddball and that maybe it might lose out amongst like kind of like especially for like samsung And iphone kind of like all the like the the very long you know history of for example the S series with the three models people know it people understand kind of like the trade-offs of All three and then you get this edge in there and just feels like yeah I just don't get the story there necessarily unless and I just don't find thin not necessarily smaller as you said Thin I just don't see how it just really distinguishes itself in a significant way other than being thin, which I kind of have doubts on whether that's a good story for selling yet another Phone within like these very well established like lines of phones. I don't know. That's kind of my take. It just feels kind of an odd duck. Yeah. Jason Howell Well, it is. I totally agree. I think really when it comes down to it, it's about value. And both Apple and Samsung decided, and I don't argue that there's probably some really interesting and significant engineering feats that went into these phones to make them the Way they are. No question, that's probably why we haven't seen it before is because they figured certain things out. Of course, the iPhone Air, iFixit said that it was very repairable and very strong, which goes counter to the thought that a lot of people have, which is, oh, it's thinner. It's going to break a lot easier. It's going to be more difficult to repair components that apparently wasn't the case. So from an engineering perspective, it's probably a really great story. But I think from a general consumer, my guess is as a general consumer, if I go into a store and I see something that is thinner, which kind of indicates something less than a thicker phone, Right? Maybe less capable, less camera, smaller battery, all these things. My mind immediately goes to, okay, well then that should be lower cost versus the more premium things. And I think that these, my guess is that these companies placed a premium on the thought that these things were engineered in a way that they can get thin and light. And that's what people are willing to pay more for is the thinness and the lightness. And maybe that didn't line up with what consumers actually believe, which is, okay, well, that's nice to have. ([Time 0:06:47](https://share.snipd.com/snip/5a4ac16d-079f-46bb-be4c-9e0252956673)) - **Premiumization Versus Practical Buyers** - OEMs face tension between premiumization and cost-conscious consumers holding phones longer. - Thinness was a premium that failed to align with what most buyers prioritize today. Transcript: Huyen Tue Dao It's weird because it's like it's like for from a regular consumer level. We've talked about this at length on various shows about how, especially the last six years, people are much more economically conscious, especially with purchases like smartphones. People want to hold on to their phones longer. They want a little more value and be able to hold on to that value. And at the same time, I think CounterPoint has noted that companies are actually increasing their profits through premiumization, which is basically getting you to pay more for something That may be marginally better or that is perceived to be better, but may not necessarily be better. And I wonder if this is- Shrinkflation. Shrinkflation, exactly. And it's so weird because somehow it's working because while most consumers are more price conscious and value conscious, it's a stat that companies are increasing their profits In a significant portion due to premiumization. So I can see as being an OEM, how do we keep playing that weird balance of giving most consumers that, that the impression of value and continued value for their money, but also keep, um, I guess, exploiting this like premium, that's a hard word to say, premiumization of the market. And I also kind of feel like that is part of it too. Like part of that, they're thinking that, hey, maybe something else that we can sell is the thinness. And then as you said, it seems to be not, there's a disconnect there in maybe what they labeled as like a premium feature thinness. Because it does require a lot of engineering to make it that way. And then it's just, yeah, as you said, the consumers just don't just see smaller phone, less phone should cause less money. ([Time 0:12:20](https://share.snipd.com/snip/85e2e3cd-ad6f-4b68-802e-ac8f8319e48b)) - **Release Delays Don't Imply One Cause** - Samsung's reported delay of the Galaxy S26 release may be unrelated to Edge cancellations but could be connected. - Release timing shifts can reflect multiple internal factors, not a single cause. Transcript: Jason Howell That's probably it. I should also mention that Tom Merritt, we were chatting a little bit in Discord prior to the show, and he reminded me this morning that Samsung used to release their major Galaxy phones A bit later in the year. So the connection to the Edge stuff going on and the delay, the potential delay of the Galaxy phone release, it could be unrelated. They also could be related or at least partially part of, you know, a whole cornucopia of reasons to push things off. So I wanted to make sure that we got that word in there too. ([Time 0:14:23](https://share.snipd.com/snip/62f57052-9502-4cc5-9e09-3aeed615689e)) - **ATT Faces European Regulatory Pushback** - Apple warned it may disable App Tracking Transparency in parts of Europe amid regulatory pressure and lobbying. - Regulators view ATT as potentially anti-competitive because Apple's own apps are exempt. Transcript: Huyen Tue Dao All right, well, Apple warned that it may disable its app tracking transparency feature in Europe due to what it calls, quote, intense lobbying by advertisers and regulators in Germany And Italy, among other countries in Europe. So App Tracking Transparency ATT is a feature that gives users control over cross-app tracking by asking for permission before tracking activity across apps and websites on iOS and IPadOS devices. Apple admits that such a move would be a detriment to European consumers and that they will continue to push for the tool in those areas if they choose to disable it. So this follows a preliminary assessment in Germany that ATT could be anti-competitive in its current form. And Apple received a fine, in fact, in France two months ago related to ATT as well. Jason Howell Aspect of this. And really what they're looking at is that Apple is potentially using, I guess you could say like the privacy, they would say as it's kind of like a weapon or kind of a wedge. Its own apps are exempt. It also applies pressure on ad dependent competitors. That's why the anti-competitive nature of this exists, or at least the opinion exists. Essentially, they see this as Apple being self-preferential in how this AT, I want to say AT&T, this ATT app tracking transparency feature is implemented. Wow. Huyen Tue Dao That's a good one for Apple, to be honest, because all of that is a bit hard to read at first. And I definitely was confused when I read Any Competitive because on the surface, letting someone know when your data is moving across apps seems like a good deal. But wow. OK. Jason Howell But, you know, as far as consumers are concerned, like I think consumer pushback on this also is. Yeah, but we do want to know these things. We do want to know. Obviously, you know, if there's an anti-competitive aspect to this that Apple is applying to others and not to its own. That's something to consider, but it's kind of one of those situations where it's baby with bathwater sort of thing. It's like, well, okay, now you don't get it at all. And I think consumers do want that control, right? ([Time 0:18:42](https://share.snipd.com/snip/454fee4b-45f6-4526-af97-44031699677c)) - **Intel's Cautious Recovery Focuses On AI** - Intel reported its first profit in two years but warned chip shortages and yield issues will persist into 2026. - The company will prioritize AI server chips and limit some consumer CPU output during recovery. Transcript: Jason Howell Sure, for sure. Intel's Q3 earnings call revealed that the company is in a cautious recovery period. It's reported its first profit in two years. So that's the good news. Intel CEO Lit Bhutan said chip shortages will persist into early 2026. And the company will put more resources into AI server production, while also limiting its consumer CPU output. Now, much of its recovery is due to some financial lifelines, much needed lifelines that it got from partners like NVIDIA, SoftBank, and the US government. So that's part of the reason why they're kind of seeing their first profit here. So I guess you could put a little asterisk next to that. They've helped stabilize company operations after a few challenging years. ([Time 0:21:04](https://share.snipd.com/snip/251fe585-6d1f-4838-a694-1c349c91e389)) - **Anthropic Expands Compute With Multi-Cloud** - Anthropic struck a major TPU deal with Google for up to 1 million TPUs and a gigawatt of capacity in 2026. - The firm pursues a multi-cloud strategy across Google, AWS, and NVIDIA for price and performance flexibility. Transcript: Huyen Tue Dao All right. Well, speaking of AI, Anthropik has struck a partnership with Google that gives them access to up to 1 million of Google's tensor processing units in a major expansion of its compute Capacity. The deal will bring more than a gigawatt of capacity to Anthropik's service in 2026 and is Google's largest TPU deal to date. Unlike its rivals like OpenAI, which is pursuing a 33 gigawatt arsenal with Stargate, Anthropic is splitting its workloads across Google TPUs, Amazon Tranium chips, and NVIDIA GPUs In a multi-cloud strategy that will allow it to fine-tune for price, performance, and power efficiency. This deepens Google's investment in Anthropic, which is already totaling $3 billion. Jason Howell Yeah. I mean, I think the diversification aspect of this with the structure, that's important. It could lead to the company just being over time, you know, a little more resilient, obviously a lot more flexible when you're talking about a diversified kind of approach. ([Time 0:22:25](https://share.snipd.com/snip/3fe367ad-d092-4f53-9c02-df82bdbc7843)) - **Prepare Extensions For Mandatory Data Disclosure** - Mozilla will require Firefox extensions to declare data collection in manifest.json starting November 3, 2025. - Developers should prepare explicit data disclosures or their extensions will be blocked. Transcript: Jason Howell Mozilla will require all new Firefox extensions to clearly disclose how they collect and share user data beginning November 3rd, 2025. So that's just a couple of weeks from now. Developers will be required to specify data practices in each extensions manifest.json file using a new data collection permissions key. It will specify whether names, emails, or browsing activity are gathered with that extension. The gathered information will then appear in installation prompts, extension listings, and Firefox's add-ons manager, so they become kind of more transparent. Extensions that collect no data must explicitly say so, and those who do not comply will be blocked. All extension developers must have this framework in place that there's like a mid-2026 deadline for like the must-have in place or else date. So this is coming up. ([Time 0:24:32](https://share.snipd.com/snip/6b308377-9686-4a65-9d97-4102b1592f6b)) - **Generative AI Enters Everyday Photo Editing** - Instagram and other platforms are integrating generative AI editing into photos and videos. - These features mirror broader trends of AI-driven creative tools rolling into consumer apps. Transcript: Jason Howell All right. Huyen Tue Dao Well, the latest update from Instagram has a few new generative AI tools that let users edit photos and videos using text prompts similar to conversational editing features rolled Out by Google to its photo service this year. Jason Howell And Microsoft is celebrating the Windows Insider Program's 11th anniversary with special anniversary wallpapers for its volunteer testers who have spent countless hours testing Pre-built releases of Windows. And I just got to ask, like, why not at least like a T-shirt, like desktop wallpaper? Huyen Tue Dao Anthropics Cloud now has long-term memory features, allowing it to recall and integrate information from past chatbot conversations for paid subscribers. Jason Howell Love that. And Netflix has reportedly shut down Boss Fight Entertainment, the studio behind the hit mobile game, Squid Game Unleashed. That's the company's second internal game studio closure this year. Well, ([Time 0:26:51](https://share.snipd.com/snip/c6fd3f91-3da4-45d4-b59f-4a3b18e7f15d))