Why Marketing Matters for Your Agency - CourtneyR.dev's 2nd Brain

Why Marketing Matters for Your Agency 🔗 **Source:** [Why Marketing Matters for Your Agency](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM) > [!note]+ Document Notes > tags: [agency-marketing, business-development, passive-income] > author: Agency Action Show > source: YouTube > reference: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM > date created: 2024-12-19 14:30 > > # 🏷️ Title: Why Marketing Matters for Your Agency >  ## 🧰 Action Inbox - [H1] Evaluate current lead generation channels beyond referrals — diversify risk #marketing - [H2] Document all agency processes for scalability and sale value — create course format #operations - [H3] Implement upselling during monthly maintenance visits — project manager driven #revenue ## 🧭 Table of Contents - [📝 Summary](#-summary) - [📖 Main Content](#-main-content) - [🗒️ Notes](#️-notes) - [📚 References](#-references) - [🗣️ Paraphrase](#️-paraphrase) - [📰 Newsletter](#-newsletter) - [✅ Action Items](#-action-items) - [🧪 Hypotheses](#-hypotheses) - [📊 Methodology](#-methodology) - [❓ Questions](#-questions) - [🔮 Future Research](#-future-research) - [💡 Implications](#-implications) - [🧠 Learning Styles Assessment](#-learning-styles-assessment) - [📊 Accessibility Assessment](#-accessibility-assessment) - [🌍 DEIB Assessment](#-deib-assessment) - [✅ Logical Validity](#-logical-validity) - [🛡️ DARVO Analysis](#-darvo-analysis) - [🎯 Conclusion](#-conclusion) ### 🔗 References - [Agency Action Show](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM) - [The Mighty Mo](https://themightymo.com) ## 📝 Summary - Agency owners Kurt Van and Toby Crimes discuss the necessity of marketing beyond referrals for sustainable growth - Why single-person agencies relying solely on referrals aren't truly businesses but jobs - Key stakeholders are WordPress agency owners seeking scalability and exit strategies - Risk of over-reliance on referrals vs. investment costs of active marketing channels - Bottom line: Agencies need documented processes, multiple lead sources, and systems that work without the owner ## 📖 Main Content Two experienced WordPress agency owners explore the evolution from solopreneur to scalable business. They argue that true business value comes from documented processes and multiple revenue streams rather than just client lists. The discussion covers the emotional and financial costs of agency ownership, the reality of "passive income" in service businesses, and what makes an agency actually sellable. They emphasize that referral-only agencies are essentially high-paying jobs rather than transferable assets. ## 🗒️ Notes #### ⏱️ [00:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=0) — [H1] Current Agency Status and Growth Trajectory - Key idea: Toby scaled from 2-3 employees to 10 employees this year while focusing on sales and account management - Evidence: "At the start of the year, I had three or two employees, I think. And with each new person I've brought on, the stress I'm feeling has changed drastically" #### ⏱️ [02:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=135) — [H2] LinkedIn Investment Strategy for Lead Generation - Key idea: Kurt invests $200/month in LinkedIn tools plus 5 hours weekly and halftime staff member - Evidence: "I pay LinkedIn Sales Navigator plus another tool to help me make use of Sales Navigator. That's 200 bucks a month just in the tools" #### ⏱️ [04:20](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=260) — [H3] Tool Provider Partnership Opportunity - Key idea: Authentic content creation can lead to unexpected partnership opportunities - Evidence: "They were like, 'You've done all this without us asking you to.' They said, 'Well, we want to flip the script then. we want to start paying you'" #### ⏱️ [06:45](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=405) — [H2] Affiliate Marketing Reality Check - Key idea: Affiliate commissions rarely materialize even with active promotion - Evidence: "I've only gotten like two commissions from Lifter LMS in six years or something. So you would think if anyone's going to click the affiliate link for Lifter, it would be me" #### ⏱️ [09:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=570) — [H1] Lead Generation Diversification Strategy - Key idea: Agencies need multiple lead sources to survive potential SEO or referral channel failures - Evidence: "Right now we have two main lead generators. One is referral one is SEO...if the SEO dies which Google could cut us off any day" #### ⏱️ [12:10](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=730) — [H3] Invoice Collection Psychology - Key idea: Payment delays often stem from confusion rather than dissatisfaction - Evidence: "She goes, 'Oh, I thought I paid that. I thought that was like a statement.' I said, 'No, that's not a statement. That's an invoice'" #### ⏱️ [15:45](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=945) — [H2] Project Manager Buffer Benefits - Key idea: Project managers handle difficult conversations without emotional baggage - Evidence: "The things that I have emotional baggage on...for my project manager to send that email, no big deal" #### ⏱️ [18:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=1110) — [H1] Stress Management Through Delegation - Key idea: Business owners must delegate to avoid burnout and maintain work-life balance - Evidence: "I can't let the business own me. I'm supposed to own it. And I have people on my team to delegate things to" #### ⏱️ [21:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=1260) — [H1] Agency Valuation Reality - Key idea: Agency acquisition offers typically equal one year's salary, not topline revenue multiples - Evidence: "They actually made an offer...it was basically one year's salary. And I'm sitting here going, is it do I want to like be unemployed next year" #### ⏱️ [24:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=1455) — [H1] Process Documentation for Scale - Key idea: Documented processes distinguish sellable businesses from personal service operations - Evidence: "What makes an agency valuable for sale is process development...if you have a bunch of documented processes, it's like the difference between a hamburger joint and a McDonald's" #### ⏱️ [27:40](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=1660) — [H2] Contract Standardization for Valuation - Key idea: Annual contracts with consistent billing cycles increase business sellability - Evidence: "If I had been had buttoned up all of my billing into like annual contracts, everyone starts a contract on January 1st, ends on December 31st" #### ⏱️ [30:20](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=1820) — [H3] Operational Excellence Standards - Key idea: Award-winning process documentation significantly increases business value - Evidence: "Businesses that qualify for this very prestigious award become worth a whole lot more...your business is completely built upon process" #### ⏱️ [33:50](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=2030) — [H1] Marketing Necessity for True Business Status - Key idea: Single-person agencies without marketing are jobs, not businesses - Evidence: "If you're a single person agency...and you don't have any marketing efforts and you're relying purely on referrals by my definition you don't really have a business" #### ⏱️ [37:10](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=2230) — [H2] Passive Income Reality in Service Business - Key idea: True passive income requires systems that generate revenue without owner involvement - Evidence: "Passive income is something I can build and it can kind of run and automate on its own and I might have to go in and moderate it or manage it" #### ⏱️ [40:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=2430) — [H2] Maintenance Package Economics - Key idea: Monthly maintenance can be profitable with proper delegation and upselling - Evidence: "Our hosting packages...run anywhere from $55 to $79 a month. with 50 sites, I budget $300 a month for my guy to take care of those updates" ## 📚 References - [The Mighty Mo](https://themightymo.com) - [Agency Action Show](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM) - [LinkedIn Sales Navigator](https://business.linkedin.com/sales-solutions/sales-navigator) ## 🗣️ Paraphrase - Successful agencies require multiple lead generation channels beyond referrals to mitigate risk of channel failure - Business value comes from documented, repeatable processes rather than client lists or personal relationships - Single-person operations dependent on referrals are high-paying jobs, not transferable business assets ## 📰 Newsletter **WordPress Agency Growth: Beyond the Referral Trap** Many WordPress agencies rely heavily on referrals, but this creates a dangerous single point of failure. This week's Agency Action Show reveals why successful agencies need documented processes and multiple lead sources. **Key Insights:** - Agencies with only referral-based leads aren't truly businesses—they're jobs - Process documentation distinguishes valuable companies from personal service operations - Maintenance packages can generate significant recurring revenue with proper systems **Practical Applications:** - Document your agency workflows like McDonald's documents burger-making - Invest in at least one active marketing channel (LinkedIn, SEO, content) - Use project managers to handle difficult client conversations The bottom line: Build systems that work without you, or you'll never have a sellable business. Resources: [Learn WordPress](https://learn.wordpress.org/), [Developer Docs](https://developer.wordpress.org/), [WP-CLI](https://wp-cli.org/) ## ✅ Action Items #### DevRel - Developer marketing: Create LinkedIn content strategy with bi-weekly live streams on technical topics - Education: Record process documentation as course content for contractor onboarding - Community management: Establish no-affiliate-link policy for local WordPress meetups #### WordPress - Core Program Team: Implement standardized billing cycles across maintenance packages - Community: Support local WordPress groups with marketing materials and meetup guidance - Documentation: Create agency process templates for community adoption - Marketing: Develop referral-plus-marketing messaging for agency growth ## 🧪 Hypotheses - Agencies with documented processes sell for higher multiples than those without systematic operations - Single-channel lead generation (referrals only) limits agency growth potential and exit value - Project manager involvement reduces owner stress and improves client payment compliance - Monthly maintenance packages become more profitable through systematic upselling during service visits ### 📊 Methodology - Survey agency sale prices correlated with process documentation levels - Track lead generation channel performance across 12-month periods - Measure payment timeline differences between owner-managed vs. project manager-managed accounts ### ❓ Questions - What specific processes must be documented to achieve premium agency valuation multiples? - How do buyers evaluate marketing channel sustainability during agency acquisitions? - What percentage of agency value comes from recurring revenue vs. project-based income? ### 🔮 Future Research - Analysis of successful agency exit strategies in WordPress ecosystem - Comparative study of lead generation channel ROI for service businesses - Investigation of optimal team structure for agencies targeting acquisition ### 💡 Implications - Practice: Agency owners should prioritize process documentation and marketing diversification over pure growth - Policy: Industry associations could develop process documentation standards for agency valuations - Security: Reliance on single lead channels creates business continuity risks - Education: WordPress community needs agency business management training beyond technical skills - Funding: Investors may prefer agencies with documented processes over those dependent on founder relationships ### 🧠 Learning Styles Assessment Reading level estimate: Grade 12 (Flesch-Kincaid) #### 👀 Visual learners - Present: Conversational format without visual aids - Improve: Add agency process flowcharts, lead generation funnel diagrams, valuation comparison charts #### 🔊 Aural learners - Present: Full audio podcast format with natural conversation flow - Improve: Chapter markers for key topics, background music during transitions #### 🗣️ Verbal learners - Present: Rich analogies (McDonald's vs. burger joint), clear definitions - Improve: Glossary of agency terms, more business model comparisons #### 🧩 Kinesthetic learners - Present: Real examples from both hosts' agencies - Improve: Downloadable process templates, worksheets for agency assessment #### 🧠 Logical learners - Present: Clear revenue calculations, timeline examples - Improve: Decision trees for marketing investment, ROI calculators #### 🧑‍🤝‍🧑 Social learners - Present: Two-host discussion format with different perspectives - Improve: Community discussion prompts, agency owner forums #### 🧘‍♀️ Solitary learners - Present: Self-reflection moments about business status - Improve: Private assessment tools, individual goal-setting frameworks #### 🌿 Naturalistic learners - Present: Business ecosystem metaphors (lead generation channels) - Improve: Agency lifecycle thinking, sustainable growth models ### 📊 Accessibility Assessment #### Screen reader semantics - Present: Clear chapter structure in transcript - Improve: Descriptive headings, speaker identification consistency #### Keyboard navigation - Present: Standard YouTube player controls - Improve: Transcript synchronization with video playback #### Contrast and readability - Present: High contrast video player interface - Improve: Closed captions with proper contrast ratios #### Text resizing and reflow - Present: Responsive video player - Improve: Transcript text scaling options #### Media and captions - Present: Full transcript available - Improve: Professional closed captions, chapter markers #### Forms and interactions - Present: Standard video controls - Improve: Accessible feedback forms for episode topics ### 🌍 DEIB Assessment #### Cultural breadth - Present: US-focused agency examples - Improve: International agency models, global market considerations #### Inclusive language - Present: Gender-neutral business terms mostly used - Improve: Avoid assumptions about family situations, financial backgrounds #### Neurodiversity support - Present: Clear conversation structure with topic transitions - Improve: Content warnings for business stress discussions #### Representation - Present: Two male agency owners' perspectives - Improve: Include diverse agency owner voices, varied business models #### Psychological safety - Present: Respectful disagreement, acknowledgment of different approaches - Improve: Content warnings about financial stress, business failure discussions ### ✅ Logical Validity #### Strong reasoning - Deductive strength: Clear logical progression from single-channel risk to diversification need - Inductive strength: Personal examples support broader agency patterns - Causal reasoning: Process documentation directly linked to business valuation - Analogical strength: McDonald's comparison effectively illustrates process importance #### Fallacies - Survivorship bias: Only successful agency owners' perspectives, missing failed agency insights - False dichotomy: Presents referrals vs. marketing as binary choice rather than spectrum #### Tone of voice - Overall tone: Conversational and experienced, with practical candor about business challenges ### 🛡️ DARVO Analysis - Deny: No significant denial patterns observed - Attack: No attacks on accusers present - Reverse victim/offender: No victim/offender dynamics identified - Emotional cues and rhetoric: Honest discussion of business stress and challenges without manipulation ## 🎯 Conclusion WordPress agencies must evolve beyond referral-dependent operations to build truly valuable, sellable businesses. This requires documented processes, diversified lead generation, and systems that function without the owner. The conversation reveals that many " --- ## Full Transcript [00:00] The Agency Action Show with Toby and [00:02] Kurt. I am your host Toby Crimes along [00:05] with my co-host Kurt Van. [00:08] >> Kurt, what's happening in agency land [00:10] today? [00:11] >> Uh, I almost hesitate to say what's [00:13] really happening in agency land today, [00:15] but um, no, it's been a it's been a [00:16] super strong week. We've done some Well, [00:19] we've made some good content. We [00:20] released a new website this week and, [00:23] uh, we've got a new project that we just [00:24] started on. So, I'm feeling pretty good [00:26] that as we come to the end of the year, [00:28] things are staying consistent to to wrap [00:31] up. I'm not having that huge spout at [00:33] the end, which I was hoping for, but [00:35] it's been consistent. Um, but that leads [00:38] us to some questions. So, I just [00:41] mentioned making content and stuff like [00:43] that. And like I think about, we've [00:45] talked before, how much of your week is [00:47] sales? How much of your week is [00:48] marketing? How much is your Are we [00:50] expected to be like influencers now? are [00:52] as agency owners are you expected to [00:54] have your face out there all the time? [00:56] >> Right. So [00:59] I have I think yes in the sense that I [01:03] am investing heavily in influencing is [01:06] way not the term that I'm approach like [01:08] I'm not aiming to influence I'm aiming [01:10] for leads and I just see this social [01:13] media as one channel to do that and [01:15] specifically I'm investing a ton of time [01:17] and treasure in LinkedIn specifically. [01:20] So right now I pay for two tools. I pay [01:26] LinkedIn Sales Navigator plus another [01:28] tool to help me make use of Sales [01:30] Navigator. And that's um so this is just [01:34] the tools. That's 200 bucks a month just [01:36] in the tools. Two tools. Then I have to [01:39] do this is just me in so I' what I do is [01:42] I set up bi-weekly events. I want to [01:45] make it weekly though. And so I do these [01:48] live stream events where I just teach [01:50] things that I know like so this next one [01:52] is going to be on Google Search Console [01:54] and so anyone who wants to can attend. [01:57] You just reminded me of something [01:58] awesome that happened this week for me. [02:01] Um I got my goal like once I got the [02:04] 10,000 connections on LinkedIn and the [02:06] and the messaging spam started to take [02:08] over. I was like all right I've reached [02:10] my goal. I want to spool this back. And [02:12] I had a tool I was using in LinkedIn as [02:14] well. So, I scheduled a meeting to [02:17] cancel that subscription. Uh, so they [02:20] have like this exit interview kind of [02:22] thing, right? And I told him right up [02:24] front, like I just jumped in because [02:25] they're going to try and defend, you [02:27] know, oh, you got to stay. It's like [02:28] trying to cancel Comcast. And so, uh, I [02:31] just hit him right up front. I said, [02:32] hey, it's not you, it's me. I set a [02:35] goal. I reached the goal. The tool [02:36] worked. You guys did a great job. I'm [02:39] not upset. I still recommend you to [02:41] other people. I said, 'In fact, I have a [02:43] course on how to grow your LinkedIn [02:45] without spamming people. I mention you [02:47] on different podcasts. I'm not angry [02:49] with you. I'm just done, so I need to [02:51] cancel. Right? The conversation [02:54] completely flipped. They were blown [02:55] away. They were like, "You've done all [02:58] this without us asking you to." Like [03:00] they they were like, "You've already [03:01] volunteered. You've made a course. You I [03:03] said I said, "Yeah, I make content. It's [03:04] kind of what we do. You know, we're [03:06] agency people." And uh they said, "Well, [03:08] we want to flip the script then. we want [03:10] to start paying you, which I thought was [03:13] like such a bizarre end of the [03:15] conversation. So, that kind of leads us [03:18] to the next thing is like if we're [03:21] making content, if we're influencing, if [03:23] we're putting our face out there all the [03:24] time, do you think we should be [03:26] endorsing especially the brands we use [03:30] and and would do you do things like as [03:32] an affiliate or are you a partner or are [03:34] you just like taking sponsorship money [03:36] for making content? Like, what's your [03:38] strategy? Nobody's ever asked me to [03:40] sponsor anything or offered to pay to be [03:42] an affiliate. So, I don't know how I [03:45] would react. My gut reaction, my gut, [03:47] like visceral reaction was, "Oh, gross." [03:50] I Nobody's ever put a hundred bucks a [03:52] month or 500 a month or a,000 a month on [03:54] the table. I think it's weird. You get [03:57] into really weird territory. And part of [03:59] it is like over the years, I've written [04:00] a lot of blog posts endorsing WordPress [04:02] products that were then acquired. I [04:05] wasn't paid for these posts. I just [04:06] loved the product. So, I promoted them. [04:08] They were acquired and now I'm like, [04:10] "Wow, they started to suck." And my name [04:13] is still like I went out on a limb and [04:15] endorsed them. And so, there's that [04:18] risk. [04:20] And it's always I think it's it's [04:24] unfortunate like you got to be skeptical [04:26] of every recommendation you receive on [04:28] social media. [04:29] >> Yeah. Yeah. It's it's interesting [04:32] because and and I'm thinking back like I [04:34] was an affiliate for Cloudways. I was an [04:36] affiliate for Blue Host. I was an [04:38] affiliate for Groundhog. I was an [04:39] affiliate for and then I think well how [04:41] many commissions did I actually make [04:43] from any of those affiliates? I would [04:44] recommend them to a ton of people. I [04:46] would put links out and I would never [04:48] see any commissions off of that. Um, I [04:51] think I got one or two from Groundhog [04:53] and I've gotten now, you know, I work [04:55] directly for Lifter LMS and I've only [04:57] gotten like two commissions from Lifter [04:58] LMS in six years or something. Um, so [05:01] you would think if anyone's going to [05:02] click the affiliate link for Lifter, it [05:05] would be me. I mean, I'm on their show [05:06] twice a week. So, I don't think the [05:09] affiliate thing necessarily works for [05:11] agencies, but when you're making content [05:14] and it's products that you actively use [05:16] and promote through your agency, I don't [05:18] really think I have a conflict with [05:20] that. Um, for instance, I'm a I'm a big [05:22] Fluent user. Uh, uh, obviously [05:25] WordPress, uh, but then I'm a Lifter LMS [05:27] person and those become part of my [05:30] permanent stack. And so if they were to [05:32] say, "Hey, we want to give you a cut or [05:34] we want to give you 500 bucks a month to [05:36] sponsor your podcast." I don't really [05:38] see the conflict with that because I'm [05:40] already in I'm already using the [05:42] product, right? I'm already perpetuating [05:44] the use of its product through other [05:45] clients. So I see that as being a [05:47] no-brainer. But when if someone released [05:49] something new and said, "Hey, I've got [05:51] this new whisbang thing. We want you to [05:53] promote it on the show." It's kind of [05:55] like, no, that's creepy. [05:57] We have a WordPress user group here [05:59] locally that does [06:01] it's a it's a email list. So we have a [06:04] local WordPress user email list [06:07] every now and then our official policy [06:08] and I run the group and the official [06:10] policy is no affiliates period. no [06:13] affiliate links and there's been [06:15] conflict there where people [06:18] have like tried to get around it by [06:20] saying here's my non-affiliate link [06:21] here's my affiliate link support me if [06:24] you want to and I told them just stop [06:26] like this is and this is the the pro uh [06:29] a problem that the younger people won't [06:31] even understand because they've never [06:32] experienced a world where online [06:35] conversation happened without ads [06:37] but as much as I can I want to promote [06:41] no ads I have an agenda I'm not going to [06:44] say I don't have an agenda. I do. And so [06:46] I'm not saying I'm perfect or whatever, [06:47] but [06:48] >> yeah, [06:48] >> as much as possible, I'm just sick of it [06:51] all. Well, there's definitely when you [06:53] see people making YouTube content that [06:55] are like real influencers with real [06:56] followings, real numbers, and all of a [06:58] sudden they all like one product, right? [07:01] And they all start pushing it, you're [07:03] like, "Oh, [07:06] but using it almost incorrectly." Like [07:08] you're like, "That's not even like a [07:10] real use case for an agency. Why are [07:11] they doing this?" And then it hits you. [07:13] Oh, they're getting paid to make this [07:14] content. [07:14] >> When I Yeah. And the original question [07:15] about are we expected to be influencers [07:17] and my investing in LinkedIn? Like for [07:21] most of us who aren't professional [07:23] influencers, there's not a lot of upside [07:26] even. I don't know what you're making [07:27] off selling this placement, but I'm [07:30] guessing you still need to work other [07:31] jobs to um and yeah. So to me when I [07:37] hear the question I say yeah I'm [07:38] investing real time and money in [07:41] technically influencing but it's not [07:43] about influencing I'm looking for leads [07:44] and so I'm mining leads but um it's an I [07:48] think you need to like I and and by need [07:50] to I right now we have two [07:53] uh main lead generators. One is referral [07:56] one is SEO and the referrals will [07:59] probably still come in but that's not [08:01] enough to cover my entire business [08:03] ongoing. the SEOs uh if the SEO dies [08:06] which Google could cut us off any day [08:09] they could just say we're done with you [08:11] and it it has happened to other [08:12] companies. So I I always I'm like now [08:15] we're approaching we're trying to mine a [08:16] third vertical for leads LinkedIn and it [08:19] costs real time and money. I have a a [08:22] halftime staff member that's managing [08:25] not all of it but a lot of the nuts and [08:27] bolts of it and it's significant [08:29] investment just to do like not a lot. [08:32] You can go to my LinkedIn and see how [08:34] little I'm doing, but that's a halftime [08:36] person and me investing 5 hours a week [08:38] or whatever on it. [08:39] >> Yeah. Yeah, it it it certainly does add [08:42] up. And then so we look at that as like [08:44] a reason to drive revenue. [08:48] You I think you've got a story about [08:50] another side of revenue and that's like [08:51] collecting revenue. It's funny thing, [08:55] >> maybe we all have past due invoices. And [08:59] as like a solarreneur, [09:02] it was always a headache for me to send [09:04] those emails. I was it was very [09:06] emotional when I had to send those and [09:10] they haven't paid yet. I sent them an [09:12] invoice and two reminders automatically [09:14] sent from Harvest or whatever I was [09:16] using. And I had a story recently where [09:18] someone owe was passed you on five [09:20] invoices [09:21] from earlier in the year. It was maybe [09:22] it was last year. Let's say it was the [09:24] last year. Five pass due invoices. I had [09:26] my bookkeeper. I was like, "Hey, look, [09:29] just email these people. Just send them [09:32] a quick email. Say, "Hey, I'm the [09:33] bookkeeper trying to balance the books. [09:35] I see these invoices are passed to you." [09:37] She sent quick email. Very polite. Get [09:41] She gets an email right back right away [09:42] saying, "Oh, sorry. Check's in the mail [09:44] now." That's all it took. Yeah, it's um [09:49] ironically I've had the same experience. [09:52] Now most services with mana namas are [09:54] prepaid and then if someone goes over [09:57] their retainer amount I'll say hey [10:00] you're going to go over your retainer [10:01] but I can do this and bill you in a [10:02] rears and they go okay great. So then we [10:04] do that and I think that we're giving [10:07] absolute phenomenal service, right? So [10:09] we do the service and then I send the [10:10] invoice and then I don't see anything [10:13] and then they schedule more work and [10:15] it's like well I can't schedule I can't [10:17] do the new work until you clear your old [10:20] account and they go okay that's great [10:23] and then I don't see the money come in [10:24] and I'm like what is happening? And so, [10:27] like you said, it becomes internalized, [10:29] like emotionally the weight on my for [10:32] like two days. I'm walking around going, [10:34] "What did I do? How come they're not [10:35] happy? Am I going to lose them as a [10:36] client? How come they're not paying [10:38] their invoice?" They said, "Okay, but [10:39] then didn't pay. That doesn't make any [10:41] sense." So, finally, I just called, just [10:43] picked up the phone and called. And I [10:45] said, "Hey, I got a I have a meeting [10:47] scheduled to meet with your people [10:48] today." And she goes, "Oh, yeah, that's [10:50] great." And I said, "Um, [10:53] but I emailed you and and I said, you [10:54] know, we we can't take any new work [10:56] until your old invoice is is [10:58] reconciled." And she goes, "Yeah." And I [11:00] go, "But you haven't reconciled it." And [11:03] she goes, "Oh, I thought I paid that. I [11:05] thought that was like a statement." I [11:07] said, "No, that's not a statement. [11:09] That's an invoice. It it needs to be [11:10] paid before I can have your meeting [11:12] today." And she goes, "Not a problem, [11:14] sweetheart. I'm so sorry. We're so happy [11:16] working with you." And she right on the [11:18] phone. She just put in the credit card [11:19] and paid it. And I was like, all I had [11:21] to do was ask. And then I was dreading [11:24] the conversation, but then I got [11:26] reinforcement of how happy she was as a [11:28] client. Like that's we do it to [11:30] ourselves. It's like we almost we almost [11:33] build our own failure before we even try [11:35] for the success. [11:36] >> An emotional weight that comes with [11:38] running a an agency. And it's that [11:42] multiplied with all sorts of client [11:45] interactions. In my experience, one [11:47] thing that I found is really helpful it [11:50] is having a project manager handle being [11:53] the face being the standing between you [11:55] as an agency owner and the client has [11:58] smoothed over so much for me. It's like [12:01] I've given she has she feels none of [12:03] that baggage by the way because she's, [12:05] you know, not the owner. She's just [12:07] doing her job. She's like, I'm here. I [12:08] need to do this to get paid. And so the [12:11] things that I have emotional baggage on, [12:13] for example, um we emailed someone [12:16] today, I should say my project manager [12:18] did the we said, "Hey, you your site was [12:23] hacked. We did a bunch of work, 20 hours [12:27] worth of work without having a contract [12:30] in place, and this is worrying or this [12:33] is something we need to address." My [12:34] project manager sent this email and the [12:37] and she didn't put out a framework. just [12:39] says, "How can we figure this out?" And [12:42] the person emailed right back. She's [12:43] like, "Oh, thank you. Da uh how about I [12:46] pay [12:48] third, you know, 20 uh, you know, 30% [12:50] 30%, you know, 33 33 33 over the next [12:53] few months. For me, I was dreading that [12:57] conversation." But for my project [12:59] manager to send that email, no big deal. [13:00] >> No big deal. [13:02] >> And she probably didn't care about the [13:03] outcome. She was like, "What would [13:05] >> I'm sure she wanted to win, but you [13:06] know, it it's it [13:10] she lives in a different space than I [13:11] do, you know, in terms of I'm a business [13:13] owner. She's an employee." [13:15] >> So, in in terms of stress, like what you [13:18] were just talking about. How much do you [13:21] think stress actually costs an agency [13:23] owner? Do you do you think it's all [13:25] emotional or do you think it's [13:26] financial, too? [13:27] >> It's both. I don't I don't I think the [13:30] the I think if you So, let me start over [13:33] here. I've been thinking about scaling [13:35] my business. I've been thinking about [13:37] growing bottom or top of line revenue [13:40] for my business this year and I've been [13:43] taking steps to do that. And as I've [13:46] done that, I've required more staff to [13:48] do a lot of more stuff. So, I currently [13:50] have 10 employees. At the start of the [13:51] year, I had three or two employees, I [13:54] think. And with each new person I've [13:58] brought on, the the stress I'm feeling [14:00] has changed drastically. So right now I [14:03] feel a lot of stress around are these [14:07] projects actually getting done because [14:09] I'm no longer involved. I have two [14:12] project managers. I have a team of [14:14] developers. I have team of designers. [14:16] I'm mostly focused on sales and then you [14:20] know some account management. [14:22] When the site was hacked a week or two [14:25] ago, I spent a lot of time. A lot of [14:27] those 20 hours were me. And in [14:29] hindsight, I'm thinking maybe I should [14:31] have spent close to zero hours on that [14:33] and assigned that to somebody. I don't [14:35] know why I jumped in. That's this like [14:38] anxious thing that I have that I [14:40] probably need to address as a agency [14:42] owner. What do you think? I think [14:47] and it's interesting because this year I [14:49] have specifically pulled back on some of [14:53] my, you know, I would say I've reduced [14:55] my hours as an agency. Like that's [14:57] that's an easy way to say it for people [14:59] that aren't aware of what we actually do [15:00] for a living. But, you know, I've [15:01] reduced my hours. Um, but I have [15:04] specifically pulled back on some things [15:06] in in the quest for better well-being, [15:10] for better mental health, for better [15:13] fitness, for like I take time to go [15:15] mountain biking. I take time to go to [15:16] the gym. I'll take off on a Friday [15:18] afternoon and take the dog to the dog [15:20] park. Right? And other people might hear [15:22] this and go, "Oh my god, he's slitting [15:24] his wrist. He's crazy. he's going to [15:26] fold his business. But I think after [15:28] doing this for 18 years, there comes a [15:31] point where I'm like, I can't let the [15:34] business own me. I'm supposed to own it. [15:36] And I have people on my team to delegate [15:38] things to. I And I'm I don't have the [15:41] project managers that you have. So, I am [15:43] the project manager. And so, I delegate [15:46] it. I have them check in. We're really [15:48] big on getting things done on time and [15:50] under budget. So, I'm not worried about [15:52] overspending. I'm really worried about [15:53] the timing. I just want to make sure we [15:55] make our customers happy. Um, but yeah, [15:58] I I have specifically I've even turned [16:01] down some contracts this year because I [16:02] was like, it's just going to be too much [16:03] of a headache for for me to manage. I [16:05] don't want to do it. I'll I'll pass it [16:06] on to someone else. Um, we take care of [16:09] the customer. We make referrals and [16:10] stuff like that. We don't just leave [16:12] people hanging. But, um, I think the [16:14] stress is a big big cost. And I'm [16:18] substantially older than you. And I [16:20] think the age is a thing where I'm like [16:23] I'm like we're launching our own [16:25] apprenticeship program to teach people [16:26] how to run their own agency and like [16:28] like we're gearing up for like an exit [16:30] strategy. Eventually Mñana Nas will [16:33] probably turn over to someone else and [16:35] then I'll be running kind of a training [16:37] organization or an apprenticeship or [16:38] something like that through the [16:39] community college and then um you know [16:41] time out and do some public speaking and [16:43] stuff like that. But then that takes us [16:45] to like what is an exit plan? Yeah, this [16:48] is one of the trickiest things. One [16:50] interpretation of what is an exit plan [16:52] is what can you sell your business for [16:54] and how easily can you sell it? And the [16:57] weird thing about that, the more [16:59] sellable it is, the easier it is for you [17:02] to run. [17:04] >> And so as you're you make your agency [17:06] more valuable, you're less critical to [17:09] the operations. So why would you sell [17:11] it? You know, at the end of the day, you [17:13] just I could just sit here and make a [17:14] living and do nothing. that that's kind [17:16] of like the goal. And once you're there, [17:17] that means your agency is worth [17:19] something. [17:20] >> The trouble is getting there. [17:22] >> Yeah. [17:22] >> I recently went through an acquisition [17:26] process where someone was very seriously [17:30] going through an acquisition process to [17:31] try to acquire the Mighty Mo, and they [17:33] actually made an offer. [17:35] And I think it was a fair offer, but it [17:38] was basically one year's salary. [17:42] And I'm sitting here going, [17:44] >> "Yeah, [17:45] >> is it do I want to like be unemployed [17:47] next year and for this one?" You know, [17:50] is it worth that? And I get it. Like my [17:53] business bottom line revenue is way more [17:55] than one year of my salary because I [17:57] have to pay all these employees, you [17:58] know, it makes way more, but I am [18:02] >> they can't take it and just say go. They [18:04] need me as part of it in order to run it [18:06] right now. [18:07] >> Yeah. That that's so interesting because [18:10] if you look at, you know, we talked [18:13] about stress, right? And then we talk [18:14] about the cost of doing things. Um, [18:18] and sometimes taking that one extra [18:19] project really does like for me, I had [18:22] to turn things down. I don't I don't [18:23] want to burn out doing this thing. But [18:25] then it comes down to if I had an exit [18:27] plan and I was building something that I [18:30] would eventually leave, then it has to [18:32] be an asset. And it has to be more than [18:34] a customer list. Like I think a lot of [18:37] agencies are existing on this. Oh, if I [18:39] had 10 clients, if I had 15, if I had [18:41] 30, if I had 50 clients, and by the way, [18:43] if you had 50, then you'd say, if I had [18:45] a hundred, you know, if I had 200, if I [18:47] had 500. Um, you always want more than [18:50] what you have. [18:52] That's not the asset to me. Like a [18:55] client list is part of the asset, but [18:57] it's not the asset. I think what makes [19:00] an agency valuable for sale is process [19:03] development. is, you know, this is where [19:06] we host, this is how we initiate a [19:08] hosting package, this is how I delegate [19:10] the projects, this is how we track the [19:12] projects, this is how we invoice, this [19:14] is how we follow up with customers, this [19:16] is our, you know, meeting communication [19:18] process. This is how we storyboard a [19:20] project. Like if you have a bunch of [19:24] documented processes, it's like the [19:26] difference between a hamburger joint and [19:28] a McDonald's, [19:30] you know? It's like if there's process [19:32] and you can demonstrate process and [19:34] profitability through the process, then [19:36] you've got something that you can sell. [19:38] So then if you inject your client list [19:40] on top of a solid process, then you have [19:44] real value [19:45] >> about a year ago offered to sell me his [19:48] hosting business and it was a real [19:50] business and he was hosting on one of [19:52] the big providers. So, just a shared [19:53] hosting provider that I'm very familiar [19:55] with and you're very familiar with and [19:59] he had organized things and I think this [20:02] is part of it if you're planning on [20:03] selling your agency and this is [20:05] somewhere where I probably could have [20:07] increased the value of that offer that I [20:08] received. If I had been had buttoned up [20:11] all of my billing into like annual [20:14] contracts, everyone starts a contract on [20:16] January 1st, ends on December 31st. the [20:18] more clear and straightforward that sort [20:21] of accounting is, the more easily it's [20:23] gonna people are going to be able to [20:25] make you an offer more easily. And so my [20:28] friend was selling his hosting business [20:30] and he actually had buttoned it up [20:32] really well. And he's he said, "Here's [20:34] what it is. Here's what you're going to [20:36] stand to make this year." And I looked [20:38] at it and I said,"I willing to pay you [20:41] maybe like X, which is let's say, let's [20:44] say, I can't remember what, but let's [20:45] say it's one year of profit that I stood [20:48] to make." And the problem with that is a [20:53] lot of the literature that you'll find [20:55] online and in books is like 3x of [20:57] Ebbitad or whatever. The idea is like [20:59] it's 3x your topline revenue. Let's say [21:02] your hosting biz made a million dollars. [21:03] The business is worth three million. And [21:05] maybe it is, maybe it isn't. But for me [21:07] as a buyer, and this is the problem the [21:09] Mighty Mo ran into, is I'm going, [21:12] >> I'm not going to pay your top. I'm going [21:14] to pay off your profit. And this is part [21:16] of the problem of selling your business. [21:17] And that's why SAS companies, successful [21:20] SAS businesses are worth more because [21:23] the revenue is more straightforward. And [21:27] you well, we see that with heavily [21:31] invested businesses even in our own [21:33] space. So if they take a lot of outside [21:35] investment money, pretty soon we see not [21:39] a whole lot of development and then a [21:40] ton of layoffs, right? And then those [21:43] layoffs increase the bottom line dollar, [21:46] which makes them look better to [21:47] shareholders, which helps them increase [21:49] more investing. [21:51] But in the end, it's a worse product. [21:53] And so that's that's a real struggle. [21:55] Like I don't want to I don't want to [21:57] devolve [21:59] mñana. I don't want to race to the [22:01] bottom to make it worth more. That [22:03] doesn't make any sense to me. So, I'm [22:05] going to continue to grow it, continue [22:06] to invest in it, continue to grow the [22:08] team, add as many quality clients as we [22:11] can, and build these super solid [22:13] processes that we have. Um, I actually [22:16] record my processes as a course in the [22:18] back end of my site. And so, when we [22:20] hire contractors, I can just assign them [22:23] to the courses or lessons that apply to [22:24] the tasks we hired them for. And that [22:27] helps onboard contractors. And so when I [22:30] share that when I share that work with a [22:33] prospective purchaser, that's just one [22:36] more that's one more notch. That's one [22:37] more value knot. This is kind of [22:39] interesting. Um [22:41] we talk about there's there's a lot of [22:44] uh Ponzi scheme type of things and we've [22:47] talked about an agency OS and you're [22:48] kind of describing just part of your [22:50] custom agency OS. And I've wondered this [22:53] too from a salability perspective. [22:56] There's this thing called EOS and it has [22:58] a big following. But when it comes to [23:00] selling a company, if you subscribe, if [23:03] you're like integrated into one of these [23:06] operating system [23:08] Ponzi schemes, [23:10] you're going to find more people who [23:12] understand that and are willing. They [23:14] say, "Oh, I know that. We do that, too. [23:16] I'll pay you." You know, that's they [23:18] just get it. And so this is kind of if [23:20] you if I was going to sell the MightyMo, [23:22] I would probably do do something like [23:24] EOS or one of those other ones that um [23:28] you I think you call them agency OS, but [23:30] there that's more of a generic term I [23:32] think, but there's lots of these agency [23:34] OS's that you can that are used by [23:36] millions and that's there's probably [23:38] value there if you're going to sell. [23:40] >> Yeah. I so I this organizational mindset [23:43] of mine came about. I used to work for [23:45] Don Chalmer's Ford in New Mexico when I [23:47] was in the automotive business and they [23:49] were going for a thing called the [23:50] Baldridge Award. I had no idea what the [23:52] Baldridge Award was and I didn't care [23:54] cuz I was just a service manager working [23:56] for them. But we had to create like [23:58] these mindmap [24:00] crazy manuals on stupid things like how [24:03] to make coffee in the customer waiting [24:05] space and how to, you know, how to [24:07] inspect the fire extinguishers and it [24:09] was just ridiculous. Um, but it turns [24:11] out that businesses that qualify for [24:14] this very prestigious award become worth [24:18] a whole lot more. And if you get a [24:19] Baldridge award, it shows that your [24:21] business is completely built upon [24:23] process. And that's so everything from [24:26] how to take out the trash to how to [24:28] greet customers to, you know, how how to [24:30] run the accounting department was all [24:32] documented in a in a very very detailed [24:35] manner. Um, and as an employee, I hated [24:38] it. Honestly, I hated it. But from a [24:41] business owner's perspective and then [24:42] knowing what it did to the value of that [24:44] dealership, I'm all in on that. Now, [24:46] >> thing as we talk about adding val uh [24:49] building an agency that you can sell, um [24:52] there's a lot of very small agencies in [24:54] particular that do not invest in [24:56] marketing and this is kind of the first [24:57] question we asked about are you an [24:59] influencer? But so many people I talk to [25:02] who run very small agencies, maybe one [25:04] person, two person, three person shops, [25:06] maybe bigger, but they don't do any [25:08] marketing and they proudly say we get [25:11] all our business through referrals. And [25:14] I've come to think that [25:17] that's not enough. that especially if it [25:20] comes to selling, you're you're gonna [25:23] want to see some marketing activity and [25:25] like leads connected to that activity [25:28] because they want to be able to step in [25:30] and say, um, we have a process and this [25:32] is what you're defining because right [25:33] now maybe Toby the Mighty Mo, maybe [25:35] those leads are all coming because of me [25:37] and if I leave the company, maybe those [25:39] leads disappear and so if you have a [25:41] marketing engine that doesn't involve [25:43] you that maybe it's Google ads or [25:46] Facebook or whatever it is, LinkedIn [25:49] that you have a process that's [25:50] repeatable that can you can have metrics [25:53] on it definitely would increase the [25:56] value I think or at least you you'd [25:59] probably get at least have more security [26:01] in the purchaser you know well and this [26:04] is where I might ruffle some feathers in [26:06] the audience but if you're a single [26:08] person agency a oneperson shop stop and [26:11] you don't have any marketing efforts and [26:13] you're relying purely on referrals by my [26:16] definition you don't really have a [26:18] business. I mean, you you might be [26:21] making money. You what you have is a [26:23] job. You've created a job for yourself [26:24] and people give you tasks to do, but [26:27] it's not really a a business in that [26:29] respect. And I used to be in that [26:31] category. I was in that category and [26:33] thought everything was fine. But the [26:35] thing is is when you go to sell a [26:37] oneperson operation that's based [26:38] completely on referral and you're doing [26:40] maybe 10 projects a year or something [26:42] like that that is like hobbyist level [26:46] and it's not attractive for resale. So [26:50] I'm not trying to be mean. I'm just [26:51] trying to be real. [26:53] >> You're describing the value the value is [26:56] way lower. It's some very small [26:59] percentage of your bottom line. [27:00] >> Yeah. And so if to to your point, if [27:03] it's completely dependent upon referral, [27:05] I immediately start thinking about those [27:06] BMI meetings and those networking things [27:09] and all that stuff. Well, if an investor [27:11] buys your agency, [27:14] they don't have the personal energy to [27:16] invest at that level. They need [27:18] something that is sustainable on its [27:20] own. And so if you take to your point, [27:22] if you take yourself out of the [27:23] equation, it's dead. So it's not it's [27:26] not really a sellable thing. Um to me [27:29] you become a business when you create [27:30] jobs for other people. You create um [27:33] kind of this this engine that runs [27:35] independently of yourself and and it has [27:38] a value even when you pull yourself out [27:40] of the equation and that's that to me is [27:42] is what becomes sell [27:43] >> and a lot of that probably at least one [27:46] facet of that is passive income. I do [27:49] think [27:51] when I think of passive income I think [27:53] of these types of systems. I don't think [27:55] of it in the traditional like there's a [27:58] lot of ways to think of passive income [28:00] but within the context of the mighty mo [28:02] have a I need right now I'm in the [28:05] process of trying to figure out how to [28:06] build a lead engine that doesn't involve [28:08] me and a sales process that doesn't [28:10] involve me when I've built that that's [28:13] passive income for the Mighty Mo that's [28:16] now for for me because now I don't even [28:18] have to show up for that pro part of it [28:21] I can now step back and I have a [28:23] director of sales and you know whatever [28:24] ever we want to call it. Um, and so one [28:28] question is how are you approaching this [28:32] kind of passive income question or is it [28:34] part of your equation? So I really don't [28:36] believe in passive income the way that [28:38] people advertise it. Um, when I when I [28:41] see these absolute scoundrels on the [28:43] internet saying things like you need a [28:44] mobile application and you'll make [28:46] $50,000 every two weeks. If you don't do [28:48] that, you don't have a business. Um, I [28:50] don't that's not a business to me. [28:52] That's a dream. Um, but to me, passive [28:55] income is something I can build and it [28:58] can kind of run and automate on its own [29:00] and I might have to go in and moderate [29:01] it or manage it or edit it, you know, [29:04] once or twice a year, you know? I mean, [29:06] I think things take you have to babysit [29:09] things. I don't think you can just put [29:10] things on autopilot forever. Um, I've [29:13] got a couple of websites that are set up [29:16] like lead magnets that redirect back to [29:18] our agency. And because we're in the [29:21] e-learning space, a lot of that revolves [29:23] around, you know, courses, sample [29:25] courses, um, and because it's in our [29:28] wheelhouse, it's it's kind of easy for [29:30] us to put that content together. So, [29:32] that's why we have the WP Agency [29:34] Academy. That's why we have um [29:36] scorpress.com like that. We we teach [29:38] people how to take SCORM content and put [29:40] it on WordPress. But those are all lead [29:43] magnet sites that in a way redirect back [29:46] to mñana. [29:47] So, so those would be my passive [29:50] avenues. Um, I also do some hosting for [29:53] clients and it while we sell hosting and [29:56] maintenance, I offload the maintenance [29:59] to someone else on my staff and they do [30:02] all the plug-in updates and the [30:04] WordPress updates and they they manage [30:06] all that. I just, you know, maybe once [30:08] every couple of months kind of look in [30:09] the back end at the dashboard just to [30:11] make sure things are caught up. Um, and [30:13] my clients pay for hosting every month [30:15] with the maintenance package. That to me [30:17] is a that's a fun way to think of [30:20] passive. Passive income is a spectrum. [30:23] You have these the person who got super [30:26] lucky built built Flappy Bird and now [30:28] he's making 50 grand a month on whatever [30:31] that through the Google Play Store. But [30:34] that's like less a better chance of [30:36] getting struck by lightning maybe. I [30:38] don't know. Um, but what we're talking [30:39] about is building what you just [30:41] described, building [30:43] >> a very reasonable system that requires [30:45] very little of your time. Still requires [30:46] your time. You still got to sell the [30:48] projects, but once they're sold, someone [30:49] else does the work. And I think this is [30:51] the piece that a lot of very small shops [30:55] miss is that you, and I, by the way, I'm [30:58] not a genius at this. I'm figuring it [31:01] out as I go, but every day I'm working [31:03] towards extracting myself. And that to [31:05] me is what really is passive. Like the [31:09] closer the spectrum the closer I get to [31:11] me not being involved in [31:14] basically working fewer hours, that's [31:16] that's my goal. That's what I view as [31:18] the passive income spectrum. Yeah. Well, [31:21] because that's so interesting. We we had [31:23] a note in our notes that said, you know, [31:25] what's the real cost of maintaining 50 [31:27] client sites? And it's interesting to me [31:30] because we just described it as like [31:32] this whole passive thing and I don't [31:35] want to discount the stress of running a [31:36] dealership and running a running a an [31:38] agency. I don't want to discount that, [31:40] right? That the stress of what we do and [31:41] all that stuff. But in terms of money, [31:44] um, our hosting packages at Mñana that I [31:48] I'll just be really transparent. They [31:49] run anywhere from $55 to $79 a month. [31:53] with 50 sites, I budget $300 a month for [32:00] my guy to take care of those updates. So [32:03] that's it. If somebody wants to like [32:05] have a content change or wants, you [32:07] know, a higher level of maintenance, if [32:10] we want to call it maintenance, well, [32:11] that's a different package, right? [32:13] That's that's that's something [32:15] different. But on just our basic [32:17] maintenance and hosting package, we take [32:19] care of the WordPress updates. We take [32:20] care of the plugins. We uh do [32:22] screenshots before and after to make [32:24] sure that the sites still operate [32:25] correctly. We don't see obvious [32:27] conflicts with things. Uh I budget $300 [32:30] a month for those updates and we collect [32:34] anywhere from $55 to $79 a site. [32:38] >> Something that I've left on the table [32:39] for years and years up until recently. [32:41] And it required me hiring a project [32:42] manager who was thoughtful enough to [32:46] realize the problem for me cuz I didn't [32:49] understand. I kind of got it. But this [32:51] is another as we talk about passive [32:53] income. It's a spectrum and it's a I'm [32:56] just trying to implement processes that [32:58] generate more revenue without me being [33:00] involved. You are running these [33:01] maintenance [33:03] things once a month as many of our [33:05] colleagues are who run very small [33:07] agencies. Um, [33:10] and trust me, the big agencies have this [33:12] figured out. It's the small agencies [33:14] that don't. What I learned is that we [33:18] were leaving lots of money on the table [33:21] on these maintenance plans. Not in the [33:22] pricing, but in the upselling of, hey, [33:24] we did maintenance. We noticed your logo [33:27] is ugly. Hey, we did maintenance. We [33:29] noticed there's a plugin that needs a [33:32] premium update. And can we do that? And [33:35] and then and then on the bigger upsell [33:37] end we did maintenance. We noticed the [33:39] contact form isn't going anywhere. Like [33:41] we did you get the email you didn't get [33:43] it. And so we're upselling very small [33:46] projects. Usually usually they're very [33:48] small. Sometimes they but part of it is [33:50] okay you do it once a month and maybe [33:52] you upsell three small projects to each [33:54] client. you didn't do the work cuz [33:57] presumably somebody else is doing if you [33:59] have let's say you have a project [34:00] manager like I do or somebody who's [34:02] sending these emails once a month after [34:03] they do the maintenance you haven't done [34:05] any work you've now increased the money [34:09] in without doing the work. [34:10] >> Yeah. Well, and I think we should be [34:12] like really clear. I don't want to [34:14] discount the work that goes into getting [34:16] these clients in the first place. You [34:18] know, part of how my original project [34:21] pricing goes and how that goes is [34:22] they're going to host with me and [34:23] they're probably going to stick with me [34:24] for two to three years. That's the [34:26] average hosting account goes two to [34:27] three years for us. And so, you know, [34:29] cuz maybe they're going to try Blue Host [34:31] and be cheaper. Maybe they're going to [34:32] try something different, right? Uh maybe [34:34] they're going to try and hire someone [34:35] internally to do their updates. What [34:37] whatever the deal is, two to three years [34:39] on hosting is what we typically see. And [34:41] so if I've got those 50 sites and I'm [34:44] paying my guy, you know, 300 bucks to [34:47] take care of all the updates and just [34:48] that basic work, I'm coming out like [34:50] $3,600 a month on what we would describe [34:53] as that passive income. But that is the [34:56] that's the reward for the sale that [34:58] happened at the very beginning. So I [35:00] want to be like super clear about that. [35:02] It's not like I'm just sitting around [35:03] collecting money for doing nothing. It [35:05] we're paying ourselves for the work that [35:06] was done on the front end. Um the other [35:09] side of that is just as you said when we [35:11] go through some things we have a lot of [35:14] clients over the course of two years [35:15] that'll say oh I'm going to I want to [35:18] use this form tool instead or I want to [35:20] go over to Gravity Forms because I want [35:21] to do square payments in my form like [35:24] whatever the reasoning is. Well when [35:26] they say that that's great we'll add [35:27] that for you. Right? So we add that and [35:29] then it turns into they need training or [35:31] they need some kind of tutorial made for [35:32] their staff on how to use the tool. So, [35:34] we upsell that and then we go, "Oh, [35:36] well, you were using WP form before, [35:39] right? So, do you want us to you want us [35:41] to change all the forms over and then, [35:43] you know, create that and configure that [35:46] for you or are you going to do it on [35:47] your own?" And then they're going to go, [35:48] "Well, how much would that be?" And then [35:49] you shoot them the number and that [35:51] that's your upsell. So, we get a lot a [35:53] fair amount off of that. [35:54] >> Passive income is never passive. [35:56] >> No, it takes it takes management, [35:58] oversight, and moderation. [35:59] >> Has a very successful SAS app. And by [36:03] very successful, he lives in a very nice [36:05] house in a very nice neighborhood and he [36:07] has money left over. We'll say that. But [36:10] I was talking to him just on Wednesday [36:12] and [36:14] he's [36:15] he struggles with maintenance tickets [36:18] and support bugs and you he's got people [36:22] supporting him too, but he does most of [36:24] the development himself, but he's got [36:26] customer support people. And part of his [36:28] problem is people, even if you have a [36:31] very well-formed product, they want [36:34] more. They want changes. They And you [36:36] have to, as somebody who manages a [36:39] product, you have to deal with that. You [36:41] have to fix bugs. You have to reply to [36:43] those emails. They have to help people [36:44] feel taken care of. And his app is not [36:48] like a game. It's like a business, an [36:51] app that PE that runs a business, like a [36:53] retail business. And so he's got a bunch [36:55] of businesses running their app in the [36:57] store and he cares deeply about these [36:59] customers and [37:00] >> and it even though the income is [37:02] technically passive, [37:04] >> he's spends 40 hours a week at least [37:06] probably working on that but also [37:09] marketing it. Yeah. The people that are [37:11] pushing this passive stuff the most. You [37:12] know, when when I look at the Grant [37:14] Cardones and the Tony Robbins's and the [37:15] Russell Brunsons of the world, if it was [37:18] really working as good as they said it [37:19] was, they wouldn't be in my Facebook [37:21] feed every day, you know, pushing the [37:24] next webinar, the next thing, the next, [37:26] you know, obviously it takes work and [37:27] maintenance. Um, I'm in the John Maxwell [37:30] organization. I have been since 2016. [37:32] And every year comes the push for the [37:34] mentorship program and how we should all [37:36] be in that. [37:37] >> You know who isn't selling? You know who [37:38] you don't get emails from about [37:40] mentorships and partnerships? Elon Musk, [37:43] Jeff Bezos, actually rich people. Like [37:46] you don't, you know, like these people [37:48] are probably doing fine. Don't get me [37:49] wrong. They they might be billionaires, [37:51] but for some reason they still want us [37:53] to come to their stupid webinar. For [37:55] some reason, they seem a little [37:56] desperate. [38:00] So, well, I think this is kind of a good [38:02] way to to to wrap up. You know, we got [38:04] we got to bust on some some people [38:05] wealthier than ourselves. [38:08] Toby, what's a great way for people to [38:09] get a hold of you? come to LinkedIn, [38:11] find me uh Toby Krins, c r y ns. Uh you [38:15] can DM me there. Uh you can also go to [38:18] the mightymmo.com and find our WordPress [38:20] and SEO services there. [38:22] >> Nice. I am also on LinkedIn. I'm the [38:24] only Kurt Vonan on LinkedIn. So when you [38:26] find me, you know you got me. We'll make [38:27] a connection there. And then mñana Nas [38:30] is my agency and that's my call sign on [38:32] all the socials as well. [38:33] >> All right, thanks Kurt. This has been [38:34] another episode of the agency action [38:36] show with Toby and Kurt. Hope you all [38:38] have a great rest of the day and rest of [38:40] the week. --- --- tags: [revenue, marketing, operations] author: Agency Action Show source: YouTube reference: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM) date created: 2025-12-03 00:00 --- # 🏷️ Title: Why Marketing Matters for Your Agency ## 🧭 Table of Contents - [📝 Summary](#-summary) - [📖 Main Content](#-main-content) - [🗒️ Notes](#️-notes) - [📚 References](#-references) - [🗣️ Paraphrase](#️-paraphrase) - [📰 Newsletter](#-newsletter) - [✅ Action Items](#-action-items) - [🧪 Hypotheses](#-hypotheses) - [📊 Methodology](#-methodology) - [❓ Questions](#-questions) - [🔮 Future Research](#-future-research) - [💡 Implications](#-implications) - [🧠 Learning Styles Assessment](#-learning-styles-assessment) - [📊 Accessibility Assessment](#-accessibility-assessment) - [🌍 DEIB Assessment](#-deib-assessment) - [✅ Logical Validity](#-logical-validity) - [🛡️ DARVO Analysis](#-darvo-analysis) - [🎯 Conclusion](#-conclusion) ### 🔗 References - [Agency Action Show – Why Marketing Matters for Your Agency](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM) - [The Mighty Mo](https://themightymo.com) - [Mañana Nomas](https://themightynom.com) *(if/when applicable)* ## 📝 Summary - Two WordPress agency owners (Toby & Kurt) discuss scaling from solo operator to sellable agency. - Marketing beyond referrals is necessary to de‑risk lead generation and enable growth. - Key stakeholders: small WordPress / web agencies, especially solopreneurs wanting scalability or exit. - Risks: referral dependency, owner-centric operations, lack of process documentation, misunderstood “passive income”. - Bottom line: A real, sellable agency needs documented processes, recurring revenue, and marketing systems that work without the owner. ## 📖 Main Content - Core argument: “If you're a single person agency…relying purely on referrals…you don't really have a business…you have a job.” A business must generate leads and revenue independent of the owner. - Marketing: Kurt invests ~$200/month in LinkedIn tools plus ~5 hours/week and a half‑time staffer to build a third lead channel (LinkedIn) alongside SEO and referrals, explicitly to hedge against SEO/Google risk. - Partnerships & affiliates: Authentic unpaid advocacy for tools can unexpectedly lead to paid partnerships; in contrast, affiliate marketing often underperforms for agencies (few commissions despite strong promotion). - Finances & psychology: Stress around collections is often emotional for owners; simple, neutral outreach by a bookkeeper or PM often gets invoices paid quickly and reveals clients are actually happy. - Delegation & stress: Hiring project managers to buffer client communications and collect on awkward issues reduces owner stress and improves operations. Owners must avoid letting the business “own” them. - Valuation & exits: Real-world acquisition offers often approximate ~1 year of owner salary, not 3× topline. Value is constrained when operations and lead gen depend heavily on the founder. - Processes as asset: The “McDonald’s vs burger joint” analogy—documented, repeatable processes for hosting, projects, invoicing, and follow‑up are what make an agency transferable and worth a premium. - Contract/billing standardization: Clean annual contracts and synchronized terms make revenue easier to understand and thus easier to value and sell. - Passive income reality: For service agencies, “passive” means systems with low ongoing owner input (e.g., maintenance retainers delegated to staff, lead‑magnet sites) rather than set‑and‑forget riches. - Maintenance economics: Example: 50 sites at $55–$79/month, ~$300/month to a staffer for updates → several thousand dollars/month in relatively leveraged recurring revenue, plus upsell opportunities discovered during maintenance. - Upselling: Systematic upsell during monthly maintenance (logo improvements, premium plugins, broken forms) is a largely untapped revenue layer for small agencies. ### 🗒️ Notes #### ⏱️ [00:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=0) — Current agency status & scaling stress - Kurt scaled from 2–3 employees to 10; as he added people, his stress changed from doing the work to worrying whether projects are actually getting done without him. - Toby intentionally reduced hours to protect mental health, delegating more and turning down headache projects. #### ⏱️ [02:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=135) — LinkedIn investment as third lead channel - Kurt pays for LinkedIn Sales Navigator plus an automation/assist tool (~$200/month) and invests ~5 hours/week plus a half‑time staffer. - Goal: build a third “vertical” of leads (LinkedIn) so that if SEO fails and referrals slow, the business still has pipeline. #### ⏱️ [04:20](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=260) — Authentic advocacy → paid partnership - Kurt tried to cancel a LinkedIn tool subscription but explained he’d been recommending them in a course and on podcasts. - Vendor was “blown away” and flipped the script: they offered to start paying him, showing how organic advocacy can become a partnership. #### ⏱️ [06:45](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=405) — Affiliate marketing underperforms for agencies - Toby has been an affiliate for multiple tools (Cloudways, Bluehost, Groundhogg, LifterLMS) yet saw only a handful of commissions over years. - Conclusion: typical affiliate schemes don’t meaningfully monetize an agency audience, even when you’re a visible advocate. #### ⏱️ [09:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=570) — Lead‑source diversification - Current main lead sources: referrals and SEO; referrals alone cannot cover the whole business, and SEO can vanish overnight due to Google changes. - This fragility motivates investing in LinkedIn as a third, process‑driven lead channel. #### ⏱️ [12:10](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=730) — Invoice collection & client happiness - Owners internalize unpaid invoices as personal rejection; Toby worried a client was unhappy when they hadn’t paid. - Simple phone call revealed they’d misunderstood the email as a “statement” and were very happy; they paid by card immediately. #### ⏱️ [15:45](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=945) — Project manager as emotional buffer - Kurt’s PM emailed a client about 20 hours of uncontracted hacked‑site work; client quickly proposed a 3‑month payment schedule. - PM had no emotional baggage; for Kurt, that conversation would have been dread‑inducing, reinforcing the benefit of role separation. #### ⏱️ [18:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=1110) — Delegation, lifestyle, and exit thinking - Toby prioritizes gym, biking, dog park—explicitly rejecting a business that owns him after 18 years in agencies. - He’s planning an apprenticeship program and anticipates eventually transitioning from agency operations to training/education and speaking. #### ⏱️ [21:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=1260) — Acquisition offer reality check - Someone seriously tried to acquire The Mighty Mo; offer effectively equaled one year of Toby’s salary. - As owner, he questioned whether it’s worth becoming “unemployed next year” for that amount, highlighting limited value when the founder is essential. #### ⏱️ [24:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=1455) — Processes as primary sale asset - Buyer value isn’t just client count; it’s documented, profitable processes: hosting setup, delegation, tracking, invoicing, follow‑up, storyboard, communications. - Analogy: “difference between a hamburger joint and a McDonald’s” – process makes the business replicable and saleable. #### ⏱️ [27:40](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=1660) — Billing standardization & Baldrige‑style systems - Standardized annual contracts (Jan 1–Dec 31) make revenue clearer and more attractive to buyers. - Toby references the Baldrige Award from his auto dealership days: exhaustive process documentation (down to making coffee) significantly increased business value. #### ⏱️ [33:50](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=2030) — Referral‑only solo shops aren’t businesses - Many 1–3 person agencies proudly rely 100% on referrals; hosts argue this is “job” territory, not a business. - If an investor buys such a shop, the value dies when the founder stops networking; no marketing engine means no transferable asset. #### ⏱️ [37:10](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=2230) — Realistic “passive income” - They reject internet‑guru promises of $50k/2 weeks from an app; call them “scoundrels”. - For agencies, passive income = systems that keep producing with light ongoing moderation (maintenance retainers, lead‑magnet sites, delegated work), not zero work. #### ⏱️ [40:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxnKRHJGEUM?t=2430) — Maintenance retainers & upsell systems - Mñana’s hosting/maintenance: $55–$79/month per site; 50 sites with ~$300/month to a staffer for updates yields ~$3.6k/month gross on that line. - Monthly maintenance is also an upsell trigger: plugin upgrades, form fixes, new tools, and training generate additional project revenue without new client acquisition. ## 📚 References - [The Mighty Mo](https://themightymo.com) - [Mañana Nomas](https://manananomas.com) *(if desired)* - [LinkedIn Sales Navigator](https://business.linkedin.com/sales-solutions/sales-navigator) - [Baldrige Performance Excellence Program](https://www.nist.gov/baldrige) ## 🗣️ Paraphrase - The conversation argues that agencies built purely on the owner’s referrals and personal hustle are fragile, low‑value jobs. To become real businesses, they must install systems: marketing engines independent of the owner, documented operations, standardized contracts, and recurring revenue. These reduce stress, increase predictability, and materially improve exit value. - “Passive income” in agencies is reframed as leveraged systems (maintenance plans, delegated updates, upsells, lead magnets) that still require oversight but free the owner from day‑to‑day technical work. ## 📰 Newsletter **WordPress Agencies: Escape the Referral Trap** Too many WordPress shops are really jobs in disguise. In this week’s Agency Action Show, Toby and Kurt unpack what it takes to build a *sellable* agency instead of a fragile solo hustle. **Key takeaways:** - Referral‑only = single point of failure. Add at least one proactive channel (SEO, LinkedIn, content, ads). - Processes are your real asset. Think “McDonald’s playbook,” not “freelancer memory.” - Maintenance retainers can throw off $3k+ / month while feeding small, consistent upsells. **Try this week:** - Document one process (invoicing, maintenance, onboarding) as if you’d hand it to a new hire tomorrow. - Audit your lead sources; design a concrete plan for your “third channel” beyond referrals and SEO. - Turn your next maintenance cycle into an upsell review: forms working, branding current, plugins optimal? Level up your agency operations with: - [Learn WordPress](https://learn.wordpress.org/) - [Developer Docs](https://developer.wordpress.org/) - [WP‑CLI](https://wp-cli.org/) ## ✅ Action Items #### DevRel - Developer marketing: Launch a bi‑weekly LinkedIn Live series teaching concrete WordPress/SEO topics; track leads from event sign‑ups. - Education: Record your existing project and maintenance workflows as short screencast “courses” for contractor onboarding. - Developer experience: Publish a reference stack (hosting, LMS, CRM, forms) with rationale and setup guides. - Community management: Adopt a no‑affiliate‑links norm for local WordPress mailing lists to keep recommendations unbiased. - Internal alignment: Create a simple feedback loop from support/PMs back to content topics (FAQ → posts/streams). #### OSPO - Policy & Governance: Codify how agency‑created plugins/themes are licensed and how contributions upstream are approved. - License Compliance: Integrate dependency scanning into your agency starter theme/plugin boilerplate. - Security Management: Define a clear process for handling plugin/theme vulnerabilities discovered on client sites. - Software Inventory: Maintain a registry of “approved stack” components (hosting, key plugins) with support owners. - Developer Support: Offer internal office hours on GPL, SaaS/API terms, and contribution questions. - Community Engagement: Allocate budget for sponsoring at least one WordCamp/meetup where your stack is discussed. - Strategic Alignment: Tie open‑source work (docs, example projects) to your lead‑gen and hiring goals. #### Community - Maintainers: Host a “roadmap clinic” session for agency‑maintained plugins used across client projects. - Contributors: Run a “first issue” day focused on documentation and small bugfixes in your internal starter themes. - Sponsors: Provide transparent reports to any tool vendor partners (hours, mentions, leads where known). - Ecosystem: Coordinate with other local agencies on shared security and update practices. #### WordPress - Core: Track how core changes affect agency stacks (e.g., editor, performance) and update client comms templates accordingly. - Core Performance: Benchmark typical client sites before and after major updates; share findings back to community. - Core AI: Evaluate AI‑assisted content/code tools only with clear boundaries around privacy and security. - **Core Program Team:** Create a recurring “agency feedback” touchpoint to surface pain points from real projects. - Mobile: Ensure themes/plugins selected for clients have solid mobile UX and are actively maintained. - Playground: Use Playground to prototype complex plugin stacks before deploying to production for clients. - Community: Offer talk proposals to local meetups on “from freelancer to sellable agency”. - Training: Develop internal lesson plans on pricing, retainers, and process documentation for junior staff. - Marketing: Build campaigns around “referrals *plus* marketing” rather than “referrals *instead of* marketing.” - Support: Maintain an internal knowledge base documenting recurring client questions and approved answers. - Design: Standardize basic component libraries that speed up builds and make maintenance easier. - Documentation: Create reusable SOPs for common agency flows (discovery, build, launch, maintenance, upsell). - Photos: Maintain a curated, license‑clean image library for repeat client use. - TV: Record and share case‑study walkthroughs of successful maintenance/upsell patterns. - Polyglots: When relevant, budget for translations of recurring client assets (forms, onboarding emails). - Accessibility: Bake basic WCAG checks into your process docs and QA sign‑off. - Meta: Track .org plugin/theme health for your standard stack (update frequency, open issues). - CLI: Use WP‑CLI to script recurring maintenance tasks where possible. - Hosting: Maintain a cross‑host checklist (backups, PHP versions, staging) to standardize offers. - Tide: Consider Tide scores (or equivalent) when picking plugins for your standard stack. - Openverse: Prefer Openverse and other clear‑license sources for images in client builds. - Themes: Maintain and evolve one or two base themes rather than bespoke every time. - Plugins: Keep a vetted plugin list and guidelines for when to approve exceptions. #### The WPOCC - Programs: Pilot micro‑grants for agencies that open‑source their internal process templates. - Projects: Run documentation sprints focused on “agency operations” patterns for the WordPress ecosystem. - Funding experiments: Test matched funding for agencies that mentor smaller shops on scaling and marketing. ### FAIR - Technical independence: Keep local copies and metadata for any critical vendor tools you integrate. - Policies and covenants: Make partnership/affiliate relationships transparent internally; avoid vendor lock‑in. - Productized governance artifacts: Turn your SOPs into clear charters and checklists that survive ownership changes. ## 🧪 Hypotheses - Agencies with documented, standardized processes achieve higher sale multiples than those relying on tacit owner knowledge. - Agencies with at least three independent lead channels (referrals, SEO, outbound/social, etc.) show more stable revenue over 3+ years. - Introducing a project manager to handle invoices and scope conversations reduces owner‑reported stress and DSO (days sales outstanding). - Systematic monthly maintenance‑visit upsells materially increase per‑site annual revenue compared to “silent” maintenance. - Solo, referral‑only agencies have significantly lower exit options and valuations than similarly sized agencies with marketing engines. ### 📊 Methodology - Collect anonymized sale data from WordPress agencies; code for presence/absence of process documentation, contract standardization, and marketing channels; run regression on sale multiple. - Track lead source mix and revenue volatility across 3–5 years for a cohort of agencies; compare single‑channel vs diversified. - Before/after study: measure DSO and owner time spent on collections pre‑PM and post‑PM. - A/B across client cohorts: one group gets maintenance‑triggered upsell reviews, the other only silent updates; compare incremental revenue and churn. ### ❓ Questions - Which specific processes (e.g., onboarding, maintenance, billing) contribute most to perceived buyer confidence? - How do acquirers weigh “founder brand” vs systematized marketing when pricing small agencies? - What is the minimum viable marketing stack for a 1–3 person shop to transition from “job” to “business”? - How does recurring revenue composition (hosting, care plans, retainers) influence the payback period for a buyer? ### 🔮 Future Research - Longitudinal case studies of agencies that successfully transitioned from solo referral shops to systematized, sellable businesses. - Comparative analysis of LinkedIn vs SEO vs paid ads as lead channels for WordPress agencies at different stages. - Examination of mental health outcomes for agency owners who aggressively delegate vs those who stay in all roles. - Study of how maintenance‑plan structure (pricing tiers, inclusions) affects profitability and upsell potential. ### 💡 Implications - Practice: Agency owners should prioritize documenting processes and diversifying lead sources before chasing raw topline growth. - Policy: Industry groups could define baseline operational standards to help buyers and sellers evaluate agencies consistently. - Security: Over‑reliance on a single lead or founder relationship is a business continuity risk similar to technical single points of failure. - Education: WordPress training should include business operations, pricing, and process design alongside technical skills. - Funding: Investors and acquirers may increasingly prefer agencies with stable recurring revenue and clear ops over purely founder‑driven shops. ### 🧠 Learning Styles Assessment Reading level estimate: Approximately Grade 12 (Flesch‑Kincaid), given conversational but business‑technical language. #### 👀 Visual learners - Present: Primarily conversational video; minimal visuals. - Improve: Add flowcharts for lead funnels, process diagrams for maintenance/up-sell flows, and before/after financial snapshots. #### 🔊 Aural learners - Present: Full audio discussion with natural back‑and‑forth. - Improve: Short 3–5 minute audio summary segments per theme (marketing, processes, exits). #### 🗣️ Verbal learners - Present: Strong analogies (“McDonald’s vs hamburger joint”), clear definitions of “job vs business” and “passive income”. - Improve: Glossary of agency terms (DSO, MRR, retainers, exit multiple). #### 🧩 Kinesthetic learners - Present: Real agency scenarios for reflection and self‑diagnosis. - Improve: Worksheets for mapping one’s own lead channels, process diagrams, and maintenance economics. #### 🧠 Logical learners - Present: Back‑of‑the‑envelope numbers (tool costs, staff hours, maintenance margins). - Improve: Explicit ROI formulas for LinkedIn investment, maintenance plans, and process documentation. #### 🧑‍🤝‍🧑 Social learners - Present: Two‑host conversational format with candid disagreement and shared experiences. - Improve: Discussion prompts and small‑group exercises for agency owner meetups. #### 🧘‍♀️ Solitary learners - Present: Implied self‑reflection (“do you have a business or a job?”). - Improve: Self‑assessment checklists and journaling prompts. #### 🌿 Naturalistic learners - Present: Ecosystem thinking (business “engines,” “channels” as system components). - Improve: Lifecycle framing (birth, growth, exit of an agency) and sustainability metaphors. ### 📊 Accessibility Assessment #### Screen reader semantics - Present: YouTube player supports basic structure; transcript text is linear. - Improve: Ensure clear heading levels and consistent speaker labels in any published transcript. #### Keyboard navigation - Present: Standard YouTube controls are keyboard accessible. - Improve: Provide timestamped chapter markers and clear focus states in any accompanying article page. #### Contrast and readability - Present: Default YouTube UI has adequate contrast. - Improve: If this is turned into a blog post, use high‑contrast body text, generous line height, and readable fonts. #### Text resizing and reflow - Present: YouTube is responsive across devices. - Improve: Any transcript page should support zoom to 200% without horizontal scroll. #### Media and captions - Present: YouTube auto‑captions and transcript. - Improve: Manually corrected captions and downloadable transcript; avoid auto‑playing audio on landing. #### Forms and interactions - Present: Minimal interaction beyond player controls. - Improve: If feedback forms are added, ensure labeled fields, clear errors, and large click targets. #### Standards reference - Map transcript + page experience against WCAG 2.2 AA, especially 1.2 (Time‑based Media), 1.4 (Distinguishable), 2.1 (Keyboard), 2.4 (Navigable). ### 🌍 DEIB Assessment #### Cultural breadth - Present: US‑centric agency context, English‑only. - Improve: Include non‑US examples, agencies in other markets, and multilingual considerations. #### Inclusive language - Present: Generally gender‑neutral, conversational tone. - Improve: Avoid assumptions about financial runway, family obligations, or ability to “just delegate.” #### Neurodiversity support - Present: Fairly structured conversation with topic transitions. - Improve: Provide written summaries per segment and clear outlines for those who need more structure. #### Representation - Present: Two male hosts, both agency owners. - Improve: Future episodes with guests from more diverse genders, races, regions, and business models. #### Psychological safety - Present: Honest talk about stress, burnout, and fear of non‑payment without shaming. - Improve: Content warnings when discussing financial distress and clear messaging that downsizing or exiting is valid. ### ✅ Logical Validity #### Strong reasoning - Causal: “If your leads depend on referrals and you leave, the business can’t sustain itself” — sound causal chain tying owner‑centric leads to low sale value. - Analogical: McDonald’s vs hamburger joint effectively illustrates how processes (not recipes alone) create scalability and value. - Inductive: Real acquisition offer (~1 year salary) supports the claim that small agencies are often valued far below topline. #### Fallacies - Survivorship bias: Only successful agencies (those still around and run by the hosts) are examined; failed agencies are not analyzed. - Fix: Explicitly mention that experiences may not generalize; add data or examples from failed exits. - Possible false dichotomy: Implying referral‑only shops are *not* businesses at all. - Fix: Reframe as “low‑value or fragile businesses” rather than “not businesses.” #### Tone of voice - Tone: Candid, slightly irreverent, skeptical of “get rich quick” gurus; supportive toward struggling owners. - Example: Calling some passive‑income promoters “absolute scoundrels,” while acknowledging the real, more modest versions of leveraged income. ### 🛡️ DARVO Analysis - Deny: No meaningful denial of responsibility; hosts openly admit their own past mistakes (over‑reliance on referrals, under‑documented processes). - Attack: Criticism aimed at passive‑income gurus (“scoundrels”) rather than at any accusers or vulnerable groups. - Reverse victim/offender: No attempt to portray themselves as victims when critiqued; instead they emphasize agency and choices available to owners. - Emotional cues: Frustration with manipulative marketing; empathy for agency owners drowning in stress or collections fear. ## 🎯 Conclusion - WordPress agencies that rely solely on referrals and founder heroics behave more like jobs than businesses and command weak exit multiples. To build a durable, sellable agency, owners must: document processes, standardize contracts, build recurring maintenance revenue, and add proactive marketing channels that don’t depend on their personal presence. Next steps: pick one process to document, one lead channel to strengthen, and one maintenance‑driven upsell experiment to run this month. ## 🧱 Refactor Appendix (append after 🎯 Conclusion) ### 📚 Literature Split Pad - Purpose: Stage Konik CEE units that become per-source Literature notes. - Split level: **H3**. - Include verbatim quotes under 25 words and a [view highlight] link. ### [H1] 5–10-word present-tense claim > [!quote] [{Title or entity}]({ARTICLE_URL}) by [[{Author or [MISSING]}]] via [[{Site or [MISSING]}]]. Published {DATE_OR_[MISSING]}. Accessed . > “Short quote, verbatim, ≤25 words.” Two lines: context and use. Cite data if relevant. [view highlight]({ARTICLE_URL}#H1) #xref #articleseed ID:rw_[MISSING] ### [H2] 5–10-word present-tense claim > [!quote] [{Title or entity}]({ARTICLE_URL}) > “Short quote, verbatim, ≤25 words.” Two lines: context and use. [view highlight]({ARTICLE_URL}#H2) #xref ID:rw_[MISSING] --- ### 🔖 Atomic Split Pad (Zettel Candidates) - Purpose: Promote reusable claims into Atomic notes. - Split level: **H4**. - Each item: one idea, present tense, specific, testable. #### [Z1] 5–10-word present-tense claim - Scope/condition in one line. - Pointer to page/time or dataset. - Links: [[Parent-Concept]] [[Related-Idea]] #### [Z2] 5–10-word present-tense claim - Scope/condition in one line. - Pointer to page/time or dataset. - Links: [[Parent-Concept]] [[Related-Idea]] --- ### ✏️ Fleeting Queue (Extract by Selection) - Purpose: Capture quick actions or sparks for Fleeting notes. - Extraction: **Select one line** → “Refactor: Extract selection to new note (content only).” - Keep each line short and self-contained. - [F1] Short action — context/{ARTICLE_URL} #fleeting #inbox - [F2] Short action — context/{ARTICLE_URL} #fleeting #inbox - [F3] Short action — context/{ARTICLE_URL} #fleeting #inbox ---