Why Smart People Are Abandoning Social Media Cal Newport

Why Smart People Are Abandoning Social Media | Cal Newport 🔗 **Source:** [Why Smart People Are Abandoning Social Media | Cal Newport](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X-Lb81yUph4) > [!note]+ Document Notes > tags: [social-media, digital-minimalism, curated-conversation-platforms] > author: Cal Newport > source: YouTube > reference: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X-Lb81yUph4 > date created: 2024-12-19 14:30 > > # 🏷️ Title: Why Smart People Are Abandoning Social Media >  ## 🧰 Action Inbox - [H1] Define specific social platforms to avoid — curated conversation platforms #digital-minimalism - [H2] Find alternative news sources — newsletters, podcasts, traditional media #information-diet - [H3] Replace social engagement with real community participation #community-building ## 🧭 Table of Contents - [📝 Summary](#-summary) - [📖 Main Content](#-main-content) - [🗒️ Notes](#️-notes) - [📚 References](#-references) - [🗣️ Paraphrase](#️-paraphrase) - [📰 Newsletter](#-newsletter) - [✅ Action Items](#-action-items) - [🧪 Hypotheses](#-hypotheses) - [📊 Methodology](#-methodology) - [❓ Questions](#-questions) - [🔮 Future Research](#-future-research) - [💡 Implications](#-implications) - [🧠 Learning Styles Assessment](#-learning-styles-assessment) - [📊 Accessibility Assessment](#-accessibility-assessment) - [🌍 DEIB Assessment](#-deib-assessment) - [✅ Logical Validity](#-logical-validity) - [🛡️ DARVO Analysis](#-darvo-analysis) - [🎯 Conclusion](#-conclusion) ### 🔗 References - [Cal Newport's Newsletter](https://calnewport.com/) - [Digital Minimalism Book](https://calnewport.com/digital-minimalism/) ## 📝 Summary - Cal Newport argues that "curated conversation platforms" (Twitter, Facebook, Threads, Blue Sky) create a "slope of terribleness" leading from distraction to demoderation to disassociation - He defines these platforms specifically as algorithmic curation + mass conversation, distinguishing them from direct messaging or content consumption platforms - The three connected harms are inevitable consequences of the technology's design, not fixable bugs - Even if users resist sliding to the bottom, they sacrifice mental energy and flourishing to maintain their position on the slope - Newport advocates complete abandonment of these platforms in favor of newsletters, podcasts, and real-world community engagement ## 📖 Main Content Newport presents a systematic argument against what he calls "curated conversation platforms" - social networks that combine algorithmic curation with mass conversation. His central thesis is that these platforms create an unavoidable progression of harm that he visualizes as a downward slope. The "slope of terribleness" begins with distraction, where algorithmic curation overwhelms users' short-term motivation circuits through dopamine-driven engagement. This leads to demoderation, where echo chambers and tribal community circuits cause users to lose ability to see opposing viewpoints in good faith. Finally, disassociation occurs when overwhelming frustration with "the other side" leads to nihilistic withdrawal or rage-driven action. Newport argues this progression is not a design flaw but an inherent feature of platforms that combine algorithmic curation with mass conversation. The technology cannot be reformed because the problems stem from its core functionality. Even users who resist sliding to the bottom must expend significant mental energy that could be better used elsewhere. ## 🗒️ Notes #### ⏱️ [00:00](https://youtu.be/X-Lb81yUph4?t=0) — [H1] Introduction and context setting - Key idea: Rebroadcasting his strongest anti-social media argument from a podcast - Evidence: "That monologue was really well-received and I think it's as relevant right now as it was back then" #### ⏱️ [02:30](https://youtu.be/X-Lb81yUph4?t=150) — [H1] Defining curated conversation platforms - Key idea: Specific category combining mass conversation with algorithmic curation - Evidence: "Platforms in which you have a lot of people joining in conversation using curation algorithms based on optimizing engagement" #### ⏱️ [04:45](https://youtu.be/X-Lb81yUph4?t=285) — [H2] Three categories of harm - Key idea: Distraction, demoderation, and disassociation are the primary harms - Evidence: "I think they lead to uniquely awful harms... most responsible for the rise in violence" #### ⏱️ [07:20](https://youtu.be/X-Lb81yUph4?t=440) — [H2] How people rationalize continued use - Key idea: Users minimize personal impact while acknowledging harm to others - Evidence: "I may suffer a bit from distraction... the demoderation thing is a problem for other tribes" #### ⏱️ [10:15](https://youtu.be/X-Lb81yUph4?t=615) — [H1] The slope of terribleness model - Key idea: Connected progression from distraction through demoderation to disassociation - Evidence: "When you first start using these platforms, it's pretty easy to fall onto this slope" #### ⏱️ [13:40](https://youtu.be/X-Lb81yUph4?t=820) — [H2] Why distraction is unavoidable - Key idea: Algorithmic curation overwhelms brain's motivation circuits with dopamine - Evidence: "It becomes very hard to consistently resist it... like trying to quit cigarettes while carrying a pack" #### ⏱️ [16:20](https://youtu.be/X-Lb81yUph4?t=980) — [H2] Echo chambers and tribal circuits - Key idea: Algorithmic curation creates echo chambers that activate tribal community circuits - Evidence: "It is just an unavoidable consequence of using this type of algorithmic curation" #### ⏱️ [19:30](https://youtu.be/X-Lb81yUph4?t=1170) — [H2] Evolutionary basis of tribal behavior - Key idea: Tribal community circuits evolved for survival and are extremely powerful - Evidence: "Throughout most of our history as homo sapiens... our tribe was everything" #### ⏱️ [22:10](https://youtu.be/X-Lb81yUph4?t=1330) — [H2] Path from demoderation to disassociation - Key idea: Frustration with opposing groups combined with isolation leads to nihilism or rage - Evidence: "The other side is so terrible and yet nothing is happening about it" #### ⏱️ [24:50](https://youtu.be/X-Lb81yUph4?t=1490) — [H1] Why technological fixes won't work - Key idea: The problems are inherent to the technology's core function - Evidence: "That's like saying to Pizza Hut... is there a way you can exist without selling pizza?" #### ⏱️ [27:30](https://youtu.be/X-Lb81yUph4?t=1650) — [H2] Cost of resisting the slope - Key idea: Even successful resistance requires mental energy and reduces flourishing - Evidence: "Resisting further slide down this slope requires a lot of mental energy" #### ⏱️ [30:20](https://youtu.be/X-Lb81yUph4?t=1820) — [H2] Better alternatives for information and community - Key idea: Newsletters, podcasts, and real-world engagement provide benefits without harms - Evidence: "Subscribe to actual media... do the old-fashioned work of finding credible individuals" #### ⏱️ [32:45](https://youtu.be/X-Lb81yUph4?t=1965) — [H1] Final call to action - Key idea: End the decade-long experiment with curated conversation platforms - Evidence: "To save civil society, we need to end our experiment... We tried them. They became dark and awful" ## 📚 References - [Cal Newport's Newsletter](https://calnewport.com/) - [Digital Minimalism](https://calnewport.com/books/digital-minimalism/) - [FBI reports on nihilistic violent extremism](https://www.fbi.gov/) - [Derek Thompson Atlantic article on socially isolated men](https://www.theatlantic.com/) - [Yuval Harari's Sapiens](https://www.ynharari.com/book/sapiens-2/) ## 🗣️ Paraphrase - Social media platforms that combine algorithmic feeds with mass conversation create an inevitable progression from addictive overuse to tribal polarization to complete disconnection from normal social constraints - This progression isn't a bug that can be fixed but rather the core function of how these platforms work - they need algorithmic curation to manage scale and they need engagement to make money - Even users who successfully resist sliding all the way down this slope of harm must spend significant mental energy doing so, reducing their overall life satisfaction and taking away from more meaningful activities ## 📰 Newsletter Social media might be more harmful than we thought, and it's time for WordPress developers and community members to reconsider our relationship with platforms like Twitter and Facebook. Cal Newport's latest analysis reveals that "curated conversation platforms" create what he calls a "slope of terribleness" - an inevitable progression from distraction to tribal polarization to complete social disconnection. This isn't about willpower or better habits; it's built into the technology itself. For our WordPress community, this has practical implications. Instead of engaging in heated debates on Twitter about WordPress drama, consider: - Following thoughtful newsletters from community leaders - Participating in local WordPress meetups - Contributing to Make WordPress teams where structured collaboration happens - Engaging in the WordPress Slack or forums where conversations are more focused The energy we spend resisting social media's worst impulses could be better invested in building real connections and contributing meaningful work to the WordPress ecosystem. Resources: [WordPress Community](https://make.wordpress.org/), [Local Meetups](https://www.meetup.com/topics/wordpress/), [WP Slack](https://make.wordpress.org/chat/) ## ✅ Action Items #### DevRel - Developer advocacy: Share this analysis with developer communities, create workshops on healthy information consumption - Education: Develop curricula around digital wellness for developers - Developer experience: Consider how documentation and community platforms can avoid the "slope of terribleness" - Developer marketing: Shift focus from social media engagement to newsletter and podcast strategies - Community management: Evaluate which platforms create constructive vs. destructive community dynamics #### OSPO - Policy & Governance: Develop guidelines for project communication channels that avoid curated conversation platforms - Community Engagement: Focus open source community building on structured forums rather than social media - Strategic Alignment: Measure community health metrics beyond social media engagement #### Community - Maintainers: Provide guidance on healthy communication channels for project governance - Contributors: Create onboarding that emphasizes productive collaboration tools over social media - Ecosystem: Foster connections through events and structured collaboration rather than online debates #### WordPress - Core: Consider how WordPress.org forums and communication channels avoid social media pitfalls - Community: Strengthen local meetup programs as alternatives to online engagement - Marketing: Shift strategy from viral social content to newsletter and podcast education - Support: Ensure help channels provide constructive rather than tribal environments ## 🧪 Hypotheses - Developers who quit curated conversation platforms will show increased productivity and code quality within 30 days - Open source projects that migrate away from Twitter for community engagement will see more constructive contributor discussions - WordPress community members who replace social media with newsletter consumption will report higher satisfaction with community involvement - Teams that eliminate social media checking during work hours will complete projects with fewer scope changes and less interpersonal conflict ### 📊 Methodology - Productivity study: Track commit frequency, code review quality, and self-reported focus levels before/after social media elimination - Community analysis: Compare sentiment analysis and thread length in Twitter discussions vs. structured forums for same topics - Satisfaction survey: Measure WordPress community engagement satisfaction across different communication channel preferences - Team performance: Monitor project completion rates, change requests, and team satisfaction across social media usage policies ### ❓ Questions - Can professional developer communities maintain effective knowledge sharing without curated conversation platforms? - What communication structures best replicate the networking benefits of social media without the algorithmic manipulation? - How quickly do individuals recover focus and emotional regulation after leaving social platforms? ### 🔮 Future Research - Longitudinal study of developer career outcomes based on social media usage patterns - Analysis of open source project health metrics correlated with community platform choices - Investigation of alternative community building methods for distributed teams ### 💡 Implications - Practice: Development teams may need new strategies for staying current without social media - Policy: Organizations might benefit from explicit social media policies for professional use - Security: Reduced social media exposure could decrease social engineering attack vectors - Education: Developer training should include digital wellness and information diet design - Funding: Marketing budgets may need reallocation from social media to newsletter and event strategies ### 🧠 Learning Styles Assessment Reading level estimate: 11th grade (Flesch-Kincaid) #### 👀 Visual learners - Present: Hand-drawn slope diagram, visual metaphors for concepts - Improve: Flowcharts showing progression, infographics comparing platform types #### 🔊 Aural learners - Present: Originally podcast content, spoken explanations - Improve: Audio-only version without visual distractions #### 🗣️ Verbal learners - Present: Clear definitions, analogies (cigarettes, Pizza Hut), evolutionary explanations - Improve: More concrete examples, case study narratives #### 🧩 Kinesthetic learners - Present: Action-oriented recommendations, practical alternatives - Improve: Step-by-step platform migration guides, hands-on exercises #### 🧠 Logical learners - Present: Systematic three-part argument, cause-and-effect reasoning - Improve: Decision trees for platform evaluation, quantified harm metrics #### 🧑‍🤝‍🧑 Social learners - Present: Community-focused alternatives, tribal behavior analysis - Improve: Group discussion guides, peer accountability frameworks #### 🧘‍♀️ Solitary learners - Present: Individual reflection prompts, personal decision framework - Improve: Self-assessment tools, private journaling questions #### 🌿 Naturalistic learners - Present: Evolutionary psychology connections, ecosystem metaphors - Improve: Natural vs. artificial social environment comparisons ### 📊 Accessibility Assessment #### Screen reader semantics - Present: Clear heading hierarchy, descriptive content structure - Improve: Alt text for hand-drawn diagrams, more descriptive link text #### Keyboard navigation - Present: Standard video player controls, timestamp links - Improve: Chapter navigation, transcript with timestamps #### Contrast and readability - Present: High contrast text, clear typography - Improve: Ensure hand-drawn diagrams meet contrast requirements #### Text resizing and reflow - Present: Responsive text layout - Improve: Test at 200% zoom, ensure diagram accessibility #### Media and captions - Present: Full transcript available, spoken content - Improve: Time-synchronized captions, audio descriptions for visuals #### Forms and interactions - Present: Simple video interface - Improve: Accessible sharing options, feedback mechanisms ### 🌍 DEIB Assessment #### Cultural breadth - Present: Universal human psychology concepts, cross-cultural tribal behavior - Improve: Examples beyond US political polarization, global platform impacts #### Inclusive language - Present: Gender-neutral terms, accessible explanations of technical concepts - Improve: Avoid assumptions about technology access, consider different cultural contexts #### Neurodiversity support - Present: Clear structure, systematic argument progression - Improve: Summary sections, varied explanation methods #### Representation - Present: Focus on universal human experiences - Improve: Acknowledge different relationships to technology across communities #### Psychological safety - Present: Non-judgmental approach to current social media use - Improve: Acknowledge legitimate concerns about isolation when leaving platforms ### ✅ Logical Validity #### Strong reasoning - Deductive strength: Strong logical progression from platform mechanics to behavioral outcomes - Inductive strength: Good use of FBI terminology and behavioral patterns as evidence - Causal reasoning: Clear causal chains from algorithmic design to psychological effects - Analogical strength: Effective analogies (cigarettes, Pizza Hut) that clarify concepts #### Fallacies - Slippery slope: The "slope of terribleness" metaphor might oversimplify individual variation in outcomes - False dichotomy: Limited discussion of moderate usage or platform design alternatives - Appeal to nature: Evolutionary psychology arguments could be more nuanced #### Tone of voice - Overall tone: Authoritative but conversational, urgent but not alarmist, uses concrete metaphors and systematic reasoning ### 🛡️ DARVO Analysis - Deny: No denial present - acknowledges social media provides some --- ## Full Transcript [00:00] Earlier this fall, right after the [00:02] murder of Charlie Kirk, I recorded a [00:05] monologue on my podcast where I argued [00:09] why social media was worse than we [00:11] thought and that maybe now was the time [00:13] to finally quit. Well, that monologue [00:17] was really wellreceived and and I think [00:19] it's as relevant right now as it was [00:22] back then, if not more so. So, what I [00:24] want to do here in this clip I'm about [00:26] to show you, I'm pulling out that piece [00:28] of the podcast episode where I make my [00:31] my strongest argument against social [00:33] media and my most intense plea that you [00:35] should quit it. And I'm going to play [00:36] that for you now. Uh, I think you're [00:39] going to find it intriguing. All right. [00:40] So, we need to start our conversation [00:42] here by defining some terms. Uh, the [00:44] phrase social media can mean a lot of [00:46] things and then that creates confusion [00:48] because you might have one thing in mind [00:50] and someone else has something else. So [00:52] let's get really specific today. I'm [00:54] going to be referring to a specific [00:57] class of social apps that I call curated [01:01] conversation platforms. Right? So these [01:04] are platforms in which you have a lot of [01:06] people joining in conversation be it [01:09] through text, images or video [01:11] using curation algorithms based on [01:13] optimizing engagement to help select [01:15] what each individual user sees. So, some [01:19] obvious examples of curated conversation [01:21] platforms include Twitter and Blue Sky [01:23] and Threads and Facebook. Those are [01:25] classic. There's other things that [01:27] people call social media that don't fit [01:28] into this particular category. So, [01:30] probably like Pinterest doesn't fall [01:32] into there. Uh, it's not a conversation [01:34] platform so much as you're looking at [01:36] things that people posted. Snapchat [01:38] doesn't fall into here. Uh, it's a [01:40] conversation platform, but it's not [01:41] algorithmically curated. It's you [01:43] talking to groups of other people. [01:45] WhatsApp wouldn't fall in here either. [01:46] Again, it's not algorithmically curated [01:48] as conversation, but not a massive [01:50] platform. And then there's some [01:51] platforms where depending on how you use [01:55] them could fall into this category or [01:57] not. So, I think things like Instagram [01:59] or YouTube, depending on how you use [02:01] them, could fall into the category what [02:02] we're talking about today or not. So, [02:04] just to be clear about our definitions. [02:06] Now, I want to focus on curated [02:08] conversation platforms in particular [02:09] because I think they lead to uniquely [02:11] awful harms. I also think they are the [02:14] social platform most responsible for the [02:18] rise in violence that we've been seeing [02:20] recently be it political uh or [02:22] otherwise. All right, so let's talk [02:24] about these curated conversation [02:26] platforms. So what are the harms? If you [02:29] ask people, hey, what's wrong with like [02:30] Twitter, Blue Sky or Threads? Like what [02:32] are the harms that we care about? [02:33] They'll eventually probably list some [02:35] combination of the following three [02:37] things. I'll put these up on the screen [02:38] for those who are watching instead of [02:40] just listening. They're probably going [02:42] to say, "Okay, uh, distraction. [02:45] That's a common harm." This is the one I [02:47] talk about a lot in my books on this [02:48] show. Uh, it's the idea that there's an [02:50] addictive element to these platforms so [02:52] that we use them more than is healthy [02:53] and to the detriment of other things uh, [02:56] that we seem to be are important in our [02:57] life. Another harm people will often [02:59] mention if you talk about these [03:00] platforms is demoderation. This is where [03:03] you begin to lose any sense of [03:04] moderation around a given issue. It's [03:06] where you become increasingly strident, [03:08] see less room for good faith or even [03:09] basic humanity on the other side of the [03:11] issue in question. Uh there's a lot of [03:14] tribalism when it comes to demoderation. [03:16] You become part of a tribe that's [03:17] fighting some sort of epic fight. So uh [03:19] because of these stakes, there's a lot [03:21] of sort of furious policing of your own [03:23] tribe. The third harm we often hear [03:25] about these things is what I call [03:27] disassociation. [03:29] And this is where things really get [03:30] scary. This is where you begin to make a [03:32] complete break from normal associations [03:34] with human community. you lose [03:36] connection to normative ethical [03:38] constraints. This is the state in which [03:40] violence to others or to yourself [03:42] becomes a possibility or where you [03:44] become numbed to seeing such violence [03:46] being perpetrated against others. [03:48] There's really two major flavors of [03:50] dissociation. There's one that's based [03:53] around overwhelming rage. Well, I am so [03:56] mad I have to take action regardless of [03:59] the consequences. The other flavor of [04:01] this association where it leads is [04:03] nihilistic withdrawal. The idea that the [04:05] world is so dark and unredeemable and [04:07] meaningless that you might as well cause [04:08] some chaos on the way out. This [04:10] nihilistic variation of disassociation [04:12] is one that we've really been feeling [04:14] the consequences of recently. [04:16] Uh earlier this year, the FB FBI began [04:20] using a new term when talking about mass [04:22] violence incidents. They call it [04:24] nihilistic violent extremist. [04:27] It was become so common to have violence [04:29] caused by a sense of nihilism that [04:30] there's a new term for it that the FBI [04:32] uses. Uh part of the issue with [04:35] nihilistic withdrawal is that if it is [04:39] online platforms that have driven you to [04:42] disassociation, [04:44] you begin to think, oh, all that matters [04:49] is attention and respect on online [04:50] platforms. Here's Derrick Thompson [04:52] writing in a Atlantic piece that he [04:54] wrote a couple years ago. For many [04:56] socially isolated men in particular, for [04:58] whom reality consists primarily of [05:00] glowing screens and empty rooms, a vote [05:02] for destruction is a politics of last [05:03] resort, a way to leave one's mark on a [05:05] world where collective progress or [05:06] collective support of any kind feels [05:08] impossible. Right? So online [05:10] disassociation can lead to violence [05:12] because you're like, why not? And the [05:14] only thing that really matters is views [05:16] and this will get me attention. [05:19] All right, so these are the harms that [05:20] people would normally talk about. [05:22] If you then say to someone, all right, [05:25] given these harms of curated [05:27] conversation platforms, why are you [05:29] still using them? Why don't more people [05:32] quit? Well, this is because if you ask [05:34] people how these harms affect them, uh [05:36] they're going to give an answer that [05:38] looks something like this. And Jesse, we [05:39] can take this off the screen for now. [05:41] They'll say something like, "I may [05:43] suffer a bit from distraction." Like [05:45] most people will cop to that. Yeah, I [05:46] use these more than is useful, but I [05:48] could probably get that under control [05:50] with, you know, some better habits or I [05:52] can break my phone or something like [05:53] that. Then they'll say typically, yeah, [05:55] the demoderation thing that is a [05:57] problem. Not really for me, but but for [05:58] the other the other tribes. It's like [06:00] whatever groups I'm affiliated with, [06:02] like we're just being reasonable. We're [06:03] reasonably upset and we're kind of [06:05] right. But the other I I get it. Other [06:07] people on the other side, they have [06:10] problems with de moderation. Probably [06:11] the fix for that is uh depending on what [06:14] side of the political spectrum I'm on. [06:15] Maybe it's something about more [06:16] aggressive content moderation. So if [06:18] they don't see the crazy stuff, they [06:19] won't act so demoderated. Or maybe it's [06:21] a community notes like, well, if we [06:23] could just correct things that are [06:24] false, then people would be a little bit [06:25] more reasonable. But that's kind of a [06:27] other person problem. And then [06:28] disassociation. Well, people would say, [06:30] yeah, that's scary for sure. Like look [06:32] at these nihilistic extremist. That's [06:34] scary. But that's not even really [06:36] happening on the platforms I use. Like [06:38] when I think about whenever I hear about [06:40] these mass shooters, you always hear [06:42] about them being uh on like Rumble or [06:45] Kick or on some sort of like groper [06:48] server on Discord, these sort of weird [06:51] semi dark web type platform. So maybe we [06:54] should shut those down, but what does [06:55] that have to do with me? [06:58] That's sort of how people respond to [06:59] these harms. And I think that response [07:01] goes a long way to explaining why we're [07:04] sort of stuck, why more people aren't [07:06] making major changes about the role of [07:07] these technologies in their lives. But [07:10] here's the thing. Is that interpretation [07:13] of these harms, right? [07:15] I don't think it is. What I want to do [07:18] here is outline a different way of [07:20] understanding how these curated [07:22] conversation platforms hurt you. And [07:24] it's going to be a way of understanding [07:26] them that is not going to let you off [07:27] the hook so easily. All right, I'm going [07:30] to do some drawing here, so beware. If [07:32] you're listening, you might want to turn [07:33] on to the YouTube version to see my my [07:37] brilliant art. All right, so what I have [07:38] up here on the screen is the three harms [07:40] we talked about. Distraction, [07:42] demoderation, uh, and disassociation. [07:46] The right way to think about how we [07:48] interact with these is to imagine that [07:51] there is a slope. So, I'm going to start [07:54] drawing a slope. [07:56] I'm going to start got to get my RS hat [07:59] on. Starting with distraction, we start [08:02] sloping downhill and then we'll switch [08:05] over to de moderation. [08:08] That slope continues. Then finally, [08:12] we get to disassociation. [08:14] That slope continues. And I'm going to [08:16] draw here [08:18] a sort of dividing line [08:21] between I'm going to label this here. [08:24] Mainstream. Oh, look at that [08:26] handwriting, Jesse. Mainstream internet [08:29] on top, [08:31] dark web below. [08:33] All right, so let me explain this [08:35] beautiful picture I just drew. It's [08:36] pretty colorful, actually. I give myself [08:37] a lot of credit for that. It's a slope [08:40] sloping downhill. It starts in the [08:43] distraction zone, then the slope goes [08:45] through the demoderation zone, and then [08:46] finally the slope goes through the [08:48] disassociation zone. I've drawn a ground [08:51] across this slope diagram. So, right [08:53] around the place we go from demoderation [08:55] to disassociation, the slope goes [08:56] underground. Above ground is like [08:58] mainstream internet. Below ground, now [09:01] we're in the world um sort of of the [09:03] dark web. So, let me explain my model [09:06] here. When you first start using [09:10] these type of curated conversation [09:12] platforms, it's pretty easy to fall onto [09:14] this slope. That is into this zone of [09:16] distraction. So, you sort of fall into [09:18] the top of the slope where you're like, [09:19] you know what, I'm using this probably [09:21] too much. I'm using this a lot. whatever [09:22] my platform poison of choice is. I'm [09:25] kind of on this more that it's healthy, [09:26] right? Like, h this is not good. You [09:28] know me, I'm addicted to my phone. So, [09:30] we're kind of in that territory. Here's [09:31] the thing, though. You start sliding and [09:35] you're in this distraction zone long [09:36] enough. Gravity is going to pull you [09:38] down into the demoderation portion of [09:41] the slope. And now you're not just using [09:44] these services too much. You're [09:46] demoderating. [09:48] You're losing your ability to see the [09:49] other side in any sort of good faith. [09:52] you find yourself in dehumanizing [09:53] tendencies. I just hate those people. I [09:55] can't anyone who supports this person. I [09:58] just can't even imagine that. Right? [10:00] Like a they are wrong. And wait a [10:01] second. Wait a second. You're on my [10:03] team. You said the wrong thing there. [10:04] Don't you realize we have we're at war [10:07] here. We have to close ranks. All that [10:09] begins to happen. And it gets worse and [10:11] worse as you slide down this slope. If [10:13] you continue down the slope and the [10:14] pressure is pulling here, you'll end up [10:16] in the disassociation zone where you you [10:17] say, "You know what? Uh, screw it." [10:21] Right? The world is unredeemable. [10:23] And once you're down here is where [10:26] people bounce off of the primary [10:30] mainstream platforms. You begin to [10:31] bounce off those into like whatever [10:33] mixture of things like Gab or Kick [10:37] or Rumble. Like now you kind of like end [10:39] up roaming around these barely regulated [10:42] sort of wild west semi dark web type [10:44] services. And that's where like the [10:45] really bad stuff happens. [10:48] This is I call this the slope of [10:49] terribleness. This is actually the right [10:51] way to understand these harms. They're [10:53] all connected. You start with one, but [10:55] gravity's pulling you down towards the [10:57] next and then towards the next. Now, [10:59] your question might be, can we fix this? [11:02] Maybe if we just fix these services, [11:04] there's a way that we can we can maybe [11:05] put up some roadblocks on the slope of [11:07] terribleness and prevent this from [11:08] happening. But I want to argue that [11:09] actually this is not the side effect of [11:12] some mistakes in the way these services [11:13] were implemented that can be fixed. But [11:15] actually the slope of terribleness and [11:17] the tendency to slide down it is [11:19] actually fundamental to how these [11:21] technologies function. Let me get a [11:23] little bit into this. All right, let's [11:24] start with distraction. You start using [11:27] a curated conversation platform. Part of [11:31] the problem is the curation means that [11:33] the algorithm is looking for engaging [11:36] material. What actually catches your [11:37] attention? Whatever that is, it will get [11:39] pretty good at finding that. It [11:40] represents it as sort of weighted data [11:42] points in a multi-dimensional space. but [11:44] it figures out what type of content is [11:45] engaging for you because that's how they [11:47] make their money. Now, the issue with [11:49] this is the stuff you're seeing on the [11:51] phone is uh very compelling. This will [11:54] pretty soon begin to overwhelm your [11:56] short-term motivation centers in your [11:58] brain. So, we have these circuits in our [12:00] brain that are making predictions. [12:02] They're looking at activities that are [12:03] available to you in the moment, and [12:05] they're making predictions based off [12:06] past learning. What are the different [12:09] outcomes going to be of these various [12:12] short-term activities? And if the brain [12:15] has learned, oh, there's a really [12:17] positive outcome that's going to happen [12:18] from a particular activity, you get a [12:20] flood of dopamine in that motivation [12:22] circuit, which activates it and then [12:23] makes that that activity seem [12:25] irresistible. Right? This is something [12:27] we often get wrong about dopamine. I [12:29] noticed this in like the the governor of [12:31] Utah, Spencer Cox's comments in the the [12:33] aftermath of the Kirk assassination. A [12:35] lot of people think of dopamine as a [12:37] pleasure chemical of like, oh, once you [12:39] do something, you get a splash of [12:40] dopamine and it feels good. No, no, no. [12:42] It's a motivation chemical. So, these [12:44] short-term motivation circuits have [12:46] learned through past experience. For [12:48] example, when I eat that cookie, there's [12:50] all of these things I feel that are [12:52] good. And the circuits learn from that [12:54] and they say, "Great. When I see a [12:56] cookie again, dopamine will activate [12:58] that circuit because that circuit [13:00] recognizes the cookie and give me a [13:01] sense of intense motivation to eat it." [13:04] Well, algorithmically curated content [13:07] really plays to those circuits very [13:09] well. And if you're using the phone all [13:11] the time, you build a very strong [13:14] prediction circuit that when it says a [13:15] phone is nearby, dopamine, dopamine, [13:18] dopamine, in that circuit saying, "Pick [13:19] up that phone and look at it. We're [13:20] going to see something that's going to [13:21] cause a reaction that's interesting. Be [13:23] it pleasurable or outrage, but it's [13:25] going to be interesting, an interesting [13:27] reaction." That is very, very strong. [13:30] And the problem is the phone is always [13:33] with you. [13:34] So that circuit is just constantly being [13:37] bathed in dopamine. It becomes very very [13:39] hard. You can resist it sometimes, [13:42] but it becomes very hard to consistently [13:44] resist it. So you go back to using those [13:46] services again and again and again. [13:47] That's just a basic sort of feedback [13:49] reinforcement loop. It would be like [13:50] trying to quit cigarettes. You're like, [13:52] look, I don't want to smoke, but I'm [13:53] going to carry in my hand at all times a [13:55] pack of cigarettes that's right there. [13:57] That's a very hard way to to cut back on [13:59] smoking because those circuits are [14:01] constantly being bathed in dopamine [14:02] saying that will give us a reward. You [14:04] need to smoke it. All right. So, just as [14:07] fundamental brain chemistry, you have [14:08] algorithmically curated content [14:10] accessible in your hand at all times. [14:12] You're going to use that more than you [14:14] want to. So, that's how you begin [14:15] sliding down that distraction slope as [14:18] soon as you begin in any sort of regular [14:20] way using one of these curated [14:22] platforms. [14:24] Why does this bring us into [14:25] demoderation? [14:27] Well, two things happen with these [14:28] platforms once you start using them all [14:30] the time. [14:32] Another side effect of the algorithmic [14:34] curation is the echo chamber effect. And [14:36] we say this sort of loosely like, oh, [14:38] don't be in an echo chamber, but I'm [14:40] saying it in a in a sort of a [14:41] techneterminist sort of way. It is a [14:44] unavoidable side effect of an [14:46] algorithmically curated information [14:48] experience. the way these algorithms [14:50] actually work and and I don't want to be [14:52] too technical but basically they have [14:54] these huge multi-dimensional uh points. [14:58] So just large vectors of numbers that [15:00] describe it's an embedding of content [15:02] into uh think of it as like a bunch of [15:04] little descriptions. I have a thousand [15:07] categories I can use when I'm trying to [15:09] describe something. And I take a thing [15:10] and I go through and give it a number in [15:12] each of these categories. And that [15:14] combination like describes it really [15:15] well. And what it does is it learns [15:19] spaces the multi-dimensional spaces in [15:20] which these preference vectors exist. It [15:22] sort of learns these regions [15:25] where content here does really well with [15:27] this person [15:29] that creates an echo chamber. I mean [15:30] it's not no one's sitting there [15:32] programming create echo chamber execute [15:34] or there's an echo chamber knob. It is [15:36] just an unavoidable consequence of using [15:39] this type of I'm going to observe your [15:42] engagement and then use that to try to [15:43] figure out where in the space of [15:44] possible content things create the most [15:46] engagement. So you're going to start [15:47] seeing a lot of stuff that's similar. [15:50] So if there's a a something you lean [15:52] towards on an issue, you're going to be [15:53] seeing a lot more of stuff about that [15:55] side of the issue and you're going to [15:56] see stuff that's more and more engaging [15:58] within that space, which will typically [15:59] be the stuff that's a little bit more [16:01] strident in. We like that. Okay. The [16:04] other issue is so we're hearing kind of [16:05] the same stuff. You you algorithmic echo [16:08] chamber. These are conversation [16:10] platforms. Remember I mentioned it's [16:12] important that it's people conversing [16:14] not just like you consuming content from [16:16] experts [16:18] that is going to fire up in your mind [16:20] the tribal community circuits. Yeah. [16:23] These are these people that we're [16:24] talking back and forth. I'm in [16:25] community. The social circuits come up. [16:27] So you have echo chambers plus tribal [16:29] community circuits fired up and these [16:31] things come together and they create in [16:34] your mind this virtual tribe that has a [16:37] very strong cause. That's where [16:39] demoderation comes from. It's not a lack [16:41] of willpower on your point. It's not a [16:43] sort of knob that can be turned in the [16:45] the algorithms that run these social [16:47] networks. It is a unescapable [16:48] consequence of how these platforms [16:51] function. Those tribal community [16:53] circuits are incredibly powerful because [16:56] throughout most of our modern history as [16:58] a homo sapiens, so let's go back two to [17:00] 300,000 years. This is how we survived. [17:02] Our tribe was everything. The other [17:05] tribes, we had to be very, very [17:06] suspicious of it. You are not from my [17:09] tribe. My tribe is what matters. If [17:11] you're not, I worry that you are going [17:13] to you're going to kill me or steal our [17:14] food. I do not like you and I need to be [17:17] that. There's nothing more compelling [17:20] than those tribal community circuits. [17:21] You can think of like the entire history [17:24] of of human civilization. Yval Harrari [17:27] is good about how we used abstractions [17:28] to do this is an effort to try to [17:31] overcome [17:33] the tribal community circuits that are [17:34] so deep in our mind. And this is [17:36] basically the point of the book sapiens [17:38] if you want to sort of go down a rabbit [17:39] hole here is that humans abilities to [17:41] organize around abstract causes in [17:44] tribes basically hijacked our tribal [17:46] circuits and allowed us to expand the [17:48] scope to which they applied them. So now [17:50] they could apply to like our entire [17:51] country or everyone who shares a [17:53] religion as what allowed humans to work [17:55] together in large numbers which was key [17:56] to our success. That is Yuval Harrari's [17:59] argument. But the point is our success [18:01] came from figuring out how do we [18:03] actually like hijack overwhelm or [18:04] otherwise redirect these tribal circuits [18:06] because they are so strong. [18:09] Curated conversation platforms just get [18:10] back to paleolithic let's go right and [18:13] that's where that demoderation is so [18:15] strong. And it's not because, oh, that's [18:18] a a bug in the system. We need to turn [18:21] that off so I can get the real value out [18:22] of these platforms. It is the value for [18:24] most people. That is what's creating the [18:26] most engagement. That's the thing that's [18:28] feeding into our to to the addiction [18:30] loop on it. So, it's very difficult to [18:33] avoid demoderation if you're using these [18:34] things a lot. All right. But now, here's [18:37] the problem. the more increasingly [18:39] demoderated you get and look in the [18:41] mirror. know you are like whatever issue [18:43] it is you care about. These tribes are [18:45] almost by the way random what you end up [18:47] echochambered in. It's like your slight [18:49] preferences plus whatever the algorithm [18:51] pushed you in. Like it could be pretty [18:52] arbitrary. But just think about right [18:54] now whether it's like it's political and [18:57] you're you're like on the left and [18:59] thinking about MAGA people or you're on [19:00] the right and you're thinking about like [19:02] the blue hair people or you know you're [19:05] a like a a super health mom who's [19:06] thinking about man these pharmaceutical [19:08] companies are are poisoning my kids [19:09] because they don't care or whatever the [19:12] issue is. Right? Think about the the [19:14] push to dehumanize that other that other [19:17] group. Like man they're just terrible. [19:20] Look at this stuff I'm reading. I just [19:21] cannot imagine how they exist. When you [19:24] are in that mindset, [19:26] you keep sliding down the slope of [19:27] terribleness. That is what eventually [19:30] gets you to disassociation because you [19:32] get to a point where you say [19:35] the other thing the the side I don't [19:36] like is so terrible and yet nothing is [19:38] happening about it. We're not, you know, [19:41] cutting off half the country or whatever [19:42] it is. Like they're not seeing that I'm [19:44] just right and changing their views to [19:46] align with mine and no one seems to [19:47] care. Uh or whatever the issue is. and [19:50] it nihilism either nihilism or rage [19:52] follows like I just I can't fathom this [19:54] and it sort of breaks it the make [19:56] matters worse especially if you're [19:58] younger [19:59] a side effect of a conversation platform [20:02] is that it's taking the place of actual [20:04] human interaction so you're also going [20:06] to become more actually socially [20:07] isolated so huge demoderation plus more [20:10] of social isolation whether you're young [20:12] this also happens a lot with older [20:14] people as well who are sort of retired [20:15] and older in life man that gets you to [20:17] disassociation Before [20:20] you know it, you're showing up at Comet [20:23] Pizza. You know, someone's got to free [20:26] the kids from the secret caves [20:28] underneath or you're a nihilistic [20:30] shooter. [20:32] One thing leads to another [20:35] and it is built into the technology. So, [20:38] we can't fix this. You can't This is not [20:40] There's no version of Twitter that [20:42] doesn't have this because the point is [20:43] is the two things that drive this is the [20:45] fact that it's people coming together. [20:47] or it's virtual interaction that is [20:48] algorithmically curated. You turn it [20:50] off, you don't have those services. You [20:52] can't have a version of those services [20:53] without uh conversation and algorithmic [20:56] curation. That is the service. That's [20:59] like saying to Pizza Hut, look, we we we [21:01] don't want to put you out of business, [21:02] but is there a way you can exist without [21:03] selling pizza? Like that's what we do, [21:06] right? This is what these conversational [21:08] algorithmic platforms do. You have a [21:09] huge number of people come together onto [21:10] a platform to have conversation. You [21:13] have to have algorithmic curation [21:14] because what else are you going to do? [21:15] you have 500 million people submitting [21:17] tweets a day. You have to curate it. And [21:19] if you're going to curate it, you're [21:20] going to curate it on like what people [21:21] want to see. And you put those forces [21:23] together, you slide down the slope of [21:25] terribleness. There is no technological [21:27] fix to this. It is a unavoidable side [21:30] effect of these technologies. [21:33] All right. So, you're probably saying, [21:35] "Yes, but I'm not going to end up at the [21:39] bottom of the slope. I've used these [21:41] things. Most people don't. [21:43] A lot of people use these services, but [21:45] they don't end up on, you know, Rumble [21:47] or or Groful, you know, Groper Discord [21:50] servers, right? And it's true, you can [21:53] resist the pole of gravity, but let's [21:56] think about what that costs. I'm going [21:57] to bring up this picture one more time [21:59] on here. So, we have the slope of [22:01] terribleness here. Um, so yes, I'm going [22:03] to draw a little picture here. It is [22:05] true you can, you know, at some point [22:10] hold on. I don't know. Does that look [22:11] like a mountain climber holding on [22:12] Jesse? [22:13] >> Yeah, I'm doing something. All right. [22:14] So, you you can arrest your fall at some [22:17] point. But here's the issue. There's two [22:20] issues with this. All right. Number one, [22:24] imagine over here we have a scale. Think [22:27] about this as like a scale of [22:29] flourishing, right? The higher up you're [22:32] on the scale, the more you're [22:33] flourishing as a human. I'll label that [22:36] flourishing. [22:39] I'll pull that down there. So here's the [22:41] problem. [22:43] Yes, you stop yourself somewhere on the [22:45] slope of terribleness, but the farther [22:46] you've gone down, the lower you've gone [22:48] down on the scale of flourishing. So [22:50] maybe you arrest your stop somewhere [22:51] here in the de moderation area, but [22:53] you've arrested your life in a place [22:54] that's worse. You're flourishing less [22:56] than if you weren't on the slope at all. [22:58] To make matters worse, resisting further [23:01] slide down this slope requires a lot of [23:04] mental energy. To not be demoderated [23:07] when you're using the services all the [23:08] time requires like a real application of [23:11] will. When you're demoderated, to not to [23:13] make that final slide towards [23:15] disassociation requires a lot of will. [23:17] To be fully disassociated and resist the [23:19] call to come join other disassociated [23:21] people who understand your disaection on [23:23] these sort of dark web type services. [23:25] That takes a lot of mental energy. So [23:27] yes, you can maybe prevent yourself and [23:29] most people do of course from getting to [23:31] the bottom of the slope of terribleness, [23:32] but they get stuck in a place where they [23:33] have reduced flourishing and is eating [23:35] up a lot of mental energy that you could [23:37] otherwise be spending on stuff that [23:38] matters to you more in your life. So why [23:42] is this worth it to be less happy and to [23:45] waste huge amounts of mental energy [23:47] needed to prevent yourself from [23:48] descending into what is essentially a [23:50] sort of living hell? Once you realize [23:53] the real dynamics at play here, it [23:54] becomes hard to justify why you're still [23:57] spending time [24:00] with these curated conversational [24:01] platforms. [24:03] You want to stay up to date on the news, [24:04] subscribe to actual media. You want to [24:07] hear information that you think is [24:08] otherwise being suppressed. All right, [24:11] subscribe to newsletters, subscribe to [24:13] podcast, do the oldfashioned work of [24:15] here is a a real individual. Here is why [24:18] I think they are a good person to listen [24:20] to. Here is their credentials. here's [24:22] how they convince me and I will listen [24:23] to them writing out a thing once a week [24:25] and there's no curation and it's not [24:27] conversation great do that the internet [24:29] can help you here you don't have to be [24:30] on the curated conversation platforms [24:32] you want to be a part of something [24:33] that's great being on those platforms [24:35] just tricks you into thinking you're a [24:37] part of something you're not you imagine [24:40] often if you're engaged in combat on [24:42] these platforms you imagine you're at [24:44] the front of the crowd marching on that [24:45] that bridge from Selma in reality you're [24:48] in an attention factory [24:50] punching with your time clock while your [24:52] billionaire overseers laugh as their net [24:55] worth goes up due to your efforts. You [24:57] want to be a part of something, actually [24:58] go be a part of something, not on a [25:00] screen. And maybe you're using because [25:01] you're bored. Find better entertainment. [25:03] Even on your phone, there's better high [25:04] quality entertainment. Do whatever it [25:06] literally almost anything else. I know [25:09] it's it presses these buttons. Find [25:11] other things to press the buttons. You [25:12] can listen to podcast, read newsletters, [25:14] read books, watch movies. You have [25:16] streaming media. you have literally [25:18] something like a half a trillion dollar [25:20] worth of capex expense and entertainment [25:22] available at your fingertips for like a [25:25] $30 a month. Like there's plenty of [25:26] other things you can do to not be bored [25:28] that doesn't put you on the slope of [25:30] terribleness. [25:31] All right, so that's the way I see these [25:34] things. Um, so why don't we do here like [25:36] we always do is move on to our takeaways [25:39] section. We have a little takeaway music [25:41] here. We do. [25:42] >> Let's hear this. [25:44] All [25:54] right, so let's get to my takeaways [25:56] here. When it comes to these curated [25:58] conversation platforms, [26:01] we've been telling ourselves a [26:02] reassuring story. Yeah, they're not [26:05] great, but most of the worst harms don't [26:07] impact me, and you know, there's some [26:09] nice benefits. What's the rush to [26:11] change? But in reality, these harms are [26:13] all connected to a common slope of [26:15] terribleness. You use them and you'll [26:18] start sliding down this slope. It'll [26:19] make your life worse as you move [26:21] further. You'll likely stop yourself [26:23] eventually before you get to the hellish [26:24] bottom. But this resistance requires [26:26] energy, mental energy you could be [26:28] spending on things that matter or people [26:30] you love. This trade-off is not worth [26:33] it. I want to end this deep dive by [26:35] reading from the conclusion of the essay [26:38] that I published on my newsletter a [26:39] couple weeks ago. Here's how I ended [26:41] that essay. To save civil society, we [26:44] need to end our decadel long experiment [26:46] with curated conversation platforms. We [26:48] tried them. They became dark and awful. [26:51] It's time to move on. Enough is enough. [26:55] Hey, if you like this video, I think [26:56] you'll really like this one as well. [26:59] Check it out.