# How to Be A Better Partner  ## Episode metadata - Episode title: How to Be A Better Partner - Show: Hidden Brain - Owner / Host: Hidden Brain, Shankar Vedantam - Guests: [Edward LeMay](https://share.snipd.com/person/f1469145-61d4-409c-aee2-ca015d0c1ea7), [Sonja Lyubomirsky](https://share.snipd.com/person/a77ebee7-8a6e-4d66-b39a-a71af25739bb) - Episode publish date: 2026-08-17 - Episode AI description: Edward LeMay, a psychologist who studies how we project thoughts onto partners, and Sonja Lyubomirsky, a happiness researcher who studies feeling loved, explore how our fears and desires shape relationship perception. They discuss projection, how acting lovingly can change feelings, the gap between being loved and feeling loved, and small acts that signal deep care. - Mentioned books: [Don Quixote](https://share.snipd.com/book/14e4ce8b-c798-4d8a-9e81-4c1fe03ef80a) by [Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra](https://share.snipd.com/person/5bbdb462-1d8c-4d6e-9713-eb23b66ef790), [How to Feel Loved](https://share.snipd.com/book/600ef700-44e8-464a-a241-a03960a9fdfb) by [Sonja Lyubomirsky](https://share.snipd.com/person/a77ebee7-8a6e-4d66-b39a-a71af25739bb), [Harry Reis](https://share.snipd.com/person/919657de-4f75-43c4-8146-3cb99e3387e6), [The Divine Comedy](https://share.snipd.com/book/355082ec-4637-4383-9507-d794557d8d30) by [Dante Alighieri](https://share.snipd.com/person/1e294e55-88fb-4efe-b247-50442138fcc2) - Duration: 01:26:25 - Episode URL: [Open in Snipd](https://share.snipd.com/episode/aa5376fa-347e-47ff-b8aa-cbf72575af67) - Show URL: [Open in Snipd](https://share.snipd.com/show/c94a26f6-1a03-4020-a574-bec10c59f432) - Export date: 2026-09-02T16:46:52 ## Snips ### [High School Crush That Exposed Projection](https://share.snipd.com/snip/0a8c4162-b7c7-47ae-b21d-2e5f5b7b3588) 🎧 10:47 - 11:59 (01:12) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/e3f41573-8e98-4fbd-9416-77d2a966bef4" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Edward LeMay recounts his high school crush who invited others to the mall and kissed in his car, revealing he had been misreading her signals. - That moment made him realize his belief she liked him came from his own mind, not her behavior. #### 💬 Quote > I remember just sitting there kind of stunned. And that was the moment that it hit me that what I had been seeing all along...really wasn't coming from her. It was coming from me. > — Edward LeMay Edward LeMay on a personal memory of projection #### 📚 Transcript **Shankar Vedantam:** When I was in high school, I had a major crush **Edward LeMay:** on a friend of mine, but she was in a relationship with somebody else. And for a long time, I told myself that she probably liked me too, given our closeness, and that if she weren't already with someone, perhaps something might happen between us. So eventually she and her boyfriend broke up and I remember thinking, okay, this might be my chance. So not long after she asked if I wanted to go to the mall and I picked her up thinking that maybe this might actually be like a date or something. But when I got there, I was surprised to see that she invited her sister and another friend along, a guy that I didn't know. And her sister sat in the front seat and she and the guy sat in the back. And as I was driving, the two of them in the back leaned over and started kissing in my back seat. Oh, dear. Oh, **Shankar Vedantam:** dear. I **Edward LeMay:** remember just sitting there kind of stunned. And that was the moment that it hit me that what I had been seeing all along, that she might be into me, really wasn't coming from her. --- ### [Projection Turns Your Feelings Into Perceived Facts](https://share.snipd.com/snip/fe026375-6e2a-4f3d-b8a1-409cabd578c1) 🎧 12:22 - 16:03 (03:40) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/65734c7a-3846-40e0-a17d-d0542e893536" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - People project their own thoughts and desires onto others, believing others share the same motivations. - Edward LeMay's studies of friendships showed romantically attracted people greatly exaggerated their friends' reciprocal interest, driven by projection. #### 💬 Quote > By projection, what we mean is this tendency for people to use themselves as a guide to understanding other people. > — Edward LeMay Edward LeMay defining projection #### 📚 Transcript **Shankar Vedantam:** Our minds do this too? Yes, **Edward LeMay:** that's correct. By projection, what we mean is this tendency for people to use themselves as a guide to understanding other people. To be a little bit more concrete, it's a tendency for people to think that other people have the same thoughts, feelings, motivations, characteristics that they have. And it's been documented many, many times that people have this projection bias. **Shankar Vedantam:** We don't see our projections as projections, so what we think we see becomes what we actually see. It becomes our reality. When we come back, a look at the lenses that shape how we see our friends and partners and how they burnish or disfigure what is really in front of our eyes. You're listening to Hidden Brain. I'm Shankar Vedantam. Pop quiz. What's in your kid's lunchbox? At Whole Foods Market, they've already done the studying. Over 300 food ingredients are banned from their shelves. No hydrogenated fats in the peanut butter and no high fructose corn syrup in the cookies. And for sandwiches, there are no synthetic nitrates or nitrites in any of their deli meat. So you can pack lunchboxes with peace of mind. Get back to school ready at Whole Foods Market. **Shankar Vedantam:** This is Hidden Brain. I'm Shankar Vedanta. When we look at our friends and romantic partners, we feel as if we're seeing them clearly, taking in who they are, what they want. Other people may be gripped by delusions, we tell ourselves, but we see things clearly. Psychologist Edward LeMay has found that these projections can both help and harm our relationships. Ed, you've studied the scenario described in 500 Days of Summer, where one person has romantic feelings for a friend and assumes the friend feels the same way. Describe the setup of your study and what you found. I've **Edward LeMay:** conducted a few studies on platonic friendships between men and women. And it's important to note that these are heterosexual men and women. And in one study, we just took a snapshot of what's happening in the relationship. But then in the other study, we actually followed people over time to look at how these friendships progress. One of the central findings across both studies was that when people had romantic desires for their friend, they projected this desire onto their friend. They believed that their friend reciprocated their romantic feelings. Now, importantly, we also had the friend in the study, so we could measure whether the friend actually reciprocated. And what we found was that when people had romantic attraction toward their friend, they greatly exaggerated the extent to which their friend reciprocated their romantic attraction. In other words, they projected their romantic attraction. **Shankar Vedantam:** Now, I'm wondering, did this projection have an effect on the relationship between these two people? So if I am overestimating how much someone is attracted to me, does that **Edward LeMay:** eventually change how they actually feel toward me? --- ### [Projections Can Create Their Own Reality](https://share.snipd.com/snip/4f89e8e6-fc25-4cd7-a3d6-acc0bbe3ee6c) 🎧 16:18 - 17:23 (01:04) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/8b61efc7-8375-4dc3-b704-c7f3dfc3c061" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Projections can become self-fulfilling because they change the projector's behavior toward the target. - In LeMay's longitudinal friendship study, those who projected attraction pursued friends and often elicited growing interest in return. #### 💬 Quote > So the friend ended up becoming more interested in them over time because we all like to receive attention. We all like to be valued. > — Edward LeMay Edward LeMay on projection causing relationship initiation #### 📚 Transcript **Edward LeMay:** So they engaged in a variety of behaviors that social scientists refer to as relationship initiation behaviors. These include things like directly expressing one's interest in the other person, but more bold things like moving in for a kiss, looking deep into a person's eyes, engaging in flirting, and then trying to enhance one's appearance, doing whatever one can to attract the other person. And people who engaged in these behaviors, there was sort of a self-fulfilling prophecy that unfolded. So the friend ended up becoming more interested in them over time because we all like to receive attention. We all like to be valued. And so people whose projection gave them the courage to initiate the romantic relationship ended up, in many cases, getting what they actually wanted, which is a friend who did indeed like them back. --- ### [Caring Creates Inflated Perceptions Of Reciprocity](https://share.snipd.com/snip/3bb3b47e-48e8-4541-8af3-6e791401ef65) 🎧 19:42 - 20:36 (00:53) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/a1388029-0c3e-42f6-8a09-4f30b8fd560d" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - People who deeply care for their spouse tend to overestimate how much their spouse cares back, and the reverse is true for low care. - LeMay measured both partners and found consistent exaggeration in perceived mutual care. #### 💬 Quote > Those who strongly cared for their spouse exaggerated the extent to which their spouse cared for them. > — Edward LeMay Edward LeMay on projection of care in marriages #### 📚 Transcript **Edward LeMay:** And so in some of our early studies, we looked at married couples and their projection of care onto their spouse. And what we found was that when one person cared deeply about their partner's welfare and they were motivated to provide support to their partner, they believed that their partner felt the same way toward them in return. And once again, like the friendship study, we actually had the partner participate in the study, too. So we had their reports of how motivated they were to provide support to the person doing the perceiving and how much they actually cared for them. And again, what we found was this exaggeration. So those who strongly cared for their spouse exaggerated the extent to which their spouse cared for them. And likewise, it works in the negative direction, too, though. --- ### [How One Person Brought Out A Colleague's Kind Side](https://share.snipd.com/snip/847aaceb-8cea-4fb2-951d-c3c67fe87494) 🎧 27:00 - 28:20 (01:19) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/1f9cea39-fb19-4cba-8067-d7f8ead838ec" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - A colleague nicknamed the 'Dan Whisperer' changed how he interacted with a grumpy senior by asking for help and bringing out Dan's supportive side. - That behavioral change altered the friend's experience and others didn't see it because they used different approaches. #### 💬 Quote > He went out of his way to help my friend prepare and to manage his nerves. And after that, my friend started approaching Dan differently. > — Edward LeMay Edward LeMay on using behavior to reshape perception #### 📚 Transcript **Edward LeMay:** Yeah, sure. So I have a friend who worked with a senior colleague named Dan. And Dan had a reputation for being grumpy and intimidating, but also brilliant. I think that was part of why he was intimidating to people. And most people in the office kept their distance from him. At one point, my friend had to give a very important presentation and needed to coordinate with him. My friend was so nervous that he ventured to mention his apprehension to Dan himself. And what surprised my friend was how kind and supportive Dan was when he mentioned his anxiety. He went out of his way to help my friend prepare and to manage his nerves. And after that, my friend started approaching Dan differently. Instead of avoiding him, he would ask Dan for help and involve him more because he knew that that would sort of bring out this more pleasant side of Dan. And over time, that completely changed how my friend experienced Dan. He no longer saw Dan as intimidating. He saw him as much more supportive and approachable. Other people in office didn't seem to have that same experience, maybe because they didn't know the sort of secret to unlocking this part of Dan. --- ### [Give Ambiguous Behavior The Benefit Of The Doubt](https://share.snipd.com/snip/57406e46-a8e0-4b80-8d52-94f0c8c2e3f7) 🎧 39:50 - 40:42 (00:52) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/e831364c-0e4c-467f-9f13-55e79a65c1cd" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Give your partner the benefit of the doubt in ambiguous moments but stay open to updating when patterns emerge. - LeMay recommends generous interpretations to promote trust while watching for consistent troubling behavior. #### 💬 Quote > We want to see them generously while still staying grounded in reality. Give your partner the benefit of the doubt when things are ambiguous. > — Edward LeMay Edward LeMay on balancing generosity and realism #### 📚 Transcript **Shankar Vedantam:** Well, **Edward LeMay:** I think that the key is that we don't want to see our partners unrealistically. We want to see them generously while still staying grounded in reality. And I think that one way people do this is by giving their partner the benefit of the doubt when things are ambiguous, assuming good intentions rather than the worst. But at the same time, it's important to stay open to new information. So if there is a consistent pattern of troubling behavior, you don't want to explain that away. In fact, that's why some people end up staying in relationships that are really not good for them. So it's really about a balance, holding on to a generally positive view of the partner while still updating that view when the evidence calls for updating. --- ### [Act Loving To Become More Loving](https://share.snipd.com/snip/8f49ea1e-4cea-4991-8db2-539a089a1544) 🎧 43:20 - 43:42 (00:21) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/28f88497-2b9e-45e4-84fb-8ba1fe5ad8fa" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Act loving even when you don't feel it to create behavioral evidence that can change expectations and feelings. - LeMay notes that behaving warmly gives you reasons to feel valued and can override negative expectations. #### 💬 Quote > When we act loving, we sort of create behavioral evidence for why we should be valued in our relationship. > — Edward LeMay Edward LeMay on behavior shaping feelings #### 📚 Transcript **Shankar Vedantam:** And that certainly is true to some extent. But I think what you're also saying is that if you start with the behaviors, if you start by acting loving, you in fact start to feel loving. **Edward LeMay:** Yes, that's correct. When we act loving, we sort of create behavioral evidence for why we should be valued in our relationship and why we have a good relationship. --- ### [Pause And Ask If The Feeling Is Yours](https://share.snipd.com/snip/dcba6e03-589a-4cac-af96-91e0c0e08630) 🎧 44:48 - 46:15 (01:26) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/040d1774-ef7c-430c-b709-addb141c244b" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Pause when you feel a strong negative reaction and ask whether it's about your own state rather than your partner's behavior. - LeMay describes catching himself when he felt irritated by his wife's tone and reframing it as his own stress. #### 💬 Quote > So instead of reacting, I just took a step back and considered that I might be bringing a particular lens to this interaction. > — Edward LeMay Edward LeMay on catching his own projection #### 📚 Transcript **Edward LeMay:** There was a moment recently where I felt like my wife was being a little short with me. It was something about her tone, sort of subtle. And I could feel myself starting to get irritated. And I was on the verge of snapping back. But then I paused and I realized that I've been stressed and on edge all day. And it occurred to me that I might be just reading that into her, seeing her as more agitated than she actually was. So instead of reacting, I just took a step back and considered that I might be bringing a particular lens to this interaction and helped me reframe this situation as one where she didn't actually seem as upset as I had initially assumed. And moments like that have made me more aware of how easily our internal state can shape what we think we're seeing in other people. So now when I feel that kind of strong reaction, I try to treat it as a signal to pause and ask, is this really about them? Or is this about something that I'm bringing to this interaction? One of the things that we find is that in many situations, our partner's behavior is actually a bit ambiguous. There's more than one way to interpret it. And in those moments, we have a choice about the lens that we use. --- ### [Most People Are Loved But Don't Feel Loved](https://share.snipd.com/snip/a173fa86-39d3-4711-bc6d-e502cdcdb520) 🎧 50:00 - 51:04 (01:03) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/fc469b46-9862-492a-8f80-79064dd6fd75" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - There's a gap between being loved and feeling loved; many people report relationships where they don't feel as loved as they'd like. - Sonja Lyubomirsky's survey found 70% have at least one relationship where they lack felt love. #### 💬 Quote > We found that 70% said that there's at least one relationship in their life that they don't feel as loved as they'd like to feel. > — Sonja Lyubomirsky Sonja Lyubomirsky on feeling loved vs being loved #### 📚 Transcript **Shankar Vedantam:** But knowing in an intellectual way that someone loves us, and feeling that love, those are very different things. At the University of California, Riverside, Sonia Lubomirsky studies the human desire to feel loved. With Harry Rees, she's the author of How to Feel Loved, the five mindsets that get you more of what matters most. Sonia was a guest on a recent episode of Hidden Brain titled, Do You Feel Loved? Today, she returns to the show for our popular segment, Your Questions Answered. Sonia Lubomirsky, thank you so much for joining me today on Hidden Brain. I'm **Sonja Lyubomirsky:** delighted to be back. Sonia, we all **Shankar Vedantam:** want to be loved. You say that it is vitally important not just to be loved, but to feel loved. Explain this distinction to me. **Sonja Lyubomirsky:** Yeah, I think a lot of us are loved, but we don't feel loved. My co-author, Harry Reese, and I actually conducted a survey expressly for our book, and we found that 70% said that there's at least one relationship in their life that they don't feel as loved as they'd like to feel. --- ### [Love Languages Matching Is Not The Main Point](https://share.snipd.com/snip/3fb0a55c-0d78-4b5d-b07d-e9b5ec4f2cbb) 🎧 01:02:53 - 01:03:41 (00:47) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/9d1e92d6-b394-4f60-b668-9ca5a626549b" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - The matching idea in 'love languages' lacks strong evidence; most people want words of affirmation and quality time. - Lyubomirsky says expressing love in many ways helps—matching one stated language matters less. #### 💬 Quote > It turns out there's really two love languages that we all want, and those are words of affirmation and quality time. > — Sonja Lyubomirsky Sonja Lyubomirsky critiquing love languages theory #### 📚 Transcript **Sonja Lyubomirsky:** Well, I should start by saying I love the idea of love languages. I talk about them all the time. What's not supported, first of all, the idea that there's just five, there's lots of love languages. It also turns out there's really two love languages that we all want, and those are words of affirmation and quality time. And so we kind of all want those love languages. Another finding is that really the more love languages someone shows love to you, the better. And so really the part that's really not supported by the evidence is that there's sort of this matching hypothesis, this idea that if you find someone who matches your love language, right, like my love language is physical touch, and that's what they express their love to me the most, then that's going to lead to a stronger and more long-lasting relationship. That's the part that's really not support. So the matching is not really that important. --- ### [Stop Investing When Reciprocation Never Comes](https://share.snipd.com/snip/f9e48576-04de-4a78-bf99-9ef8530b9363) 🎧 01:10:34 - 01:11:28 (00:54) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/802a1a3d-af18-4ebf-8817-b43ea4a0b231" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - If you've tried everything to make someone feel loved and they don't reciprocate, consider pausing or stepping away. - Sonja bluntly suggests accepting limits: pause the relationship or walk away when sustained reciprocation fails. #### 💬 Quote > When people say that to me, I'll say, you know, maybe you made the wrong decision. Maybe you need to step away from that person. > — Sonja Lyubomirsky Sonja Lyubomirsky advising on unreciprocated giving #### 📚 Transcript **Sonja Lyubomirsky:** This happens sometimes. feel like you're doing all the right things. Like in our book, we talk about the importance of sharing and listening and showing curiosity and being attuned to people with warmth and acceptance. And sometimes people, you're doing all those right things. You're showing kindness. You're listening. And the other person is not reciprocating. You know how therapists don't ever tell you kind of directly what they think, right? They want you to come up with the answer. I'm not a therapist, so I'll be blunt. When people say that to me, I'll say, you know, maybe you made the wrong decision. You know, maybe you need to step away from that person. Maybe you need to pause that relationship or just accept it, right? If it's a family member, you can't really walk away. So, yeah, if you're trying everything, you're doing all the right things, and they're still not reciprocating, you know, again, my blunt response is like, maybe it's not going to happen. But most of the time, people do reciprocate. --- Created with [Snipd](https://www.snipd.com) | Highlight & Take Notes from Podcasts